454 vs 496..
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Feb 2002
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From: Sodertalje/Sweden
454 vs 496..
What the Pros and Cons with building a 496..I have started to look for the different parts going in to my engine and stumbled over this idea.. :cheers: :thumbs:
Team Owner
Joined: Apr 1999
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From: Reno Nevada
2024 C3 of the Year Finalist- Modified
Re: 454 vs 496.. (BB wowbagger)
I have only owned one stroker Big Block. It was a bored out 496 which made it a 510 ci. The power change with all the same parts between a 454 and 496 is an addition 50 foot lbs of torque.
Team Owner
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From: Republic of Texas
Re: 454 vs 496.. (Brettmc)
Isn't that a .060 over 454 block and a 4.25" crank? I don't think are any cons, just pros!!!!
Brett :thumbs:
Brett :thumbs:
:cheers:
Race Director
Joined: Nov 2000
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From: Waterloo ontario Canada
Re: 454 vs 496.. (BB wowbagger)
The 496 doesn't need special longer rods. The stroke while 1/4 inch longer is actually only 1/8th further down and 1/8th high up to equal the 1/4 inch stroker., Lingenfelter actually sometimes used stock 454 pistons and decked the top by .100 to keep from hitting the head and at the same time giving 0 deck height.
The oil pan and bottom end will clear fine. It is a worthwhile displacement increase to really wake the 454 up. You can use .030 fine and you just give up a few cubic inches but save the block for furture cleanup.
So if you are buying a crank and pistons anyway go for it. Nothing else needs to be changed.
The oil pan and bottom end will clear fine. It is a worthwhile displacement increase to really wake the 454 up. You can use .030 fine and you just give up a few cubic inches but save the block for furture cleanup.
So if you are buying a crank and pistons anyway go for it. Nothing else needs to be changed.
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Team Owner
Joined: Feb 1999
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From: Republic of Texas
Re: 454 vs 496.. (norvalwilhelm)
The 496 doesn't need special longer rods.
Noval I thought by using the stock rods would throw the piston to rod ratio off and results in a 1.44?? Most 496 kits use 6.385 rods and this would give you a ratio of 1.55. I would be a little concerned turning a 496 up with all that stress on those rods.
:yesnod:
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Joined: Jul 2002
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From: fargo nd
Re: 454 vs 496.. (BB wowbagger)
I would look at SRP pistons to go into this combo. They can use stock or plus length rods, and there are different oversizes available 30, 60, 70, 100. http://flatlanderracing.com/ or here http://speedomotive.com/. Might want to look here, they have a bunch of different combinations available that should work
Race Director
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From: Waterloo ontario Canada
Re: 454 vs 496.. (Corey 68)
I have a good article on Lengenfelters 496, 623 horse build up. He uses a standard 2 bolt main block, stock 3/8th bolt rods and stock seal power pistons with the dome cut .010 and a .100 cut on the dome to clear the head. I would just buy the proper pistons with the clearance already done. The crank bolts right in without modifications but turn the crank over slowly when assembled to make sure all the rods clear the oil pan skirt. They sometimes tick in a few places and just a light cleanup with a grinder in these spots is all that is needed.
For his combination he recommends the 288R comp cam with .244 duration.
This motor idled like a stocker and still put out 623 horse and was built as an economy motor.
So with just a stroker crank and matching pistons that is all you need.
Remember a 1/4 inch stroker is really only 1/8th inch longer . The rod only moves 1/8th inch further down the hole and 1/8th further up into the head, not 1/4 inch so it is very small difference from stock.
For his combination he recommends the 288R comp cam with .244 duration.
This motor idled like a stocker and still put out 623 horse and was built as an economy motor.
So with just a stroker crank and matching pistons that is all you need.
Remember a 1/4 inch stroker is really only 1/8th inch longer . The rod only moves 1/8th inch further down the hole and 1/8th further up into the head, not 1/4 inch so it is very small difference from stock.
Safety Car
Joined: Dec 1999
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From: Roxbury NJ
Re: 454 vs 496.. (norvalwilhelm)
Scat is even selling affordable cranks now that are built specifically for the 4.25" stroke, stock 6.135" rod combo. The counterweights are clearanced so that the pistons fit with the short stock rod. If this car is basically a weekend toy, I wouldn't be worried about the stroke/rod ratio at all.
Like the others said, I would go with something like an SRP piston that's built just for that combo. Modified 454 pistons would work just fine too if you've got the skills (Norval obviously does!), but if you can't machine them yourself the cost may be higher in the end.
Like the others said, I would go with something like an SRP piston that's built just for that combo. Modified 454 pistons would work just fine too if you've got the skills (Norval obviously does!), but if you can't machine them yourself the cost may be higher in the end.
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Feb 2002
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From: Sodertalje/Sweden
Re: 454 vs 496.. (norvalwilhelm)
Norval,that combo sounds like something i would build.I`ve got the cam and 2 bolt block allready :thumbs:
The big question is how far you would dare to push the 3/8 rod in Rpm,before it decides to exit the engine by a hole in the block.I`ve 3/8 rods with ARP bolts in them.
I think i`ll buy a complete kit with pistons and all,just to be on the safe side of things,because i think its the wrong place to start cutting corners.
Which company sells the "Most bang for buck" stroker kits? :smash: :cheers:
The big question is how far you would dare to push the 3/8 rod in Rpm,before it decides to exit the engine by a hole in the block.I`ve 3/8 rods with ARP bolts in them.
I think i`ll buy a complete kit with pistons and all,just to be on the safe side of things,because i think its the wrong place to start cutting corners.
Which company sells the "Most bang for buck" stroker kits? :smash: :cheers:
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From: Waterloo ontario Canada
Re: 454 vs 496.. (BB wowbagger)
The Lengenfelter motor was taken to 6500 with the 3/8th rods and this is a torque monster. I think close to 500FT LBS by 2000 rpm. No need to rev the thing that high. Stick to around 6000 and it will live fine.
As for deals I don't have a clue but Flareside said Scat.
I have heard that it makes a big difference over the 454 and you can stick to .030 overbore and give up just a few cubic inches.
[Modified by norvalwilhelm, 9:53 AM 8/6/2003]
As for deals I don't have a clue but Flareside said Scat.
I have heard that it makes a big difference over the 454 and you can stick to .030 overbore and give up just a few cubic inches.
[Modified by norvalwilhelm, 9:53 AM 8/6/2003]
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 2,298
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From: Sodertalje/Sweden
Re: 454 vs 496.. (norvalwilhelm)
What kind of crank did he use? Cast or Forged.I belive your kinda pushing your luck going over 6Krpm with a cast crank. :confused: :cheers:
Safety Car
Joined: Dec 1999
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From: Roxbury NJ
Re: 454 vs 496.. (BB wowbagger)
I got my assembly from the place J. Swisher mentioned above, Flatlander. Great service and prices. I paid around $1600 for a Scat 4340 forged crank, Scat H-beam rods, SRP forged pistons, rings, pins, clips, Clevite H bearings.
You can also build this combo with an aftermarket cast crank and hypereutectic pistons for around $1000. Call Flatlander and talk to Phil (the owner), he'll give you good advice for your usage.
You can also build this combo with an aftermarket cast crank and hypereutectic pistons for around $1000. Call Flatlander and talk to Phil (the owner), he'll give you good advice for your usage.
