Crate motor or rebuild?
Thread Starter
Intermediate
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 29
Likes: 0
From: Utica, KY USA ky
Crate motor or rebuild?
I am not a mechanic, so some of this will be very basic to you guys who can do your own work or are more knowledgable. I have a 73 with standard motor and auto transmission. I was considering a Jasper engine rebuild using my core, but lately have been looking into GM crate engines and trying to learn about them. Could you explain any advantages or disadvantages to the two possibilities? What comes with a GM crate engine? I know or think that it is a "new" engine. What parts would I have to add to it to make it run?
Thanks
Thanks
Race Director
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 10,896
Likes: 2
From: CO
Re: Crate motor or rebuild? (aardvark)
Crate engines come in all different forms. Some just add a carb and some you have to add alot more.
Crate motors are great. You don't have to do any guess work on head/cam combos or matching intakes. They did it all from the factory to get a great performing engine. no guessing. All GM parts.
If you build it, or have it rebuilt by a good machine shop, you may get a better build quality and it may be less expensive, you could also get alot more power depending on what you want.
There is no answer as to which is better. It really depends on your attitude twords it. Crate motor is less hassle, less guess work. Rebuild could provide a less costly bill or more performance. Crate motor is a sure-thing peformance wise, its all spec.
I personally think the crate motor would be the less hassle route.
Also , this engine rocks http://www.sallee-chevrolet.com/Chev...eeZZ450HP.html
330HP 350 HO Deluxe, 350 HO with carburetor, distributor, water pump, torsional damper, and auto trans flexplate. SBC crate engine. 3,295.00 http://www.sallee-chevrolet.com/Chev...ckV8s/330.html
[Modified by flood, 6:46 PM 7/21/2003]
Crate motors are great. You don't have to do any guess work on head/cam combos or matching intakes. They did it all from the factory to get a great performing engine. no guessing. All GM parts.
If you build it, or have it rebuilt by a good machine shop, you may get a better build quality and it may be less expensive, you could also get alot more power depending on what you want.
There is no answer as to which is better. It really depends on your attitude twords it. Crate motor is less hassle, less guess work. Rebuild could provide a less costly bill or more performance. Crate motor is a sure-thing peformance wise, its all spec.
I personally think the crate motor would be the less hassle route.
Also , this engine rocks http://www.sallee-chevrolet.com/Chev...eeZZ450HP.html
330HP 350 HO Deluxe, 350 HO with carburetor, distributor, water pump, torsional damper, and auto trans flexplate. SBC crate engine. 3,295.00 http://www.sallee-chevrolet.com/Chev...ckV8s/330.html
[Modified by flood, 6:46 PM 7/21/2003]
Racer
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 288
Likes: 0
From: Roanoke VA
Re: Crate motor or rebuild? (vette_c5c6)
Crate any day, Just drop it in check the oil every few months and it will outlast the C3. :auto: :auto:
Thread Starter
Intermediate
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 29
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From: Utica, KY USA ky
Re: Crate motor or rebuild? (flood)
Would the 350 HO Deluxe be pretty much a direct exchange without any modifications. Also what would need to be done to the automatic transmission to handle the added horsepower?
Thanks
Thanks
Team Owner
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Re: Crate motor or rebuild? (aardvark)
Would the 350 HO Deluxe be pretty much a direct exchange without any modifications. Also what would need to be done to the automatic transmission to handle the added horsepower?
Thanks
Thanks
1. The come with a long water pump. The C3 uses a special "short" water pump with a 3/4" shaft.
2. Flywheel. Most crate engines use the newer crankshaft that has a smaller mounting bolt pattern for the flywheel, so the flywheel from the old motor will not bolt on. And usually the new motor comes with a smaller flywheel. You will most likely have to change to the 168 tooth flywheel for the new motors. The place you buy the engine from should be able to take care of exchanging both for you.
I did the ZZ4 swap on my 1980, and I documented all the little issues in a mult-step web page. Read through My ZZ4 swap project (click the link) and that should cover 90% of the issues that will come up.
Racer
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 488
Likes: 0
From: Woodstock GA
Re: Crate motor or rebuild? (aardvark)
I bought an ATK reubilt crate http://www.rebuiltcarengines.com at a very reasonable price.
It's a drop in replacement, oil pan and chrome valve covers- everything except your intake and carb. 3 year unlimited mile warranty, parts and labor.
I bought the low-end "high performance" model with a 9.1-1 comp ratio. About the same HP as an L82, I believe.
If I were to do it again, I'd put a lopey cam on it when the engine was swapped, or buy the next higher up model of the engine.
It's a drop in replacement, oil pan and chrome valve covers- everything except your intake and carb. 3 year unlimited mile warranty, parts and labor.
I bought the low-end "high performance" model with a 9.1-1 comp ratio. About the same HP as an L82, I believe.
If I were to do it again, I'd put a lopey cam on it when the engine was swapped, or buy the next higher up model of the engine.
Race Director
Joined: Aug 2000
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From: HONOLULU HAWAII
Re: Crate motor or rebuild? (aardvark)
Would the 350 HO Deluxe be pretty much a direct exchange without any modifications. Also what would need to be done to the automatic transmission to handle the added horsepower?
Thanks
Thanks
Oh BTW......if you put the 350 HO you won't have to do nothing to the trans to handle the added HP......But if you buy a 383 Stroker Crate....you better make arrangements to have your trans upgraded... :flag :seeya Cappy
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Drifting
Joined: Jun 2000
Posts: 1,476
Likes: 1
From: Mt Juliet TN
Re: Crate motor or rebuild? (aardvark)
I went the Jasper rebuild route and I'm quite happy with the motor. They picked up my original block and made sure to keep the casting numbers. The motor has lots of torque and a 3 year warranty (I think most GM crates are 90 days). And you can just bolt on your old accessories. You can always buy a crate motor and keep your original in storage but if you don't have the room Jasper does a pretty good job.
Burning Brakes
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 1,162
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From: Beaverton, OR
Re: Crate motor or rebuild? (8T1-7T9 BIONIC VETTE)
Oh BTW......if you put the 350 HO you won't have to do nothing to the trans to handle the added HP......But if you buy a 383 Stroker Crate....you better make arrangements to have your trans upgraded... :flag :seeya Cappy
Please correct me if I'm wrong, I'll be pulling my transmission in a day or two and I'd like to know if I should be doing anything except replacing the seals, filter, checking the front pump health, and cleaning it...
Burning Brakes
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 1,162
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From: Beaverton, OR
Re: Crate motor or rebuild? (aardvark)
Oh yeah, with my running transmission commentary, I almost forgot to mention the route I went for a "crate" engine... I bought an engine from AR Racing ( http://www.maxhorsepower.com/ ) that was one of his fairly "standard" crate engine builds and had him do some additional work on it to prep it for nitrous. I felt like I got the best of both worlds with this route as I got what seems to be a very reasonable deal on exactly what I wanted. AR can give you a turnkey solution, or sell you just the long block, or somewhere in between, which is what I did. That way you just pay for what you need. If you're interested, you'll want to talk to Mark Lim @ (540) 439-1961. I cannot yet comment on my engine as it's still bolted to the crate, but soon I hope to. Several others on the forum have went this route and are up and running...
Team Owner
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Re: Crate motor or rebuild? (dath)
I had my engine custom build; no regrets! Plus - got a 36/36 warranty. :)
Thread Starter
Intermediate
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 29
Likes: 0
From: Utica, KY USA ky
Re: Crate motor or rebuild? (8T1-7T9 BIONIC VETTE)
I ordered the 350 HO Deluxe today. It's supposed to fit the auto transmission without a new flywheel according to the people I talked to. I will need a short water pump(what do you recommend?) Also I will need headers or exhaust mainifolds. What will fit my 73 and any recommendations on brands and models will be appreciated. Thank you guys for all your information. I feel like it helped me make a well informed decision as to what would be best for me.
Race Director
Joined: Aug 2000
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From: HONOLULU HAWAII
Re: Crate motor or rebuild? (dath)
Oh BTW......if you put the 350 HO you won't have to do nothing to the trans to handle the added HP......But if you buy a 383 Stroker Crate....you better make arrangements to have your trans upgraded... :flag :seeya Cappy
I think I disagree with what you said about having to make transmission mods... This is highly dependent upon which transmission he already has. I may be a dumbazz, but I'm dropping in an engine which is around 465HP (very similar torque as well) and maybe as much as 600HP with nitrous. I'm doing nothing at all to my TH400 save replacing my old torque converter and adding a driveshaft safety loop. From my understanding, I'm way more likely to blow out my rearend or twist a half shaft than bring harm to my TH400...
Please correct me if I'm wrong, I'll be pulling my transmission in a day or two and I'd like to know if I should be doing anything except replacing the seals, filter, checking the front pump health, and cleaning it...
I think I disagree with what you said about having to make transmission mods... This is highly dependent upon which transmission he already has. I may be a dumbazz, but I'm dropping in an engine which is around 465HP (very similar torque as well) and maybe as much as 600HP with nitrous. I'm doing nothing at all to my TH400 save replacing my old torque converter and adding a driveshaft safety loop. From my understanding, I'm way more likely to blow out my rearend or twist a half shaft than bring harm to my TH400...
Please correct me if I'm wrong, I'll be pulling my transmission in a day or two and I'd like to know if I should be doing anything except replacing the seals, filter, checking the front pump health, and cleaning it...
I retract my statement......Leave your trans the way it is when you upgrade your motor to a 383 Stroker with nitrous 600 HP.....I'll still :seeya at you out there on the road. :flag :seeya Cappy
Advanced
Joined: Jun 2003
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From: Santo Domingo DR
Re: Crate motor or rebuild? (aardvark)
GM crate engines are as everybody says, are the best and most reliable deals you can get for that amount of money. Everything is new and matching properly. Serveral of my friends have installed them on their cars. (forst and second gen. camaros, c3 corvettes, etc) perfect fit and lot's of fun after installed. It's like christmas they say, opening the crate and installing the new toy on the car. If you can, go on the zz4, that engine will make your vette fly just out of the crate!
Dan
Dan :thumbs:
Dan
Dan :thumbs:
Advanced
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 74
Likes: 0
From: Santo Domingo DR
Re: Crate motor or rebuild? (aardvark)
GM crate engines are as everybody says, are the best and most reliable deals you can get for that amount of money. Everything is new and matching properly. Serveral of my friends have installed them on their cars. (forst and second gen. camaros, c3 corvettes, etc) perfect fit and lot's of fun after installed. It's like christmas they say, opening the crate and installing the new toy on the car. If you can, go on the zz4, that engine will make your vette fly just out of the crate!
Dan :thumbs:
Dan :thumbs:
Burning Brakes
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 1,162
Likes: 2
From: Beaverton, OR
Re: Crate motor or rebuild? (8T1-7T9 BIONIC VETTE)
All righty then......
I retract my statement......Leave your trans the way it is when you upgrade your motor to a 383 Stroker with nitrous 600 HP.....I'll still :seeya at you out there on the road. :flag :seeya Cappy
I retract my statement......Leave your trans the way it is when you upgrade your motor to a 383 Stroker with nitrous 600 HP.....I'll still :seeya at you out there on the road. :flag :seeya Cappy
Burning Brakes
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 1,162
Likes: 2
From: Beaverton, OR
Re: Crate motor or rebuild? (aardvark)
I ordered the 350 HO Deluxe today. It's supposed to fit the auto transmission without a new flywheel according to the people I talked to. I will need a short water pump(what do you recommend?) Also I will need headers or exhaust mainifolds. What will fit my 73 and any recommendations on brands and models will be appreciated. Thank you guys for all your information. I feel like it helped me make a well informed decision as to what would be best for me.
Drifting
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 1,809
Likes: 0
Re: Crate motor or rebuild? (dath)
All righty then......
I retract my statement......Leave your trans the way it is when you upgrade your motor to a 383 Stroker with nitrous 600 HP.....I'll still :seeya at you out there on the road. :flag :seeya Cappy
:cheers: Hope I don't break anything, maybe I'm just silly, I really don't know, but I asked the question a month back or so and nobody told me to do anything to my transmission... If I break it, maybe my wife will let me go for the ROD 6-speed :D
I retract my statement......Leave your trans the way it is when you upgrade your motor to a 383 Stroker with nitrous 600 HP.....I'll still :seeya at you out there on the road. :flag :seeya Cappy
:cheers: Hope I don't break anything, maybe I'm just silly, I really don't know, but I asked the question a month back or so and nobody told me to do anything to my transmission... If I break it, maybe my wife will let me go for the ROD 6-speed :D
