Houston, we have a problem!!!
Thread Starter
Safety Car
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 3,525
Likes: 2
From: Houston TX
I finally got back to this project. All the silicon hoses (black color) and new SS T-bolt clamps came in this week, so I should be able to take it for a drive with the new system this weekend. I have kept it driveable with the old Spearco, but hopefully the old IC goes away after this weekend.
BTW, I was able to speak to both a Mustang owner and LS1 owner that were in the 900WHP and 780WHP area respectively with no heat exchanger, just xxOH injection. They have been doing it for several years with purpose built cars. So... my "street car" should have no issue with running for a bit w/out the IC.
Aaron
BTW, I was able to speak to both a Mustang owner and LS1 owner that were in the 900WHP and 780WHP area respectively with no heat exchanger, just xxOH injection. They have been doing it for several years with purpose built cars. So... my "street car" should have no issue with running for a bit w/out the IC.
Aaron
Thread Starter
Safety Car
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 3,525
Likes: 2
From: Houston TX
Finished the alcohol injection. Did some tuning this evening prior to taking it to the semi-annual vette show at 1960/I45 Hooters tomorrow AM. Good news / bad news. 
Bad news
I have the alcohol set to come on at 4 psi and full tilt by 15. (The highest I had seen since the change was 12 psi at 5250RPM. Well, the IATs still rise very quickly. They will go up to 195 - 210°F, and this was this evening at 64°F. I will see if I can post up the datalogs tomorrow.
Good news
This thing pulls like a raped ape. I saw 15.0 psi at 5400 on one run and 14.6 psi at 5100 on another run. Keep in mind that my previous runs on the dyno in late July were with 7.3 psi at 5200RPM, and 10.3 psi at 6400 RPM. The max RPM I took it to was 5400 (mentioned above), as I was doing all of my tuning in 3rd/4th gear runs. It is tough to see at night and handle the car, while hoping there are no cops around on the feeder roads.
Any one tuned their alcohol to come on at 2 psi and all in by say 8 psi so that you get max cooling affect throughount the run?
And on a side note, this is with the 6rib factory serpentine. I have had the cog drive off for the last ~8 months, due to some issue with abuse on the head unit. Who says you can't make big boost with a 6 rib.
Aaron
Bad news
I have the alcohol set to come on at 4 psi and full tilt by 15. (The highest I had seen since the change was 12 psi at 5250RPM. Well, the IATs still rise very quickly. They will go up to 195 - 210°F, and this was this evening at 64°F. I will see if I can post up the datalogs tomorrow.
Good news
This thing pulls like a raped ape. I saw 15.0 psi at 5400 on one run and 14.6 psi at 5100 on another run. Keep in mind that my previous runs on the dyno in late July were with 7.3 psi at 5200RPM, and 10.3 psi at 6400 RPM. The max RPM I took it to was 5400 (mentioned above), as I was doing all of my tuning in 3rd/4th gear runs. It is tough to see at night and handle the car, while hoping there are no cops around on the feeder roads.
Any one tuned their alcohol to come on at 2 psi and all in by say 8 psi so that you get max cooling affect throughount the run?
And on a side note, this is with the 6rib factory serpentine. I have had the cog drive off for the last ~8 months, due to some issue with abuse on the head unit. Who says you can't make big boost with a 6 rib.
Aaron
Thread Starter
Safety Car
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 3,525
Likes: 2
From: Houston TX
Pics of the install.
I mounted the controller directly off of the two screws that hold the spark knock module. Minimal wiring required. Basically power from inside, and another lead inside to run to the indicator LED. You can also see the "bung" added to the windshield washer tank (it holds just over 3/4 of a gallon of mix). And seems to work as a windshield washer cleaner as well. In the runs I made last night, the level dropped 4".
The pump is mounted inside the ground effect. I have my MSD in the driver's ground effect, so I thought this was appropriate. Withe everything installed, nothing is visible except the topside to the control box (but you would have to be looking for this).
This is the finished topside. The nozzles have been cut down, but still retain their QDs.
All in all, the system turned out nice, with minimal additional weight added to the car.
Aaron
I mounted the controller directly off of the two screws that hold the spark knock module. Minimal wiring required. Basically power from inside, and another lead inside to run to the indicator LED. You can also see the "bung" added to the windshield washer tank (it holds just over 3/4 of a gallon of mix). And seems to work as a windshield washer cleaner as well. In the runs I made last night, the level dropped 4".
The pump is mounted inside the ground effect. I have my MSD in the driver's ground effect, so I thought this was appropriate. Withe everything installed, nothing is visible except the topside to the control box (but you would have to be looking for this).
This is the finished topside. The nozzles have been cut down, but still retain their QDs.
All in all, the system turned out nice, with minimal additional weight added to the car.
Aaron
Last edited by AKS Racing; Oct 29, 2006 at 10:20 AM.
Racer
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 420
Likes: 1
From: Zolton NJ
Nice job. I am sure several people on this forum are monitoring your results. There are at least a few that would like to ditch the air to air heat exchanger. Thanks for the information, both the good and the bad. Are you planning to install some kind of safety to keep you out of boost if you should run out of methanol? 
Burning Brakes
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 904
Likes: 36
From: Santa Cruz CA
Comparison.
Looking at the huge money costs and fabrication time to put a bigger intercooler in my car for the D1, since they say the factory P600b intercooler becomes a cork at 550hp I was very interested in an alternative that would allow me to skip gutting the front of the car and running tubes everwhere.
The two names I have heard are Blowerworks and Snow Performance. I looked at the manual/catalog thing from Blowerworks and it is impressively complete with a lot of different options and different kits. I like that tank that goes behind the rear bumper but that kind of drives the price way up.
How does the Snow Performance stuff compare to the Blowerworks stuff? I know they both seem to have full computer control and all that and I would like to just use my XFI to trigger it since it already monitors, MAP and IAT and such and has extra channels to control accessories. So what is the difference and which is the best? Blowerworks seems to have been doing it since 1970 but if you picked Snow there must be a good reason. I would love to dump my air/air intercooler and the damn hoses and connections and crap. My car will never go over 14 PSI, but I only run on 91 octane pump gas too. Never gets over 90 here or under 50 so pretty mild weather wise. Thanks for any information.
Oh, yeah, and what about that old problem I remember people talking about with water injection washing down the cylinder walls and basically taking all the oil film off and ruining rings and cylinder surfaces? I remember from back in the 80's people talking about that as a reason not to run it for more than very small bursts so you couldn't really replace a intercooler full time with it. What has changed?
The two names I have heard are Blowerworks and Snow Performance. I looked at the manual/catalog thing from Blowerworks and it is impressively complete with a lot of different options and different kits. I like that tank that goes behind the rear bumper but that kind of drives the price way up.
How does the Snow Performance stuff compare to the Blowerworks stuff? I know they both seem to have full computer control and all that and I would like to just use my XFI to trigger it since it already monitors, MAP and IAT and such and has extra channels to control accessories. So what is the difference and which is the best? Blowerworks seems to have been doing it since 1970 but if you picked Snow there must be a good reason. I would love to dump my air/air intercooler and the damn hoses and connections and crap. My car will never go over 14 PSI, but I only run on 91 octane pump gas too. Never gets over 90 here or under 50 so pretty mild weather wise. Thanks for any information.
Oh, yeah, and what about that old problem I remember people talking about with water injection washing down the cylinder walls and basically taking all the oil film off and ruining rings and cylinder surfaces? I remember from back in the 80's people talking about that as a reason not to run it for more than very small bursts so you couldn't really replace a intercooler full time with it. What has changed?
Last edited by Jaxian; Nov 7, 2006 at 07:37 PM.
Thread Starter
Safety Car
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 3,525
Likes: 2
From: Houston TX
Paul,
I will start by saying that BW does an awesome job with their xxOH injection and basically all of Greg's support for the vette community. Greg is a great guy.
However, when I started down this path, it was a temporary trial to see if xxOH injection was all folks on this board (and other boards) claimed that it was. My thought was that I am a ChE by degree, and as such latent heat of vaporization, fuel blends, evaporation rates, and resonance time should be right up my alley. I did not really expect to have a high level of success with the xxOH injection effort. I figured I would be going back to FMIC in short order. But, as I tried last winter, I wanted to see what removing the IC/piping restriction would do to the boost.
Therefore, price (and ultimately re-selling price, obviously at a loss) was a big factor for me as well as simplicity of install (and the resultant removal). I wound up buying the SP system, and have been very happy with the simplicity and cost. It works without all of the bells and whistles. It is kind of like the rest of the car just simple and fairly bullet proof.
If I were going to do it again, I might buy a nicer kit; now that I know it will work in a high boost, high HP application. Who would've thought....
Aaron
p.s. I would caution you on statements such as "car will never go over 14 PSI". You might be surprised as to how much restriction all of the ATI piping and IC may provide.
I will start by saying that BW does an awesome job with their xxOH injection and basically all of Greg's support for the vette community. Greg is a great guy.
However, when I started down this path, it was a temporary trial to see if xxOH injection was all folks on this board (and other boards) claimed that it was. My thought was that I am a ChE by degree, and as such latent heat of vaporization, fuel blends, evaporation rates, and resonance time should be right up my alley. I did not really expect to have a high level of success with the xxOH injection effort. I figured I would be going back to FMIC in short order. But, as I tried last winter, I wanted to see what removing the IC/piping restriction would do to the boost.
Therefore, price (and ultimately re-selling price, obviously at a loss) was a big factor for me as well as simplicity of install (and the resultant removal). I wound up buying the SP system, and have been very happy with the simplicity and cost. It works without all of the bells and whistles. It is kind of like the rest of the car just simple and fairly bullet proof.
If I were going to do it again, I might buy a nicer kit; now that I know it will work in a high boost, high HP application. Who would've thought....
Aaron
p.s. I would caution you on statements such as "car will never go over 14 PSI". You might be surprised as to how much restriction all of the ATI piping and IC may provide.
