Ok, I've done some research, and now I'm ready to put a specific question to ya'll...

I've got a stock 1978 vette that I've the itch to mess with...
First I'll be changing the tranny to a 200-4R (why do some sites list it as 200-R4?...are they different?)
Next I want to address the engine...
Everything works fine (for today at least...), but I really want to add some sort of EFI to improve my mpg--I'd like to make her my daily driver...
Now, if the best thing to do is buy a new engine with EFI, so be it (I REALLY wouldn't mind a little extra power)...and I WILL inevitably buy a new engine (for more power) so the EFI I buy should be compatible with a ZZ4 or similar...
Any ideas?
so far I've looked at
ZZ4 with Edelbrock ProFlow (if you know of better combo's let me know!), from http://www.goautocenter.com/fuel_injection_engines.htm
Ramjet 350 (doesn't seem as well made as the ZZ4?)
Holley, separate system
I'll be having the install done by a mechanic, so difficulty of install is secondarily important (ie $$...which is why I was going with the easy to drop in ZZ4)
What do you think is my best bet for $$ to performance to durability ratio??
Any options I haven't considered are welcome of course...
TIA


[Modified by 6318, 1:10 AM 12/21/2003]


[Modified by 6318, 1:12 AM 12/21/2003]

 

There's lots of different routes you could take. I kinda like the TPI conversion idea. Stock bolt on GM.
But I've been looking at this one (since it's cheap): http://www.customefis.com/
Or if you're adventurous there's the Megasquirt that uses a GM throttle body: http://www.bgsoflex.com/megasquirt.html
but that one takes alot of tweaking.

 

you talkin bout the TBI?
Yeah, it's a lot cheaper and easier to install (I hear), but is the first generation of EFI...some consider it a mix between carb and true EFI...

Any ideas out there on mpg differences from carb-->TBI-->MPFI?

 

Yes, the cheap one I want is a cross between a carb and FI. It injects at the same point as a carb would. The TPI system is true FI and injects into the manifold.
Isn't EFI a Ford term?

Larry

 

I always understood EFI = Electronic Fuel Injection, a very generic term. When the "new" Chevy trucks came out in 1998, they had "EFI" on the lower right corner of the tailgate.

 

So how much easier is it to install a prepackaged engine/MPFI like the ZZ4/Edelbrock than a separate MPFI on my existing engine?
Just as bad?
Alot easier?

 

Stay with stock parts and any GM dealer can work on it and replacement parts are easier to come by. I would go TPI over TBI. You might save a little with TBI, but the performance differences make TPI worth the extra.

 

I have the Holley Commander 950 EFI on my 350 and it is great. It was straightforward to install and shouldn't be any more difficult than any other type of system. As for parts availability, they use factory type components for most everything anyway. All the sensors and connectors are standard items. The nice thing about the aftermarket systems is that they are easily changed and tuned for a wide range of cams. The stock TPI computer needs custom chips to accommodate different and radical cams.

 

:withstupid: Very well put. I would add that you will probably need to run a new return fuel line and have the gas tank modified. Both of which sound worse then they really are.

 

I like my TPI but if you are planning on getting a new motor, I'd recommend just getting the Ramjet 350. Somebody has already done the tuning for you and it makes plenty of power. You literally drop it in and go. But whatever route you go, there are tons of knowledgable people here to help you out if you have trouble.
:thumbs:

 

:iagree:
I have the Holley 950 system also, but I am doing Throttle Body Injection. The Holley computer is the key to the package though. It is COMPLETELY customizable with a laptop. The Edelbrock system is not. You have to have them burn a new prom every time you want to make a change.

With the Holley if you want to change your timing, do it on the fly. Change rev. limiters - easy. Change what temp your electric radiator fan kicks on and off, done. Change cams and need more fuel - all ready to go.

If it were me, and I was just doing a daily driver and not concerned with having the most HP, then I would do the 350 RamJet. That will not fit under the stock hood though. But, with that you just drop in the motor, plumb the fuel system and it's done. With any other fuel injection you are going to have to mount a computer, run a harness, and a lot of extra work when compared to the RamJet motor.

If you the most power you can get, and don't have to worry about having the EGR and AIR pump for emissions, do the ZZ385 or ZZ4. With either one, look at upgrading to the HOT cam and 1.6 rockers before install. If you don't have the money, then go with the ZZ4.
After you get the motor, then go to the Holley Commander 950 Multi port injection system. It costs a bit more than the Edelbrock, but being able to customize it is worth the extra bucks.

 

I am going to get the Holley Stealth ram system if/when Summit does there 10% off sale again. I know it dos not fit under a C4 hood but I have heard it does under a C3, if not I'll swap it with the LT1 in my formula. :yesnod:

 

tanks for all the input guys...
I really think the RamJet 350 would be best for me...but as with any big purchase, I've gotta shake the Gremlins of doubt off my back...
1) I hate to replace the hood...hood and paintjob alone are worth >1 grand...
2) ZZ4's are built with noticably better components
3) It's a daily driver!...but the man urge keeps whispering 'you need more power!'...no matter if I'm taking my medicine or not...

So, now that I think about it...is the RamJet really cheaper than the ZZ4 and independant?...if I gotta replace and paint a hood?

What ZZ4 and TPI combo do we KNOW fits underneath a '78 hood?...If I add the Fastburn, does it change what TPI will fit under the hood? Do I have to replace the radiator with a ZZ4 (I just replaced it last mo...)

Sorry for all the questions...been searching our forums for the last 5 hours or so and none of the above seem to have been answered very well...

 

Well, if you want the easiest drop in solution, it would be the RamJet. If you have some understanding of EFI, or really want to learn, then the more bang for the buck would be a ZZ4 with a Holley Stealth Ram / Commander 950 system. That by far is going to bring the most power, most adjustability, most complete package. It will also be the hardest install, and will take time to tune it.

I think the stock radiator will work with the ZZ4, that's what I am using. You may want to upgrade to a low priced aluminum or at least a good dual electric fan for the stock radiator. Make sure you go with a good water pump in any situation. The water pumps that come with either motor will not work in the C3.

So, bottom line is this.
Lower power, easier install, no changes after the install: Ram Jet.
More power, more difficult install, but will be able to tailor make your performance now and forever - ZZ4 with a Stealth Ram / Holley 950.

I don't know for 100% that the stealth ram will fit, I have just heard that it will. Also, if you go to the fastburn (vortec) heads, the stealth ram is out, and then you would have to go to Holleys standard MPI system and run a regular air cleaner over a throttle body with the injectors in the runners on a vortec intake manifold.

The only reason I did not go with the stealth ram on my ZZ4 is that it will not pass my visual emissions inspection since there is no provision for EGR, and I can't change any emissions device.


[Modified by BSeery, 10:18 PM 12/23/2003]