Might have signs of blown head gasket now
08-14-2005, 03:42 PM
#21
Team Owner
Originally Posted by Dominic Sorresso
korvette4U,
I have been having a heck of a time trying to find an oil leak that seemed to originate from somewhere near the China Wall. Changed the intake gaskets on my Xfire. I am running TF 23d heads with mods to the motor. CFI is familiar with it. Anyway, a mechanic friend of mine told me it could be an oil galley plug leaking that is located under the rear top of the head/block interface on the drivers side. That necessitated pulling the head. 5 years ago I installed the TFS heads with ARP bolts using a Felpro 1010 head gasket. Here's what I found on #7
I found that the fire ring was also beginning to pull away from #1 CYLINDER.
On 3rd Gen. org. one of the moderators told me FelPro had this particular type of defect with the 1010 gasket. After calling TFlow, I bought a set of the 1003. Although the compression thickness is .002 more than the supposed .039 on the 1010, the tech at TF said they use the 1003 on all their engine builds and have never had a problem with them. AFR recommends the 1003 for their 195 heads as well. Needless to say, I just pulled the passenger side. It wasn't quite as bad as the drivers side, but the #8 cylinder is showing signs of the same defect. The fire ring is actually pulling away or separating from the gasket material. There was no sign of coolant in the oil, but I was having a hard time getting air out of the coolant system. And I have been struggling with a stumble at idle although cruise seemed to be fine. The oil leak led me to find another, more serious problem.
I have been having a heck of a time trying to find an oil leak that seemed to originate from somewhere near the China Wall. Changed the intake gaskets on my Xfire. I am running TF 23d heads with mods to the motor. CFI is familiar with it. Anyway, a mechanic friend of mine told me it could be an oil galley plug leaking that is located under the rear top of the head/block interface on the drivers side. That necessitated pulling the head. 5 years ago I installed the TFS heads with ARP bolts using a Felpro 1010 head gasket. Here's what I found on #7
I found that the fire ring was also beginning to pull away from #1 CYLINDER.
On 3rd Gen. org. one of the moderators told me FelPro had this particular type of defect with the 1010 gasket. After calling TFlow, I bought a set of the 1003. Although the compression thickness is .002 more than the supposed .039 on the 1010, the tech at TF said they use the 1003 on all their engine builds and have never had a problem with them. AFR recommends the 1003 for their 195 heads as well. Needless to say, I just pulled the passenger side. It wasn't quite as bad as the drivers side, but the #8 cylinder is showing signs of the same defect. The fire ring is actually pulling away or separating from the gasket material. There was no sign of coolant in the oil, but I was having a hard time getting air out of the coolant system. And I have been struggling with a stumble at idle although cruise seemed to be fine. The oil leak led me to find another, more serious problem.
I am wondering if torquing that last bolt is being done right? It's a toughy to reach. I did hers off the car, and that, I am sure, helped a lot.
Stingraynut - I am SO glad that your problem was found before metal got eaten!!!!!!!!!!!
08-14-2005, 09:00 PM
#22
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
Bogus -
thanks - me too! I had almost no symptoms, only some smoke out the exhaust when engine hot which was not normal. I was lucky that the problem was discovered and caught it so early.
korvette4u - re the dimmer circuit - I will post on the forum when I've fitted the module and run it for a few weeks - obviously the part is for my circuit, not yours which looks to be a later module. The part my electronics friend used to replace the To2 was MJE 3055. He's also drawn up a circuit diagram, all of which I'll post when I prove it works in the vette.
S'nut
I am SO glad that your problem was found before metal got eaten!!!!!!!!!!
korvette4u - re the dimmer circuit - I will post on the forum when I've fitted the module and run it for a few weeks - obviously the part is for my circuit, not yours which looks to be a later module. The part my electronics friend used to replace the To2 was MJE 3055. He's also drawn up a circuit diagram, all of which I'll post when I prove it works in the vette.
S'nut
08-14-2005, 10:12 PM
#23
Le Mans Master
Originally Posted by korvette4u
Remember to torque the head bolt down in sequence
(MAKE SURE OF THIS). If you reusing the old bolts ( prefer new)
add 3 lbs ft extra..
(MAKE SURE OF THIS). If you reusing the old bolts ( prefer new)
add 3 lbs ft extra..
tightening sequence and torque value. I recently read another thread
here where the posters spoke about errors in the factory/Helms
manual. Apparently, in at least one release, it specifies an invalid
tightening sequence (all bolts on one side followed by all bolts on the
other side) and in the same or another release, it specifies a torque
value that is too high for aluminum and likely to result in damaged
threads (50 ft lbs).
For my '89, the manual calls for 47Nm (35 lbs ft). The tightening
sequence is shown as follows (looking down: left side here represents
front of engine)
12..11..04..01..05..06
Frt --------------Rear
10..09..03..02..07..08
Unless someone else reports issues with the above, check to make
sure that your shop knows and follows this procedure.
.
08-14-2005, 10:34 PM
#24
Drifting
Member Since: Mar 2005
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Originally Posted by bogus
That is EXACTLY where the head gaskets blew on bastet44's 87 coupe. The only difference? It was #8, not #7. But it was the EXACT SAME SPOT.
08-15-2005, 12:08 PM
#27
Le Mans Master
Originally Posted by Morley
But that brings the question...WHY the hell are they
still making those POS gaskets?
still making those POS gaskets?
Yet.
.
08-15-2005, 04:22 PM
#28
Le Mans Master
Guys,
This thread would make a great "stickie", don't you think
Mr. Moderator?
I'll bet there's a ton of us that have used this gasket for our AL head mods. My friend =Jeff= is going to pull his CNC L98 heads after reading this thread even tho he currently has no symptoms of a problem.
korvette4U,
I originally installed the heads 5 years ago with a new set of ARP bolts.
This is the first time heads have been off since. Are you suggesting that I would need another new set or are you talking about the original OEM bolts?
This thread would make a great "stickie", don't you think
Mr. Moderator?
I'll bet there's a ton of us that have used this gasket for our AL head mods. My friend =Jeff= is going to pull his CNC L98 heads after reading this thread even tho he currently has no symptoms of a problem.
korvette4U,
I originally installed the heads 5 years ago with a new set of ARP bolts.
This is the first time heads have been off since. Are you suggesting that I would need another new set or are you talking about the original OEM bolts?
Last edited by Dominic Sorresso; 08-15-2005 at 04:25 PM.
08-15-2005, 09:35 PM
#29
Le Mans Master
The Felpro split where most of the stock gaskets blow at #7 - I'd check the deck for a tiny grove assuming that's why you swapped out the gaskets in the first place. A number of stock units on the early aluminum head motors didn't make it pass the warranty period - so if it leaked for any length of time, there's a good chance a few mils need to come off the deck. Otherwise, it isn't going to matter what gasket you put on it.
08-15-2005, 10:55 PM
#30
Le Mans Master
SunCr,
The evidence seems to indicate that there was a manufacturing flaw on the rightmost cylinder, if you are looking at gasket with UP indicated on the surface. Having taken off both sides, I can overlay both gaskets and have the same defect on the same cylinder. It seems to be prevalent on the outermost cylinders ie 1,8,2,7. And on the outermost edge of the cylinder. Also saw indication of a 'track' between the innermost cylinder pairs as was described by someone else in this thread.
The evidence seems to indicate that there was a manufacturing flaw on the rightmost cylinder, if you are looking at gasket with UP indicated on the surface. Having taken off both sides, I can overlay both gaskets and have the same defect on the same cylinder. It seems to be prevalent on the outermost cylinders ie 1,8,2,7. And on the outermost edge of the cylinder. Also saw indication of a 'track' between the innermost cylinder pairs as was described by someone else in this thread.
08-15-2005, 11:16 PM
#31
Le Mans Master
My point was that the early aluminum head motors blew the stock gasket with incredible frequency at #7 pretty much at the same spot as shown in the photo (I know mine did along with all the others who took the time to file complaints with the NHTSA or file lawsuits against GM). As best as I could find out, GM changed the gasket material, but nothing made it into production until '91 when the 113's underwent a minor redesign. In any event these engines seemed prone to allow coolant seepage between the gasket, the iron deck and the aluminum head, generally at #7, setting the stage for galvanic corrosion (a phrase GM subsequently removed from their Bulletin when they redesigned the heads). If it went on long enough it might wear a groove in the deck (to say nothing of what it does to the coolant passages and radiator), so if I blew the replacement gasket at 7, I'd take a look at the deck first.
08-16-2005, 12:04 AM
#32
Le Mans Master
SunCr,
I appreciate that additional elaboration. At least in my case, the original motor, a Xfire, came with Stock (ick) iron heads. So the groove you speak of isn't applicable in my situation. Again, in my case, the gaskets on either side showed the same defect and there have been more reports of the same defect with different aluminum heads but the same FelPro 1010.
I appreciate that additional elaboration. At least in my case, the original motor, a Xfire, came with Stock (ick) iron heads. So the groove you speak of isn't applicable in my situation. Again, in my case, the gaskets on either side showed the same defect and there have been more reports of the same defect with different aluminum heads but the same FelPro 1010.
09-03-2005, 06:08 AM
#33
Instructor
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Hello.
I belive that I´ve have a head leak, very high pressure in the water system, it gurgel and bubble. Have "new" engine, and bore 4.030. I´ve used the 1010 gasket.
What gasket shall I use? The 1003 or?
//Andreas
I belive that I´ve have a head leak, very high pressure in the water system, it gurgel and bubble. Have "new" engine, and bore 4.030. I´ve used the 1010 gasket.
What gasket shall I use? The 1003 or?
//Andreas
09-03-2005, 10:42 AM
#34
Le Mans Master
Originally Posted by HuggerVette
Hello.
I believe that I´ve have a head leak, very high pressure in the water system, it gurgle and bubble. Have "new" engine, and bore 4.030. I´ve used the 1010 gasket.
What gasket shall I use? The 1003 or?
//Andreas
I believe that I´ve have a head leak, very high pressure in the water system, it gurgle and bubble. Have "new" engine, and bore 4.030. I´ve used the 1010 gasket.
What gasket shall I use? The 1003 or?
//Andreas
I just re-did my head gaskets after having found 3 cylinders where the fire ring was disengaged or in the process of. I started to have problems "purging" the coolant system. Had lots of bubbling and it would shoot out of thee radiator. Also, fluid level would drop over short period of time. There was vapor coming out of the exhaust even in warmer temps outside and for the motor. The gasket I had used on my TF23d heads was the 1010. You can find other examples of the 1010 going away on this forum and on 3rd Gen. Checking with both Trick Flow and AFR, they recommend the 1003 for bore up to 4.10. Good Luck and tell us what you find.
Last edited by Dominic Sorresso; 09-03-2005 at 10:44 AM.
12-02-2005, 03:53 PM
#36
Safety Car
Member Since: Dec 2004
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So, what is the stock pt. # for the 89 head gaskets? If it is #1010, I gonna complain to the shop who put them on my year old heads and simulate overheating. Don't worry, I'm still under warranty!!
01-25-2014, 05:06 PM
#37
Which head gasket would you recommend for a 4.030 bored 383 with 70cc AFR195 heads?
I installed a Felpro 1010 very careful and got this: http://forums.corvetteforum.com/c4-t...1-383-tpi.html
Could be the gasket ...
Would a 4.060 be OK or should I go with a 4.100 ?
I installed a Felpro 1010 very careful and got this: http://forums.corvetteforum.com/c4-t...1-383-tpi.html
Could be the gasket ...
Would a 4.060 be OK or should I go with a 4.100 ?
01-27-2014, 07:47 AM
#38
Law Dawg Moderator
Which head gasket would you recommend for a 4.030 bored 383 with 70cc AFR195 heads?
I installed a Felpro 1010 very careful and got this: http://forums.corvetteforum.com/c4-t...1-383-tpi.html
Could be the gasket ...
Would a 4.060 be OK or should I go with a 4.100 ?
I installed a Felpro 1010 very careful and got this: http://forums.corvetteforum.com/c4-t...1-383-tpi.html
Could be the gasket ...
Would a 4.060 be OK or should I go with a 4.100 ?
