I remember that car from Westhampton Drag Strip on Long Island and National Speedway and seeing it at Motion on Sunrise Highway in either 1969 0r 1970 if memory serves me correct it ran as a NHRA B/MP I dont remember the AHRA class, with times in the high 11's which was quite respectable times back then but not for that class. Anyhow thats what I remember but that was a long time ago. I was under the impression that Dennis Ferrara bought the car and took it to Florida with him anyhow $1500 seems like an over kill amount for the research with no guarantee but back then I dont remember New York as being a title state just registration. LOL with getting anything from Joel Rosen from my dealings with him at Motion in the late 60's if you asked him what time it was he would try to charge you for the answer. Motion got a lot of ink in the magazines I think Marty Shore was his uncle or something anyhow thats what the word was on the streets back then.

[Modified by tom102, 4:08 PM 6/26/2004]


[Modified by tom102, 4:09 PM 6/26/2004]

 

I think ebay has proved this to be a false thought. How many modified vettes have people posted about that have been on ebay. Of those, how many are decent looking?? Most of them make us sick to our stomach from the meer sight of them. And as for the 2 schools of thought between the NCRS and yenko/motion vettes.... The modified such as motion were modified back when they were new and had very limited numbers. It is like the current linginfelter, hennessey and other tuners. They are produced by a special company, documented and modified to the max. 35 years later, these cars are not able to be restored to NCRS status, and are much more unique. Most normal old cars can be restored to NCRS with some money. Cars that have already been heavily modified such as motion can not, because of this, they are much more unique and usually have an interesting history.


[Modified by lostpatrolman, 4:24 PM 6/26/2004]

 

If you mean pic's either of my cars I don't want to make you sick to your stomach. It makes me that way. I hate that I used a polaroid to take the best of the shots that I did of my cars. Those pic were pitched out years ago when they faded out so bad that you could not tell what they were.

i am trying to find some of the guys that did take good pic of the cars way back then to see if they still have any good ones but so far have struck out. Bummer....!

I have very little pic of my cars nowadays that survived. Thank Goodness I did get 3 pretty decent pic of my '69 BM Black car. By the time I got the white '70 Phase III I did not have time to worry about recording them and was into quick and relied on Polaroids and now alas I have few and little to show anyone. The ones that I do have are before I learned to take a good pic like I did when I went SCCA B/production and into the Can AM series Racing.

The cars look pretty shabby nowdays. I almost went **** up back in the 80's when I caught a bad case of racing so they just sat in the backyard out in the weather because the race vette and the Pantera got to stay inside.

My '70 only has 15,000 actual miles on it today but the original paint is pretty far gone. Motor has a rod knocking and the motor will be coming out in the next few weeks and I will be going through it and bringing it back up to LS-7 spec's. I just received a nice set of Alum heads to go back on it like it came from Joel with.

I will restore the paint and have it to show to the world next spring. Perhaps sooner. I am under a lot of pressure to do a frame off on it but I feel that it should not be that necessary to do to such a low mileage vehicle. If we can get it done in time I will take it to a few events "as is", once the motor and drive train is restored and then do the body work and paint this winter. It is probably the only Motion car that still has its original paint.

Now the '69 is setting naked in my shop (Stripped of all the paint) and just tonight I finally received the rear taillight panel (new) that has taken me 11 months to locate that I need to put it back to original from a minor traffic accident. Now if I can only find a pair of '69 leather factory seats and I will be getting close to having it back on the road. it only has 45,000 mi on it. Not sure just how far down I will take it to restore it. I don't like frame off cars as they are not a real car anymore and they are just too perfect to ever drive down to the local Sonic. I won't have something like that. People want to see it run and I just could not bear to have it and not be able to drive it. After all these years, it is my "BABY" and you just don't know what it is like to have something like that for 30 something years and not be able to drive it when I want.

Sorry I don't seem to be able to post a image on here????

 

Thanks Here is a link from a while ago with pics of Baldwin Motion Vettes http://forums.corvetteforum.com/zerothread?id=137574

 

Occupation: Swimming Pool Owner

 

Oh sorry I was too intent on the conversation about the car to notice that said swimming pool owner when it should say "Swimming pool company, owner" That is a one man business repairing swimming pools.

Thanks for pointing that out.

Pantera

 

I like "Swimming Pool Owner" better. Sounds like a goooooood occupation! Nice vettes by the way.

 

hey thanks for pointing it out. I like working for myself.

Thanks for the kind words about my cars. I have been collecting parts to repair them an finally found the rear taillight panel that I have needed to fix the back of the 69 and a pair of 074 alum heads to put the 70 LS-7 back together.

 

When I was having my '63 put together, I thought it might be nice to have an O.D. unit installed because of the 4.11 rear, just like some motion cars had. I looked up Mr. Rosens number and gave him a call. Was told he was busy, but to leave a message and he would call me back. Being it was long distance, I figured I had a snowballs chance of hearing from, especially cause he didn't know me from Adam. Sure enough a half hour later he called. He steered me towards a richmond 6spd instead of the o.d. unit and we talked on his dime for a good 45 minutes.

He asked about my car, how long I had it etc. Just regular car guy talk. Being someone who was around alot of hot cars, he wasn't stuck up or anything of the sort. Nice fella in my book.

As for the $1500 fee. I enjoy talking to people about my car and corvettes in general as are most vette owners. But think of how many really stupid questions you are asked in the course of a year. Now multiply that 100,000 fold because everyone and his brother that has an early c-3 thinks they have a motion car so they can retire to the bahamas if they sell it. Mr Rosen would be swamped with enough calls to have his own area code.

It's hard to document a motion car. The way I look at it, that is a good thing.
It's easy to "document" an 67 L-88, that is why there are 38 of them, when chevy only made 20.Classic

 

Oh I found him to be very easy to talk to also.

I was at the checkin counter at the hotel at the sYc renunion in St Louis last Labor day weekend and he and Gary the Local brush, Marty Schor and the rest of his group took time to chat with myself and a friend that had just purchaced a rough 68 vette with real Motion bodywork on it from years ago. It was pretty much a basket case.

Joel just loves to talk about his old cars and the past. I quizzed him about my '69 SS427 GT car and he was nice and told me some things about it but would not or could not pinpoint it as his old car from memory. He did try hard to discourage me from claming it was a real Motion car. Offered to search his records if I wanted to send him all the info and pic I have for the $1500 fee.
He was very nice about it and told me that there were many over the years that had made copies of his cars and that mine could be a fake. He could tell me for sure if I wanted to put he money up though.


I then; in a way, sandbaged him about my other Motion car. I mean how many people in the country have two of these cars. Until I showed up you have to remember that there were only 3 of these cars even known to still exist!

I casually asked him if he ever built a White Phase III GT vette? Of course it helps to already have the answer when you ask a loaded question like that. His reply was yes he did make a Gold stripe on a White Vette one time. He then quickley added, that "it no longer existed" any more! He said he remembered the buyer calling him not too long after buying it and informing him that he wrecked the car. "So that car was a total and is long gone now" he said!!!!

He said I will never forget that guy "Lawler about drove me nuts over that car" till he picked it up. BOY was that the one word that I was waiting for...! I couldn't stand it any longer I was about to **** down my leg with excitement because I knew something that Joel didn't know.

I told him that it was funny that he mentioned that name "Lawler", because I had a White with gold stripe Phase III vette at home. And that back when I first got it, I had found a BOS in the back of it from Baldwin Chev made out to a Roger Lawler of Dallas Tx. Joel was visabiliy shocked and asked "You mean that car is still around?" I told him that yes, the car was still alive (and well er:almost) and back home in Tulsa OK and had been all these years ever since I bought it from a dealer in Dallas back in 1974.

I told him that I could tell that it had been hit on the L front, but it had been repaired (poorly) and still only had 15,000 actual miles on it.

He turned to Gary the Local brush next to him and said, that he would never forget that car! because that "LAWLER" guy that bought it, just about drove me crazy wanting to get the fastest - baddest car that l could build, so we put a LS-7 Alum head motor in it.

Then he said "you know I will never forget that car! that was the most expensive Phase III GT vette that I ever sold! " Boy did that information make me feel good...!!!!!

My BOS shows it cost $13,620 on Jan 21, 1971 when it was delivered. It was a 70 model car not a 71!

So I have to say that Joel is very nice to talk to but we all have to remember that every tom dick and harry that is interested in his old cars thinks he should give them for free all his time and free info about his old cars. Most of them don't know diddly about what they are talking about and after a while I can see his side of the situtation. Everybody that comes along with a motion part on a used vette has tried to get him to document it as a real MOTION car for them, I bet he gets tired of that crap after a while. I think he is a prince to even talk to some of these nutty people myself.

We can only hope and pray that someday he will put what he knows down on paper for those in the future to have something to document what we all love as his old MOTION cars.

I can never forget the Quickstop that I bought that first Car's magazine and how I went out in the car and read that article about the SS427 GT Motion vette in my car in the parking lot. I kept that magazine all these years. I even got Joel to autograph it for me. Gary and Marty and all the rest too.

I will never forget how excited I was back in eary 1972, when a guy drove the very same car that I was so enamored with on the cover, into my service station to show it to me. He was working on it for a used car dealer here in Tulsa. I just about poopie my pants when I reconized it as that same car on the cover. It had been repainted Black with gold stripes, but I could still see the motion mods done to the car.

Later that week bought the car from him. I called Joel a few years later and asked him about the car and he said it sure sounded like his old car. I was always going to try to go back there and show it to him but never got around to it. sure glad that I never sold it back when money was tight and I about went broke in the used car business in the early 80's when interest went so high.

So now you know the rest of the story.... LOL....

And so the story will continue until i put a name on the first owner of this car. perhaps someday I will even find some old pictures of it when it was almost new?

Stay Tuned....

Pantera
Tulsa OK