I have a motor being built now and am planning to go nitrous on it. The motor is a 383 being built with a high CR of 11.4:1 but I did what I could to build the motor for it. I used a Scat Forged Crank, Scat Forged Rods, and SRP Forged Pistons. I am using 4 bolt splayed mains and Billet caps. The Dart Heads were Swain coated in the chambers, valves, exhaust ports and I coated the Pistons as well. I'm using a thin Metal Cometic gasket at .027 thickness to reduce blown head gaskets. And the whole motor is being built with ARP hardware by TPiS and Dyno tuned as well.
I have been modding cars for 18 years and am a graduate of LTI's Automotive program so I have a very good knowledge base to draw from. But this is my first experience using Nitrous.
When I do a project I research first, decide what I want, and buy EVERYTHING I will need to do the project once and do it right.....the first time. I want to build this setup with the maximum amount of detail spent on safety components. I have a handle on some stuff.
I definetly want an RPM Window switch, and a full throttle switch. I'm definetly going to use a remote bottle opener and I'm not sure about a bottle warmer yet? Is it worth it?
Where I really get lost is in the Programable controllers. Basically I want to go with 2 stages, but I don't always want to use the 2nd stage, have it selectable, but mostly what I want is to be able to control the % of Nitrous flowing to maximize traction and at the same time minimze the inital hit the crank takes by bringing it in slowly, almost like boost from a turbo. But some seem to have switches I want, some don't, basically I'm really lost, I have been looking at stuff like these
http://store.summitracing.com/partde...5&autoview=sku

http://store.summitracing.com/partde...5&autoview=sku
and this one
http://store.summitracing.com/partde...5&autoview=sku
I'm not sure what I want?
Also do I want to go with a dry setup and an FRP? Which brand should I go with? What size bottle for a 383? Where should I install the jets?
Any and all comments and opinions are not only welcome they are encouraged guys. I'm looking to really learn the "Correct" way to do this, I don't care about the money, I care about reliability. No matter how much the setup costs, if it saves a motor from exploding it's still saved me thousands of dollars!
Thanks Guys

 

None of the links produced anything on my computer.
I have found the failure of nitrous are the solenoids.
You can run up a 250 shot with your motor.If you want to go fast a 150 to 175 shot if the motor is what you have written will be no problem.
I would only use a wet kit .The reason I say wet is you seem to want a lot of power when you call on it and wet will perform better that a dry kit.
Yes a blanket /heater is mandatory.
I would forget the programmer,just set your switches in the dash and flick it on when you want.
The bigger shot the more nitrous you will have to carry seven 10 second blasts on a 100 shot is normal.Turbo ,supercharger,nitrous all operate the same ,you need to retard timing 1 1/2 degrees for every 50 shot.
The MSD 6AL box is one of the easiest to work with .
I am not saying use the cheaper units ,just the one you feel most user frendly.I will never use NX ever again ,their system cost me a car.
I use the Barry Grant and NOS system and the Zex's plate .The jets come with the system and don't worry about any of that stuff.
You will need a presure regulator and on your car it is hard to get to it on a regular bassis.
I don't change jets ,I just lower the fuel presure or raise it to get the car to go faster,or increase the temp on the bottle.
I would go to a search engine and type in nitrous info and their are alot of info.

 

I fixed the links now. I want the controller because once it's programmed correctly not only is it easier to drive, but it is significantly more consistent. Plus I think almost all controllers will adjust the timing and Fuel Psi based on how it is programmed.

 

All the controllers function by pulsing the solenoids, which is super hard on the noids. I used a Jacobs controller for a long time and really liked it, but I was going through a set of solenoids every 2 months.

If you truly want to be able to ramp the system up, google search 'pulseoids' or 'pulsoids.' They are a different type of solenoid designed to pulse open and closed. A friend of mine has a complete system from www.noswizard.com. They aren't a US based company, but all their **** is top notch. His kit is so adjustable it's sickening, he can bring in any amount of nitrous he wants based on anything. What gear he's in, what his current MPH is, RPM, time delay, what color the sky is, if his socks match, etc...

If you want the trickest N20 system out there, check them out.

Honestly though, for a new N20 guy like you, just dual stage it. Two, 75 HP shots for a total of 150. Then play with it from there.

Edit: Damn this is awesome, check out this controller:

http://www.noswizard.com/product_inf...&products_id=3

It's the only controller I have ever seen with a feature built into it where you can pedal the throttle and still retain the correct nitrous activation. It's sweet as hell, and if I was made of money, I'd have one in a heartbeat.

 

Here is more info on the FJO controller, a state of the art controller I might add. Please consider buying from a site sponsor, as Summit or NOSWizard are not paying sponsors. Let me know if I can answer any questions. I might add that the NOS Wizard is big time anti American products and takes every chance he gets to rank us down.
Nitrous Direct/NX FJO
Here's a link for other Nitrous Direct controllers,
Nitrous Direct Controllers
Robert

 

NX and FJO offer all the options you describe. The NOSwizards stuf is based on the little **** pots from Europe. They have been around a while and you wonder why nobody runs that stuff. Yes, they have some good ideas, but there is a lot of bull also. Do your research on these products and you see what time it is. I have some links if you would like?
Robert

 

Easy killer, simmer down. I wasn't trying to drum up business for them, or take away business from anyone here. If you've got some legit links de-bunking the claims on the site, post em' up. Gotta be more in there than just calling them names like **** pot though.

No one here fears factual information. Sometimes the other sections get bogged down with polite protocol, and the real tech suffers, but the forced induction/nitrous section is thankfully free of that. You'll need to do better than just calling them names though, bring the tech man!

 

You don't think the average 4 banger European car is a **** pot?
Their kits were designed for little cars, not American muscle. They have named themselves Wizards of NOS, like a slap in the face to NOS, also have stated many times that wish to take down NX. They have absolutely nothing good to say about American Nitrous company. If you doubt my word and think they are so great, go visit the wizards of Nos web site. Here's a link you might find interesting.
Wizards of NOS Thread
If you want to support an anti American company, so be it.
Robert

 

Lol, right on man.

Look, if you don't like the companies attitude toward the US, that's great. Let's leave your opinion of ethical practices out of it and just discuss some technical aspects of the products. Do you have any technical reason for not using their products? I'm not trying to promote them, or fight with you, but posting a link to name calling thread on ls1tech is pointless. There's a thread on www.nloc.com with over 200 replies praising the company. Know what though, it's just 200 opinions from key board warriors who have never used their stuff. In all 200 replies, only the thread starter had actually used their stuff. On ls1tech, you've got a load of responses from key board warriors jumping on your hate band wagon. No one on ls1tech has actually used the products, or has any tech what so ever to back up the hate.

If the products are bad, let us know! If you don't like the company based on an Internet perception of their attitude towards the US, I don't really see that as a valid reason not to use their stuff.

 

One more thing I should add, one of the main reasons I want a Ramp Up Controller is that so anyone I'm racing will not realize I'm running Nitrous. When your neck and neck and then 1 of the cars suddenly pulls 6 cars it's a little obvious, if it ramps up it will not be AS obvious. And I'm looking to go with a 150 1st stage and a 150 2nd stage. But most of all I want ease of use, and programability, so I can basically arm the system and I can concentrate on driving and it will do everything else, everything.

 

Any of the controllers you mentioned should work well for you. I prefer the Jacobs controller, but that's probably because it's the only one I've actually used.

Just a word of advice, take it with a grain of salt, but you might want to get your feet wet a bit with some smaller shots, single stage, and no controller first. Just pull some timing and install a basic 100 HP shot and go from there. That's how I started, and now I have:

-Dual stage 75's for a total of 150.
-I used a WOT style toggle switch mounted inside the console to control the second stage. I built a bracket that bolts to the shifter bolts and hold the switch so that the shifter handle hits the switch when I shift into second. That way, I launch on a 75 HP shot, and grab another 75 from second gear on.
-For awhile I ran the Jacobs controller, and you are right the controllers can bring the power on so smooth you wouldn't even know the car had nitrous. However, I was chewing through solenoids at the rate of 1 N20 noid about every 2 months. The pulsing is pretty hard on the noids. I finally sold the controller and built the dual stage system because of it.

I started out with a basic, 100 HP single stage, and slowly added things until it was exactly what I wanted it to be. If you plan to do the install yourself, the wiring aspect of it can be kind of overwhelming at first, so that's why I think you might want to start with something a little more simplistic than a dual stage system with a progressive controller.

Good luck, let us know what you decide to do!

 

I'm not doing the install, I actually am planning on having TPiS set it up on the motor and set up the controller programming and having it in use when they dyno tune the motor. My tech at my local shop will do the remaining part of the setup that has to be done and they have lots of experience at this.
Solenoid failure is not acceptable to me, so I'll do whatever I need to do to get what I want. I am a huge patriot and would prefer to buy an American product, but if the US product is inferior and will continually fail then it's not a possibility for me. I believe that reliabilty on a 7/24/365 scale is MANDITORY as power with reliability is pointless. What is the point of a 600HP car that you are affraid to drive because it may break down.
I was really hoping for Robert65 to give a direct answer as to the validy of neats claims of soleniod failure, and if a a forum sponsor could supply a product that will operate correctly. I would prefer to deal with a forum sponsor to be honest, I love this place and such a deal would be good for me, good for them and good for the board. But I need to know that the parts would work in a way that I desire at a 100% reliable rate. I hate the Anti-US crowd and would hate to put money in their pocket, but if they are the only company that offers a system with these 'pulseoids' or 'pulsoids.' that neat described, if they are in fact what I need then they will unfortunately get the sale.

 

I rechecked your links,Works !!
I have the NOS system and I don't think that would be a good system for what you want to do .The NOS is easy to use and set up but it doesn't have the finenite adjustments you will need to run the system the way you want.The NOs ramp up system is just reseting the dial to a different number of seconds and it doesn't or cant be adjusted on the fly.
I think the Jacobs will do pretty much what you want.
I have worked with the jacobs but I have never owned one.
Once they are set you can change it easy and even with a light throttle you can control the amount of nitrous in the engine,with the nos system you set it and push down on the outside of the **** and reset it,not hard but kinda of primitave compaired to the jacobs.
You know how I feel about NX

 

if you are expecting 100% reliability, you are in the wrong hobby. especially at the kind of power levels you are talking about. a 300 shot is a serious shot, and takes it's toll on an engine. at those kinds of levels, you almost have to consider your rings to be a wear item, just like brakes or something.

how much hp will your motor produce without the gas? i'm guessing maybe 500? so a 300 shot is adding about 60% to the output.

i think the best advice given on this thread so far was to start slow... go with a single stage, 100hp shot first and learn how to use it. see how it feels. even a 175 shot is a sweet sweet ride, and your engine hopefully will live a lot longer at those kinds of levels.

if you want to see a video of what a 175 shot does check out this link. and keep in mind that this is in 5th gear at about 3000 rpm... and you can still easily tell when the nos kicks in.
http://media.putfile.com/maton-mile-186mph

good luck with whatever you decide.

sonny

 

Of the different controllers you’ve listed the Jacobs is the best unit, however as others have mentioned pulsing solenoids on and off to controller the output of power is not the most reliable thing to do. Pulsing an electrical item on and off is going to shorten its life span REGARDLESS of where the solenoid is manufactured. This is why you normally will not find these types of systems in Racecars. In a race application we’ll set the nitrous up so that you can be as aggressive as possible without breaking traction. Controlling bottle temperature and pressure is going to be as important if not more so to your consistency than anything else.

 

I actually couldn't tell when the Nitrous hits I was expecting something significantly more violent, if thats what an average 175 will do I'll need more.
See I had a car stolen in 2001, it was a 92 Mustang that was insanely worked that was dynoed shortly before it was stolen with 753 RWHP and 851 FtLbs of torque, I had over 70k into the car, had a 393 with a Vortech T trim making 28 lbs of boost, it was an animal. The Vette needs to exceed the Stang. See no matter how nice the Vette is, in my mind it's still less of a car than the Stang and always will be till it's faster.
The motor will make about 490 HP running NA, so it's going to need quite a shot! I really wanted to go with a large single turbo, like a T80 but it's WAY to custom a job, not too mention the heat issues! I never imagined in my wildest dreams that I would have trouble making a Corvette as fast as a Mustang
Are pulsoids manufactured differently to cycle without the problems inherrent in a solenoid? The amount of squeeze I'm going to run is way past the traction limits even with 315 DR's so I will need some type of ramp up controller to simulate a build like a turbo..............
I was planning on a bottle heater and a 20lb bottle will that we sufficent?

 

I have 702 hp in my 86 and it is not in the least streetable .
The trans will not hold and the rear end
Even with a spool it sucks.
I ran 2 10 lb bottles in mine before the noids failed and blew off the fromt end.
Yes you have to have a blanket.

 

I'm planning on using a T56 and having it upgraded by D&D, if memory stands correct they rate the prepped T56 at 900 ftlbs so the trans should be OK. I'm planning on Upgraded Half Shafts and cryo treated gears for the Dana 44 from Randy's Ring and Pinion(the carrier can't be upgraded so I'll just hope)
The ramp up style hit on the NOS will also help prevent a SUDDEN shock on the motor & drivetrain which is normally responsible for most breakage of parts. We'll see.