I suppose I will get a new set of heads for my SBC sometime in the future, but there are so many choices. It gets pretty confusing.
Stuff like CC size. I think my stock ones are 76. Is 64 better?
I have a CC268H cam. Does this play a part in my decision?
How about manifold? I'm running a performer.

You see where I'm going with this? I want a set of bolt on heads that arent going to force me to swap out other parts.
I want a good boost in performance without taking out a second mortgage. As you no doubt know by now, I dont know much about this topic. Help and advice is appreciated.

Comments?
Stew


[Modified by Stewart's74, 4:13 PM 8/19/2003]

 

At chevy hi performance's website they have a complete head comparo in the tech section.

Brett :thumbs:

 

Too bad you have the Edel intake already because the best bang for the buck for under 400 hp is the Vortec heads but you need the vortec intake.

 

Stew, I have the Vortecs. I like them. Dollar for dollar, I don't think they can be beat. For $700 I got the whole set up from Scoggin Dickey. That's the manifold, the heads (assembled!) and the fasteners. I think I even got a sticker or two.

The head cc is going to effect your compression rate. I went over 10:1 with flat top pistons and 64cc iron heads. Not good for pump gas. We ended up having to use thicker head gaskets. I'm now at about 9.8:1, and I can run 90. But to be safe, I stick with 91 or better.

By the way, I'm also running the 268H cam. My biggest gripe is no longer with the engine, but with my gears. The 3.08 and TH350 really hold it back. But once the car hits 3000 RPM, it's like a switch goes off. The car feels real nice.

Another place to check, is Powerhouse. I thought the prices were too good to be true. I figured their stuff would have to be crap. But my engine builder highly recommends them. He's used their stuff for years, and has had no problems. They sell heads for good prices. Check them out.

But I'm with you, I couldn't stomach $1000+ for aluminum heads. That's what made the Vortecs look so good, not to mention the testimonials I read in Hot Rod and High Performance Chevy.

:cheers:


[Modified by joeveto, 4:11 PM 8/19/2003]

 

what is the link for Powerhouse :confused:

 

I have a similar set up as you, except for a 4 speed (see my signature). I have a set of TF 23* with 64cc chambers. This should give me about a 9.5 cr. DD shows me @ 370 HP and 409 ft.# torque.

Initally, I was running a Performer intake but found the ports did not match worth a crap and I was getting oil leaking into the cylinders. Performer RPM matched very well, no leaks.

I am quite satisfied with my set up. Only future mods would be flat top pistons to get the cr over 10.

 

Really like my World Products SR Torquers with 67cc chambers and large 2.02/1.6 valves. Bought’m pocket ported with valves unshrouded for $850 from Performance Chevy Products out of Phoenix (602-254-9586). Shipping was free and so was painting (black). Came with stock valve seals though – demand umbrella seals. It would be hard to find a combination these heads couldn’t work with. smog legal too. :thumbs:

 

I've got AFR 195 heads, and they absolutely rock! The AFRs have the best flow with the smallest runner size according to the CHP tests, meaning they have the highest velocity and therefore best throttle responses. They were $1250 from Herbert Performance fully assembled. I spent quite a bit more on the project, though, because I added hardened pushrods, RPM intake, and Comp Pro Magnum 1.6 roller rockers. I am running the Comp 268H with Hooker Super Comp headers and a Super T10 4-speed.
I think the chamber CCs are 68, so I ended up around 10.4:1 or so, with no detonation on 93 octane.
I could tell a difference as soon as I started it up, it has alot more bass in the exhaust tone at idle. Pulls great throughout the RPM range, bounces off the rev limiter (6000 RPM) and feels like it would pull right on through if I raised the limit.
According to the GTech Pro I ran a 13.2 1/4 mile and 4.3 second 0-60. This is with no tuning at all to the Speed Demon 650 mechanical secondary carb. That will be this fall when it cools down a little.
Later
Jeff

 

Jeff,
Are you running stock pistons? Also, did you get any info on 180cc vs 195cc? I thought the 180's would have a higher velocity (= more torque) or is it that the 195's flow just fine with a mild cam? As they're a lot of $$'s I want to make sure that I'm saving for the right ones :D
:cheers:

 

Which intake manifold is best for the vortec heads?
Those vortecs are hard to beat at $235 each.. <for someone looking for less than 400hp>
gmpartsdirect.com pn 12558060


[Modified by OldSchool, 11:48 AM 8/20/2003]

 

No, I'm running a hypereutectic piston that made about 9.4:1 CR with the stock 882 heads.

I looked at the flow numbers for the 180, 190, and 195. I was looking at the 190 heads based on my setup, then called AFR, actually called them several times over the course of a few months making my mind up. They recommended the 190 heads for my setup with Performer intake or 195 heads if I was going to run an RPM intake. Since I was buying the RPM Air Gap to install at the same time as the heads I went with the 195s. Great low end, absolutely no loss in power ot throttle response anywhere in the RPM range, and I may have even picked up a little at the bottom. Definitely gained alot in the upper RPMs.
I think the 180s would be better for a smaller displacement engine, 305, 327, etc. but you can call AFR with your specs and see what they think. Also, I like to rev my engine pretty often, and I am considering a bigger cam or stroker motor in the future and I thought the 195s would be best for those changes.
Jeff

 

Don't worry, you've got plenty of time to save. I just found out today the AFR had some sort of problem :confused: with their foundry and it will be 6 weeks until I get my heads :mad . Hate to admit it, but it's worth the wait. IMHO - Best heads on the market.

 

I love my 041 heads that cam on 69 350/350 vettes they are 64cc chambers and large 2.02/1.6 valves. Bought thenm ported with stainless valves. Probably the single best mod I did to the car REALLY WOKE IT up and the heads were a BARGAIN at 450 bucks Complete. Bought them from a cylinder head shop locally

 

I'd like to move to AFR 195's too, but have not been able to determine if they will work with my Hooker Sidemounts. I know Brutus will be trying to install AFR 190's in the future with his hookers. Does anyone know of anyone using AFR 195 with Hooker sidemount headers?
:confused:

 

Great info here guys. I am considering new heads for my 78 :cheers:

 

I bought some Holley 2.02/1.60 aluminum heads used off ebay for $500. I plan to use them as is for a season or two since my engine has 70k on it and then rebuild them with the engine. I wanted the weight savings and comp ratio freedom...

 

I have a question for the experts out there. When comparing a 180cc head to a 195cc head, the flow numbers are really different at higher lift. There's not "as much" difference below .5 in. So if you're running a street cam, you'll never be able to take advantage of the high lift flow numbers, right?

So isn't it balance between getting your max flow for your cam lift without going too big to maintain driveability / low rpm throttle response?

Edelbrock performer heads are like 170cc and they can make some nice power. Vortecs are pretty small too I think. I'd like to hear from somebody that went from a 170cc to a 195cc, hopefully somebody will chime in...

It seems picking the correct head is black magic. Hopefully we'll hear opinions from some experts...

 

the AFRs seem to be the best these days, but the vortecs are very economical. the edelbrock heads are decent too.

 

Jeff,
Thanks for the reply. Jack71 nailed what I'm thinking: I've got a lift of .454" so figure that, given the choice of several heads that flow about the same at that lift, then the ones with the smallest ports will give the best low end grunt (due to a higher charge velocity), with no restrictions at the red line? The flow rates above my max lift would just be academic but, as you say, if I later put in a cam with a profile like the Eiger, then I've got to allow for that when choosing the heads. Maybe the 190's are the ones I should go for.
Doing what Alwyn ( :seeya ) did would be the best way forward for me, but good used heads are rare here & any that come up for sale are snapped up. I've decided against Edelbrocks or Trick Flows as they wouldn't cost me much less than AFR's.

The big question really is: With my cam, etc, how much extra power would AFR190's give me compared to Vortecs? Would the cost difference justify it for normal road use & the odd 1/4 mile drag???? Anybody got any ideas? :)
:cheers:

 

Stew- I knew my 1+ year of head research would finally benefit some else. I shopped long and hard to upgrade from the stock heads on my 81 (76cc, cast iron, low comp, smog -blahblah). Dittos on the Chevy Hi-Perf website, they've benchflow tested almost every head on the market. I too was a phone call away from buying the Vortecs but was concerned the drastically increased comp the 64cc Vortecs would create would unnecessarily hasten the future rebuild of my 135K mile orig motor. I read almost every iron head engine build article I could find and the underlying thread from most of them was 10/11:1 comp to make 400hp and had to run 93+ oct gas. One point you defiinitely want to consider is fuel cost = more $ for upgrades :steering:
You can achieve the same hp levels at 9/10:1 comp with alum heads on 87 pump gas and recoup the $ difference in 2-3 years; sooner depending on how much you drive it.
As for your HP question, the AFR 180's on a stock 350, 9:1 comp, 1 5/8" headers, RPM intake, 600 cfm Holley carb, and 110E Hyd cam (Intake: .460 lift/218 @ .050; Exh: .470 lift/223 @ .050; 110 lobe center; 800 RPM idle; 16 lbs vacuum) produce 420HP@5000, 435 ft.lbs TQ@3500 (PER AFR WEBSITE)

It really boils down to pay now (more $ for alum) or pay later (more $ at every fill up)
IMHO if you can run those #'s on salad-oil pump gas, spend the extra $ you're saving at the pump for more goodies :thumbs:

I waiting to slip your same cam under those AFR 180's when it's time for that rebuild :cheers: