Exotic muscle headers
06-03-2005, 09:06 AM
#1
Melting Slicks
Thread Starter
Exotic muscle headers
i have been trying to decide what headers to get for my LT4. i was going to get the TPiS longtubes but noticed the EMs were cheaper even with the coating and i have heard a lot of people say they are a little bit better quality than the others. does anybody know if the EM longtubes have AIR fittings for a late model C4?
06-03-2005, 10:07 AM
#2
Race Director
I bought some for my 95 and they have all of the bungs welded in place ,but you have to drill the hole through the tube to use them.
Give EM a call they are easy to work with.
Mike
Give EM a call they are easy to work with.
Mike
06-03-2005, 10:07 AM
#3
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Originally Posted by 1996man
i have been trying to decide what headers to get for my LT4. i was going to get the TPiS longtubes but noticed the EMs were cheaper even with the coating and i have heard a lot of people say they are a little bit better quality than the others. does anybody know if the EM longtubes have AIR fittings for a late model C4?
06-03-2005, 12:08 PM
#8
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C4 of Year Finalist (appearance mods) 2019
Originally Posted by Admiral94
Wait until the next group buy.
Are you guys all refering to their part # 1185 stainless $849.00 or does everyone use part # 1180 mild steel pipe $425.00?
Has anyone who has had them on their C4 for a while ever experienced any cracks where the pipes meet the flange do to torque movement of the engine?
Last edited by Mr. Peabody; 06-03-2005 at 02:33 PM.
06-03-2005, 01:44 PM
#9
Le Mans Master
I just installed the EM long tubes and dynatech high flow cats about a month ago on my LT4. They are a great product in both quality, fit and looks. They fit with very minor modifications to the car, which is basically clearance stuff. The install is straight forward (this was my first header install). You really can't go wrong with either EM or TPIS. I got the Em's on a gp and Merle is great to work with.
06-03-2005, 02:50 PM
#10
Melting Slicks
Originally Posted by 96redvette
I just talked to Merle at EM yesterday. He is supposed to have a group purchase on these this weekend.
06-03-2005, 03:26 PM
#11
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Originally Posted by jwt1603
How do we find out about a GP? Will it be posted as a sticky in parts?
06-04-2005, 03:45 AM
#15
Drifting
I just installed the EM headers on my '96 auto a couple weeks ago.
Very nice pieces.
Here are some installation notes:
1. The AIR injection tube on the passenger side was impossible to fit (the EMs relocate the fitting about an 1-1/2" rearward). It's probably me, but I was unable to bend it enough to make up the slack. A tubing bender may help you in this area.
2. This only applies to auto trannys.... If you get the extensions from EM... THEY WON'T FIT BECAUSE OF THE FLANGE. With the flange eliminated (i.e. weld the two pieces together), the fit is terrific. If the flange was relocated about 3" rearward then they would fit fine.
3. A stock Felpro LT1 exhaust gasket (don't have the number off hand) doesn't have enough meat to cover the 1-3/4" opening of the header. A Mr.Gasket Ultra Seal for an LT1 has plenty of material and does the job right.
4. Header bolts... It all depends on how lazy you are. I'm really lazy so I spent the cash and bought the Breslin Split-locks. Several hundred miles, a couple dozen heat cycles later and no leaks. Install and forget.
Still, options are available. The Stage 8 bolts (the ones with the clips) look like a monster test of patience to install on a C-4. This would probably be a one time deal as well.
The last is any standard bolt and a split-lock washer. This is less certain and may require retorquing the bolt a few times during the initial heat cycles. Fine if you like disassembling wheel-well shrouds and ASR throttle assembly.
Also.. the flange on the EM headers is 3/8". I'd recommend a 1" header bolt. All mine threaded in fine.
5. Exotic Muscle is very thoughtful in providing two spacers that will be needed. The first is for the two struts that attach the A/C - alternator bracket to the 3rd exhaust stud from the front on the driver's side. You'll have to use the stock bolt on this hole.
The other is intended for the oil dipstick on the passenger side. My dipstick reinstalled quite well so I didn't use the stock bolt with the EM spacer. I did, however, slice the second EM spacer to fit the gap between the alternator and supporting bracket due to necessary elimination of the strut that goes from the alternator to the first exhaust stud on the driver's side. You can't keep that strut (I wanted to).
As long as you have the two struts supporting the A/C-alternator bracket you shouldn't have any vibration problem (although I've only tested it to 6700rpm).
6. Spark plug wires... It is absolutely necessary to replace the 180 degree boot wire on the #7 cylinder (I also recommend it for #8) with 90 degree boots.
I was running some Taylor Spiro-Pros so I ordered up the same style for a '96 Camaro (these are all 90 degree boots). The fit is fine (I only replaced #7 & #8 since you have to remove the serpentine belt and tensioner to access the Opti for #7).
7. This is noted in the EM installation instructions but is a MUST! You will have to invert the driver's side engine bracket bolt (the horizontal one....not the vertical fluid dampner bolt to the frame). This was easy with two people and a jack. It would be very tough on your own. Bring a friend.
Sorry for the long post but hopefully this will give people some items to consider BEFORE installation. It should help the frustration factor.
BTW... EM headers + extensions (no cats) + stock resonator - mufflers + LT4 heads + Hotcam + 6700rpm = HELLA LOUD! But fairly mild compared to the 15 miles I drove it with straight headers to the exhaust shop (stupid flanges)
EDIT: Just found my Summit Racing receipt for the Felpro gaskets... FPP-1470. No good with the EM's.
EDIT #2: Just remembered.... It's a very good idea to "test fit" the wrench or socket you plan to use on the header bolts while the headers are off. I did this by placing the header bolt through the flange, moving it as close to the header tube as possible (the mounting holes have some room) and trying to fit the wrench. I did have to bang out some (very minor) clearance on the #1 tube.
Very nice pieces.
Here are some installation notes:
1. The AIR injection tube on the passenger side was impossible to fit (the EMs relocate the fitting about an 1-1/2" rearward). It's probably me, but I was unable to bend it enough to make up the slack. A tubing bender may help you in this area.
2. This only applies to auto trannys.... If you get the extensions from EM... THEY WON'T FIT BECAUSE OF THE FLANGE. With the flange eliminated (i.e. weld the two pieces together), the fit is terrific. If the flange was relocated about 3" rearward then they would fit fine.
3. A stock Felpro LT1 exhaust gasket (don't have the number off hand) doesn't have enough meat to cover the 1-3/4" opening of the header. A Mr.Gasket Ultra Seal for an LT1 has plenty of material and does the job right.
4. Header bolts... It all depends on how lazy you are. I'm really lazy so I spent the cash and bought the Breslin Split-locks. Several hundred miles, a couple dozen heat cycles later and no leaks. Install and forget.
Still, options are available. The Stage 8 bolts (the ones with the clips) look like a monster test of patience to install on a C-4. This would probably be a one time deal as well.
The last is any standard bolt and a split-lock washer. This is less certain and may require retorquing the bolt a few times during the initial heat cycles. Fine if you like disassembling wheel-well shrouds and ASR throttle assembly.
Also.. the flange on the EM headers is 3/8". I'd recommend a 1" header bolt. All mine threaded in fine.
5. Exotic Muscle is very thoughtful in providing two spacers that will be needed. The first is for the two struts that attach the A/C - alternator bracket to the 3rd exhaust stud from the front on the driver's side. You'll have to use the stock bolt on this hole.
The other is intended for the oil dipstick on the passenger side. My dipstick reinstalled quite well so I didn't use the stock bolt with the EM spacer. I did, however, slice the second EM spacer to fit the gap between the alternator and supporting bracket due to necessary elimination of the strut that goes from the alternator to the first exhaust stud on the driver's side. You can't keep that strut (I wanted to).
As long as you have the two struts supporting the A/C-alternator bracket you shouldn't have any vibration problem (although I've only tested it to 6700rpm).
6. Spark plug wires... It is absolutely necessary to replace the 180 degree boot wire on the #7 cylinder (I also recommend it for #8) with 90 degree boots.
I was running some Taylor Spiro-Pros so I ordered up the same style for a '96 Camaro (these are all 90 degree boots). The fit is fine (I only replaced #7 & #8 since you have to remove the serpentine belt and tensioner to access the Opti for #7).
7. This is noted in the EM installation instructions but is a MUST! You will have to invert the driver's side engine bracket bolt (the horizontal one....not the vertical fluid dampner bolt to the frame). This was easy with two people and a jack. It would be very tough on your own. Bring a friend.
Sorry for the long post but hopefully this will give people some items to consider BEFORE installation. It should help the frustration factor.
BTW... EM headers + extensions (no cats) + stock resonator - mufflers + LT4 heads + Hotcam + 6700rpm = HELLA LOUD! But fairly mild compared to the 15 miles I drove it with straight headers to the exhaust shop (stupid flanges)
EDIT: Just found my Summit Racing receipt for the Felpro gaskets... FPP-1470. No good with the EM's.
EDIT #2: Just remembered.... It's a very good idea to "test fit" the wrench or socket you plan to use on the header bolts while the headers are off. I did this by placing the header bolt through the flange, moving it as close to the header tube as possible (the mounting holes have some room) and trying to fit the wrench. I did have to bang out some (very minor) clearance on the #1 tube.
Last edited by Dan Parker '96; 06-04-2005 at 10:57 PM.
06-04-2005, 07:54 AM
#16
Melting Slicks
Originally Posted by Dan Parker '96
I just installed the EM headers on my '96 auto a couple weeks ago.
Very nice pieces.
Here are some installation notes:
1. The AIR injection tube on the passenger side was impossible to fit (the EMs relocate the fitting about an 1-1/2" rearward). It's probably me, but I was unable to bend it enough to make up the slack. A tubing bender may help you in this area.
2. This only applies to auto trannys.... If you get the extensions from EM... THEY WON'T FIT BECAUSE OF THE FLANGE. With the flange eliminated (i.e. weld the two pieces together), the fit is terrific. If the flange was relocated about 3" rearward then they would fit fine.
3. A stock Felpro LT1 exhaust gasket (don't have the number off hand) doesn't have enough meat to cover the 1-3/4" opening of the header. A Mr.Gasket Ultra Seal for an LT1 has plenty of material and does the job right.
4. Header bolts... It all depends on how lazy you are. I'm really lazy so I spent the cash and bought the Breslin Split-locks. Several hundred miles, a couple dozen heat cycles later and no leaks. Install and forget.
Still, options are available. The Stage 8 bolts (the ones with the clips) look like a monster test of patience to install on a C-4. This would probably be a one time deal as well.
The last is any standard bolt and a split-lock washer. This is less certain and may require retorquing the bolt a few times during the initial heat cycles. Fine if you like disassembling wheel-well shrouds and ASR throttle assembly.
Also.. the flange on the EM headers is 3/8". I'd recommend a 1" header bolt. All mine threaded in fine.
5. Exotic Muscle is very thoughtful in providing two spacers that will be needed. The first is for the two struts that attach the A/C - alternator bracket to the 3rd exhaust stud from the front on the driver's side. You'll have to use the stock bolt on this hole.
The other is intended for the oil dipstick on the passenger side. My dipstick reinstalled quite well so I didn't use the stock bolt with the EM spacer. I did, however, slice the second EM spacer to fit the gap between the alternator and supporting bracket due to necessary elimination of the strut that goes from the alternator to the first exhaust stud on the driver's side. You can't keep that strut (I wanted to).
As long as you have the two struts supporting the A/C-alternator bracket you shouldn't have any vibration problem (although I've only tested it to 6700rpm).
6. Spark plug wires... It is absolutely necessary to replace the 180 degree boot wire on the #7 cylinder (I also recommend it for #8) with 90 degree boots.
I was running some Taylor Spiro-Pros so I ordered up the same style for a '96 Camaro (these are all 90 degree boots). The fit is fine (I only replaced #7 & #8 since you have to remove the serpentine belt and tensioner to access the Opti for #7).
7. This is noted in the EM installation instructions but is a MUST! You will have to invert the driver's side engine bracket bolt (not the fluid dampner bolt to the frame). This was easy with two people and a jack. It would be very tough on your own. Bring a friend.
Sorry for the long post but hopefully this will give people some items to consider BEFORE installation. It should help the frustration factor.
BTW... EM headers + extensions (no cats) + stock resonator - mufflers + LT4 heads + Hotcam + 6700rpm = HELLA LOUD! But fairly mild compared to the 15 miles I drove it with straight headers to the exhaust shop (stupid flanges)
EDIT: Just found my Summit Racing receipt for the Felpro gaskets... FPP-1470. No good with the EM's.
Very nice pieces.
Here are some installation notes:
1. The AIR injection tube on the passenger side was impossible to fit (the EMs relocate the fitting about an 1-1/2" rearward). It's probably me, but I was unable to bend it enough to make up the slack. A tubing bender may help you in this area.
2. This only applies to auto trannys.... If you get the extensions from EM... THEY WON'T FIT BECAUSE OF THE FLANGE. With the flange eliminated (i.e. weld the two pieces together), the fit is terrific. If the flange was relocated about 3" rearward then they would fit fine.
3. A stock Felpro LT1 exhaust gasket (don't have the number off hand) doesn't have enough meat to cover the 1-3/4" opening of the header. A Mr.Gasket Ultra Seal for an LT1 has plenty of material and does the job right.
4. Header bolts... It all depends on how lazy you are. I'm really lazy so I spent the cash and bought the Breslin Split-locks. Several hundred miles, a couple dozen heat cycles later and no leaks. Install and forget.
Still, options are available. The Stage 8 bolts (the ones with the clips) look like a monster test of patience to install on a C-4. This would probably be a one time deal as well.
The last is any standard bolt and a split-lock washer. This is less certain and may require retorquing the bolt a few times during the initial heat cycles. Fine if you like disassembling wheel-well shrouds and ASR throttle assembly.
Also.. the flange on the EM headers is 3/8". I'd recommend a 1" header bolt. All mine threaded in fine.
5. Exotic Muscle is very thoughtful in providing two spacers that will be needed. The first is for the two struts that attach the A/C - alternator bracket to the 3rd exhaust stud from the front on the driver's side. You'll have to use the stock bolt on this hole.
The other is intended for the oil dipstick on the passenger side. My dipstick reinstalled quite well so I didn't use the stock bolt with the EM spacer. I did, however, slice the second EM spacer to fit the gap between the alternator and supporting bracket due to necessary elimination of the strut that goes from the alternator to the first exhaust stud on the driver's side. You can't keep that strut (I wanted to).
As long as you have the two struts supporting the A/C-alternator bracket you shouldn't have any vibration problem (although I've only tested it to 6700rpm).
6. Spark plug wires... It is absolutely necessary to replace the 180 degree boot wire on the #7 cylinder (I also recommend it for #8) with 90 degree boots.
I was running some Taylor Spiro-Pros so I ordered up the same style for a '96 Camaro (these are all 90 degree boots). The fit is fine (I only replaced #7 & #8 since you have to remove the serpentine belt and tensioner to access the Opti for #7).
7. This is noted in the EM installation instructions but is a MUST! You will have to invert the driver's side engine bracket bolt (not the fluid dampner bolt to the frame). This was easy with two people and a jack. It would be very tough on your own. Bring a friend.
Sorry for the long post but hopefully this will give people some items to consider BEFORE installation. It should help the frustration factor.
BTW... EM headers + extensions (no cats) + stock resonator - mufflers + LT4 heads + Hotcam + 6700rpm = HELLA LOUD! But fairly mild compared to the 15 miles I drove it with straight headers to the exhaust shop (stupid flanges)
EDIT: Just found my Summit Racing receipt for the Felpro gaskets... FPP-1470. No good with the EM's.
06-04-2005, 08:18 AM
#17
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St. Jude Donor '04-'05-'06-'07
Originally Posted by Mr. Peabody
Are you guys all refering to their part # 1185 stainless $849.00 or does everyone use part # 1180 mild steel pipe $425.00?
Has anyone who has had them on their C4 for a while ever experienced any cracks where the pipes meet the flange do to torque movement of the engine?
Has anyone who has had them on their C4 for a while ever experienced any cracks where the pipes meet the flange do to torque movement of the engine?
06-04-2005, 10:40 AM
#18
Have had my EMs in for over a year, I also bought the connector with cats to mate to the CORSA exhaust. Everything went on effortlessly, no fabrication or modification needed. Everything is still looking and performing great!
06-04-2005, 03:54 PM
#19
Le Mans Master
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Cruise-In VI Veteran
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St. Jude Donor '06
Originally Posted by Dan Parker '96
2. This only applies to auto trannys.... If you get the extensions from EM... THEY WON'T FIT BECAUSE OF THE FLANGE. With the flange eliminated (i.e. weld the two pieces together), the fit is terrific. If the flange was relocated about 3" rearward then they would fit fine.
Yeah I found the same problem. That's when I was happy not to have spent the extra $ on the coated ones. I removed the gasket and bolted them together. Then cut half the flange off ( tranny side) then just ran a good bead of weld around them. They fit great now.
06-04-2005, 08:11 PM
#20
Team Owner
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TPIs is the ones who welds bosses onto the bolt holes right? That in itself has got to make getting to the bolts way easier... worth the extra dough.