A/C Conversion--alternatives to R134a?
Thread Starter
Instructor
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 184
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A/C Conversion--alternatives to R134a?
Heya. In addition to getting a new engine in my '80 6-speed vette, I am going to have the mechanic fix the air (not sure what is wrong, just doesn't blow cold air). I told him I definately didn't want to stick with the old system that uses a coolant that is near impossible to get (R12).
I remember a couple of years ago when I first came on the forum (different screen name) some of yall were talking about alternatives to the R134a systems. I think there was even a website specifically dedicated to the different systems you could convert a R12 system into. Some people were also claiming you could add a can or two of something-or-other to a R134a system to help make it colder.
Anyone know what the alternatives are, what that special thing is that one should add to a R134a system to make it colder, or what that website is?
Thanks for any help.
I remember a couple of years ago when I first came on the forum (different screen name) some of yall were talking about alternatives to the R134a systems. I think there was even a website specifically dedicated to the different systems you could convert a R12 system into. Some people were also claiming you could add a can or two of something-or-other to a R134a system to help make it colder.
Anyone know what the alternatives are, what that special thing is that one should add to a R134a system to make it colder, or what that website is?
Thanks for any help.
Safety Car
Joined: Oct 1999
Posts: 4,101
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From: NorCal
Stay away from the wierdo refrigerants. They are propane based and marginal at best. Plus, if you contaminate a guy's recovery equipment with it, you will pay big $$$ to repair it!
R134a is in my stock setup (new drier and oil) and it works great.
Hans
R134a is in my stock setup (new drier and oil) and it works great.
Hans
Team Owner
Joined: May 2001
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From: Exiled to Richmond, VA - Finally sold my house in Murfreesboro, TN ?? Corner of "Bumf*&k and 'You've got a purdy mouth'."
CI 6-7-8 Veteran
CI-VIII Burnout Champ
St. Jude Donor '06-'10, '13
Originally Posted by Wrencher
Stay away from the wierdo refrigerants. They are propane based and marginal at best. Plus, if you contaminate a guy's recovery equipment with it, you will pay big $$$ to repair it!
R134a is in my stock setup (new drier and oil) and it works great.
Hans
R134a is in my stock setup (new drier and oil) and it works great.
Hans
My 1980's A/C was cold enough to make my toes cold on a trip from Phoenix to Tucson in 108 degree temps doing 80 MPH down the interstate. It is the original system using 134a. I have sealed up all the ducts under the dash to keep what little air flow there is going to the vents. I also have put heat / sound barrier under the carpet, but my heals still roast from the exhaust pipe under them and my e-brake is very hot to the touch after a cruise.
If anything, when the factory compressor kicks the bucket, I will have an aftermarket polished Sanden compressor put in.
Those other replacement refrigerants are nasty and some are very dangerous. Either pay for the R12, or convert to the 134a.
Drifting
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 1,634
Likes: 4
From: Northern NJ
St. Jude Donor '04 & '05
I've heard of people using propane but this is NUTS IMO. Use a 134a conversion kit (w/oil) after pulling, and holding, a vacuum on the system to completely evacuate all the R-12 and also make sure you have no leaks. I have done this on several cars with no issues. FWIW.
Good Luck!
Good Luck!
Le Mans Master
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 5,635
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From: Orlando Floriduh
If you intend to do the job youself .... Freeze 12 is very good. I was skeptical until I tried it. It has NO flamables like propane.. it is 134a and 142b to carry the mineral oil that is in an R12 system. They say you can just put it in an R12 system. They do reccomend that you add some ester oil. Now when you use freeze 12 both oils circulate and the combination does seem to cooler better at low speed. I had a very small leak that I couln't find (I have a sniffer) with just R134a but not with the freeze 12.
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Safety Car
Joined: Jun 2002
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From: Buckeye, AZ
St. Jude Donor '12-'13
I went the R12A, which is what Freeze 12 is. By research it appears this is a very good way to go. It is designed to mix with existing R12 and is environmentally safe. It also blows colder than R134. It is my belief that most shops are pushing the conversion because it is a good money maker. R12A is only $15 a pound and with C3s using only 3lbs total you can see where they would make more money. A conversion for $100+, or a recharge for about $50 max.
Racer
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 383
Likes: 0
From: Columbia SC
On a long or short cruise on a 95 degree day I have to turn mine down from max cool, and until that changes I am sticking with 134a.
Also, if you search e-bay you will find a good bunch of folks selling the small cans of r12.
If done correctly the 134a is just fine and if you read all of the threads on this you can cut a few corners (just do a conversion kit and nothing else) and 134a is still fine.
Depends on how much time and money you want to throw at it right.
But at least you have options.
1) buy r12 cans & oil from ebay.
2) buy r134a cans or conversion kit from local auto parts store.
3) buy "whatever" from ?? and have a unique system that nobody will touch except you..
Depends on how much risk you want to take.
I myself would not pick #3 cause it is to unique, but Larry B. knows what he is talking about regarding the oil being compatable, very important.
Also if you can't do the work yourself (cause your not handy on A/C stuff) then you had better have a
guy who will work on your A/C if you go with #3
I picked #2 and replaced parts and O rings so I had 99% new parts in the A/C system when I was done. I am very happy with my vent temps.
If I was interested in quick and easy, I would do #1 and call it a day.
Also, if you search e-bay you will find a good bunch of folks selling the small cans of r12.
If done correctly the 134a is just fine and if you read all of the threads on this you can cut a few corners (just do a conversion kit and nothing else) and 134a is still fine.
Depends on how much time and money you want to throw at it right.
But at least you have options.
1) buy r12 cans & oil from ebay.
2) buy r134a cans or conversion kit from local auto parts store.
3) buy "whatever" from ?? and have a unique system that nobody will touch except you..
Depends on how much risk you want to take.
I myself would not pick #3 cause it is to unique, but Larry B. knows what he is talking about regarding the oil being compatable, very important.
Also if you can't do the work yourself (cause your not handy on A/C stuff) then you had better have a
guy who will work on your A/C if you go with #3
I picked #2 and replaced parts and O rings so I had 99% new parts in the A/C system when I was done. I am very happy with my vent temps.
If I was interested in quick and easy, I would do #1 and call it a day.
Thread Starter
Instructor
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 184
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Talked with the guy who is going to install my new engine and asked him about R134a versus R12a. He said he generally does R12a and prefers to go that route because it is generally colder. Although the R12a itself costs a little more, it is not significant.
Seems like I'll go this route unless someone knows a strong reason not to.
Thanks a bunch.
Seems like I'll go this route unless someone knows a strong reason not to.
Thanks a bunch.
134a, 1980, 76, adding, air, alternative, alternatives, conditioning, conversion, corvette, covert, freeze12, freon, propane, r134, r134a
