Need diagnosis - Headgasket
Thread Starter
Safety Car
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 4,723
Likes: 11
From: Winnipeg Manitoba, Canada
Originally Posted by bogus
I will also make a suggestion: If you find that the current engine is dying, you may simply want to get a GM Crate motor - ZZ4 comes to mind - for it.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 6,130
Likes: 2
From: seattle WA
A difference between the two tests is a compression test localizes the leak (which cylinders). Crate motors are ready to run. With 150K on the clock, your current engine is do, and I agree with the Kid, probably needs to be bored. I've done alot of rebuilds with engine in car..unless the engine needed to be bored..but not in a vette, hardest part there is getting it hig enough off the ground. As far as going from crate..rebuild to a 383, well, I've had my mod days, personally I'd leave it stock, unless you're planning time at the strip. It ain't cheap building, and it ain't cheap maintaining.If gas mileage is even slightly a concern..forget it. A mild cam and headers will really improve these little devils.
Team Owner
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 40,156
Likes: 45
From: San Pedro CA
Originally Posted by rick lambert
A difference between the two tests is a compression test localizes the leak (which cylinders). Crate motors are ready to run. With 150K on the clock, your current engine is do, and I agree with the Kid, probably needs to be bored. I've done alot of rebuilds with engine in car..unless the engine needed to be bored..but not in a vette, hardest part there is getting it hig enough off the ground. As far as going from crate..rebuild to a 383, well, I've had my mod days, personally I'd leave it stock, unless you're planning time at the strip. It ain't cheap building, and it ain't cheap maintaining.If gas mileage is even slightly a concern..forget it. A mild cam and headers will really improve these little devils.
If nothing else, it will confirm the need to run the compression check.
there is still a chance that the intake gasket has failed, causing leakage.
Team Owner
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 40,156
Likes: 45
From: San Pedro CA
The 383 debate.
There is no reason to build a high strung 383. But a cheap one will cost about $2000, USC. You don't need a forged crank if all you are going to do is drive it... the added CI will give torque on the cheap.
And that build won't kill MPG. It will be bigger, but not all that hotter.
It's like this: Would you rather have a high strung 400hp 350, or a milder 400hp 383?
The ZZ4 is available from any number of GM Performance Parts vendors. The street price is about $3500, USC.
There is no reason to build a high strung 383. But a cheap one will cost about $2000, USC. You don't need a forged crank if all you are going to do is drive it... the added CI will give torque on the cheap.
And that build won't kill MPG. It will be bigger, but not all that hotter.
It's like this: Would you rather have a high strung 400hp 350, or a milder 400hp 383?
The ZZ4 is available from any number of GM Performance Parts vendors. The street price is about $3500, USC.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 6,130
Likes: 2
From: seattle WA
Bogus, the compression test is difficult at best, and the gas test is quick and easy, I still like the compression test..which again localizes the problem, and IF I'm concerned about a head..then that head goes in for testing.
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Team Owner
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 40,156
Likes: 45
From: San Pedro CA
my thinking is like this... run the gas test...use that to confirm that combustion is entering the cooling system. if it's a weapy intake gasket, it will go out, but nothing will come in.
I agree, if there are gasses in the combustion, then check with a compression test - starting at #8.
I agree, if there are gasses in the combustion, then check with a compression test - starting at #8.
Thread Starter
Safety Car
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 4,723
Likes: 11
From: Winnipeg Manitoba, Canada
Thanks for the help guys. I'll run the tests this weekend and let you all know what happens. It looks like I have some thinking to do.
Last edited by jimmers; Aug 3, 2006 at 03:23 PM.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 9,036
Likes: 13
From: Edmonton AB
Please read the thread below, it is one of dozens dealing with
head gaskets but it stands out because of the pictures and
discussion. It also mentions the p/n for the Lisle Combustion
Gas Tester.
Take particular note of the comments about the head gaskets.
I am sure you only want to do this once.
Also, take note of the erosion that occurs on the head. If yours
suffer from the condition, then there is no point putting the heads
back on withoout having them repaired. This may entail surfacing
or both welding and surfacing them.
Thar she blows! Its official, head gasket gone 89A4
Another test for coolant is to have the oil analyzed. However, as
I have discovered, this test can be inconclusive - some oil contains
additives that register as possible coolant contamination. I am
currently in the midst of establishing whether my car suffers early
onset of gasket trouble or just weird oil additives.
.
head gaskets but it stands out because of the pictures and
discussion. It also mentions the p/n for the Lisle Combustion
Gas Tester.
Take particular note of the comments about the head gaskets.
I am sure you only want to do this once.
Also, take note of the erosion that occurs on the head. If yours
suffer from the condition, then there is no point putting the heads
back on withoout having them repaired. This may entail surfacing
or both welding and surfacing them.
Thar she blows! Its official, head gasket gone 89A4
Another test for coolant is to have the oil analyzed. However, as
I have discovered, this test can be inconclusive - some oil contains
additives that register as possible coolant contamination. I am
currently in the midst of establishing whether my car suffers early
onset of gasket trouble or just weird oil additives.
.
Team Owner
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 40,156
Likes: 45
From: San Pedro CA
it's quite simple. it tests the coolant for presense of combustion gasses.
What I don't remember is if it requires the engine to be running or not. It might also vary from test kit to test kit...
What I don't remember is if it requires the engine to be running or not. It might also vary from test kit to test kit...
Racer
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 286
Likes: 0
From: Alpine California
Originally Posted by Slalom4me
Another test for coolant is to have the oil analyzed. However, as
I have discovered, this test can be inconclusive - some oil contains
additives that register as possible coolant contamination. I am
currently in the midst of establishing whether my car suffers early
onset of gasket trouble or just weird oil additives.
The FelPro 1010 gaskets have repeatedly been associated with
head gasket failures. Read this thread w/ pics for some examples
Might have signs of blown head gasket now
The FelPro 1003 is said to be a better choice - remarks about mods
for it are in the thread above.
.
I have discovered, this test can be inconclusive - some oil contains
additives that register as possible coolant contamination. I am
currently in the midst of establishing whether my car suffers early
onset of gasket trouble or just weird oil additives.
The FelPro 1010 gaskets have repeatedly been associated with
head gasket failures. Read this thread w/ pics for some examples
Might have signs of blown head gasket now
The FelPro 1003 is said to be a better choice - remarks about mods
for it are in the thread above.
.
#2. Da#n it! Now I have to go home and see which head gaskets came in my kit!
Last edited by Blownfuel1; Aug 3, 2006 at 06:49 PM.
Thread Starter
Safety Car
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 4,723
Likes: 11
From: Winnipeg Manitoba, Canada
Originally Posted by Slalom4me
Please read the thread below, it is one of dozens dealing with
head gaskets but it stands out because of the pictures and
discussion. It also mentions the p/n for the Lisle Combustion
Gas Tester.
Take particular note of the comments about the head gaskets.
I am sure you only want to do this once.
Also, take note of the erosion that occurs on the head. If yours
suffer from the condition, then there is no point putting the heads
back on withoout having them repaired. This may entail surfacing
or both welding and surfacing them.
Thar she blows! Its official, head gasket gone 89A4
Another test for coolant is to have the oil analyzed. However, as
I have discovered, this test can be inconclusive - some oil contains
additives that register as possible coolant contamination. I am
currently in the midst of establishing whether my car suffers early
onset of gasket trouble or just weird oil additives.
.
head gaskets but it stands out because of the pictures and
discussion. It also mentions the p/n for the Lisle Combustion
Gas Tester.
Take particular note of the comments about the head gaskets.
I am sure you only want to do this once.
Also, take note of the erosion that occurs on the head. If yours
suffer from the condition, then there is no point putting the heads
back on withoout having them repaired. This may entail surfacing
or both welding and surfacing them.
Thar she blows! Its official, head gasket gone 89A4
Another test for coolant is to have the oil analyzed. However, as
I have discovered, this test can be inconclusive - some oil contains
additives that register as possible coolant contamination. I am
currently in the midst of establishing whether my car suffers early
onset of gasket trouble or just weird oil additives.
.
Thread Starter
Safety Car
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 4,723
Likes: 11
From: Winnipeg Manitoba, Canada
Well surprisingly I got my combustion tester tonight. I just did the test and there are gases in the coolant 
. I did the test twice just to be sure, but somthing is definitely leaking. 
. I did the test twice just to be sure, but somthing is definitely leaking.
Race Director
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 10,691
Likes: 71
From: Phoenix Arizona
You'll probably find you just have one bad cyl, but change BOTH headgaskets or you'll be back next week doing the other. As long as the engine runs good and there is no obvious antifreeze in the oil, the head gaskets along with checking for cracks and surfacing should put you back in the pink!
Le Mans Master
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 9,036
Likes: 13
From: Edmonton AB
Originally Posted by Blownfuel1
#1. Easy solution (as long as they're not charging you too much to analyze
your samples), just send in a new sample of whatever oil you're running
to be analyzed as well. If it's the additive package, the new oil will
test positive for coolant, too.
your samples), just send in a new sample of whatever oil you're running
to be analyzed as well. If it's the additive package, the new oil will
test positive for coolant, too.
In the following thread, member MSR drew my attention to the high
sodium in recent tests of Mobil products. He mentioned drawbacks
to relying on the laboratory's 'New Oil' values.
Ever wonder about oil analysis
However, after due diligence, it still appears as though there is
abnormal Sodium & Boron in used oil which is not present in new oil.
.
Team Owner
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 40,156
Likes: 45
From: San Pedro CA
Originally Posted by jimmers
Well surprisingly I got my combustion tester tonight. I just did the test and there are gases in the coolant . I did the test twice just to be sure, but somthing is definitely leaking.
. I did the test twice just to be sure, but somthing is definitely leaking. don't drive it and start tearing into it.
Racer
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 286
Likes: 0
From: Alpine California
[QUOTE=Blownfuel1#2. Da#n it! Now I have to go home and see which head gaskets came in my kit![/QUOTE]
So I went home and looked at the kit, the kit # ended in PT 9, but the # on the gaskets ended in PT 2. Are these the correct ones? Kinda Paranoid about this now, went ahead and ordered a set of ARP head bolts as well.
So I went home and looked at the kit, the kit # ended in PT 9, but the # on the gaskets ended in PT 2. Are these the correct ones? Kinda Paranoid about this now, went ahead and ordered a set of ARP head bolts as well.