To pull or not to pull?
Safety Car
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 4,344
Likes: 48
From: San Marcos CA
... I guess money does play a part. But the bigger decision right now is...... If I'm going to pull the motor and do a complete rebuild I feel like then im planning on keeping this car for awhile. VS, replacing cam lifters etc if I'm only keeping the car for a year or two. ...
Le Mans Master
Joined: Feb 1999
Posts: 6,470
Likes: 2
From: levittown pa. usa Even a bad day with my `Vette, is better than a good day at work
St. Jude Donor '10
You are totally right on the money with this.
If your pulling the motor and the car already has 100k on it, once the motor is on the stand you might as well have the bores cleaned up, new rings, new bearings, new cam, lifters, have the heads checked ect.
It adds up quick and gets expensive. You will however be far better off in the long run then simply tossing another set of lifters and a cam in it (while its in the car no less).
If your pulling the motor and the car already has 100k on it, once the motor is on the stand you might as well have the bores cleaned up, new rings, new bearings, new cam, lifters, have the heads checked ect.
It adds up quick and gets expensive. You will however be far better off in the long run then simply tossing another set of lifters and a cam in it (while its in the car no less).
Instructor
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 134
Likes: 0
From: new albany mississippi
You almost HAVE to pull the motor for as much work is involved with an in-car cam swap, right? And...
I'd be scared to do all that work and have a new cam and lifter set fail from a little chunk of the old ones floating around in there. Not to mention what it could be doing throughout the engine.
If things look good when you get it apart (clean and within tolerences), you could "freshen it up" with rings, bearings, oil pump, and that new cam and lifters you're already in it for. Might get out of it with just a light hone to seat the new rings.
I'm optomistic.
Be patient and frugal.
Keep us posted, please. And good luck!
I'd be scared to do all that work and have a new cam and lifter set fail from a little chunk of the old ones floating around in there. Not to mention what it could be doing throughout the engine.
If things look good when you get it apart (clean and within tolerences), you could "freshen it up" with rings, bearings, oil pump, and that new cam and lifters you're already in it for. Might get out of it with just a light hone to seat the new rings.
I'm optomistic.
Be patient and frugal.
Keep us posted, please. And good luck!
Le Mans Master
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 5,139
Likes: 482
From: H-Town Texas
Opti cap and rotor=$200
Rockers=$600
Studs=$50
Lifters=$110
Dyno tune=$500
Showing a C5 Z06 your C4 tail lights pulling away=Priceless
Le Mans Master
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 5,866
Likes: 60
From: Hellinois
Finalist 2020 C4 of the Year - Modified
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 492
Likes: 0
From: Minnesota
love it! But a hot cam is going to put ahead of a ZO6? I guess seriously, how hp are you talking a LT4 puts out with a hotcam. And is ther a better cam than a LT4 hotcam?
Le Mans Master
Joined: Feb 2000
Posts: 9,715
Likes: 27
From: Kempner Texas
Jake
My son, Ryan M. Cameron, graduated from West Point on 22 May 2010! He was commissioned as a 2nd Lieutenant and I pinned on his first pair of "Butter Bars" PROUDEST DAY OF MY LIFE!!
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Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 492
Likes: 0
From: Minnesota
Starting to get my hands around this, some more questions. Is a electric water pump worth it? What type of hp am i going to get from the hot cam? Any machine work besides the basics that is worth it? Porting worth it(how much$$)?
Advanced
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 66
Likes: 0
From: NJ
Lifters
I say if you want to get by for the summer. Inspect ALL the lifters, check the cam lobes and ONLY replace the ones that are bad. New lifters and old cams sometimes do not break in properly. Use Molybendum break in grease. Change oil after breakin. Save your money and rebuild in the winter.
Race Director
Joined: Apr 2000
Posts: 15,344
Likes: 4,008
From: Texas
The electric water pump frees up 5-7 hp.
Unless you plan to keep the car for a long time (then 383
) and assuming it wasn't burning oil...- I'd pull the engine and strip it to the short block
- Inspect the cam bearings and if they look good...
- replace the cam & lifters
- new timing chain
- pull the #1 main cap and peek at the crank
- have the cylinder heads cleaned up/inspected and then do some light pocket porting and port match the intake side to the GM "7777" LT4 intake gasket
- Port the intake runners to match the "7777" gasket
- custom tune
reassemble and reinstall
If the bearings look bad or it smokes, then it's time for a more complete rebuild (= $$$)
You can do the above for ~$2,500-$3,000, with most of that due to gasket and cylinder head work.
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 492
Likes: 0
From: Minnesota
With light clean-up and porting of the cylinder heads, HOT Cam, electric water pump, and catback exhaust my engine made 363rwhp (dynojet).
The electric water pump frees up 5-7 hp.
Unless you plan to keep the car for a long time (then 383) and assuming it wasn't burning oil...
- I'd pull the engine and strip it to the short block
- Inspect the cam bearings and if they look good...
- replace the cam & lifters
- new timing chain
- pull the #1 main cap and peek at the crank
- have the cylinder heads cleaned up/inspected and then do some light pocket porting and port match the intake side to the GM "7777" LT4 intake gasket
- Port the intake runners to match the "7777" gasket
- custom tune
reassemble and reinstall
If the bearings look bad or it smokes, then it's time for a more complete rebuild (= $$$)
You can do the above for ~$2,500-$3,000, with most of that due to gasket and cylinder head work.
The electric water pump frees up 5-7 hp.
Unless you plan to keep the car for a long time (then 383
) and assuming it wasn't burning oil...- I'd pull the engine and strip it to the short block
- Inspect the cam bearings and if they look good...
- replace the cam & lifters
- new timing chain
- pull the #1 main cap and peek at the crank
- have the cylinder heads cleaned up/inspected and then do some light pocket porting and port match the intake side to the GM "7777" LT4 intake gasket
- Port the intake runners to match the "7777" gasket
- custom tune
reassemble and reinstall
If the bearings look bad or it smokes, then it's time for a more complete rebuild (= $$$)
You can do the above for ~$2,500-$3,000, with most of that due to gasket and cylinder head work.
.
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 492
Likes: 0
From: Minnesota
Kinda trivial but the main reason im not excited about pulling the motor is because of having to deal with the bellhousing/tranny again
. replaced the clutch last year and became frustrated with trying to get to some bolts. But, welcome to the world of working on small high tec sports cars. Not like working on my tri 5s!
. replaced the clutch last year and became frustrated with trying to get to some bolts. But, welcome to the world of working on small high tec sports cars. Not like working on my tri 5s!
Last edited by Huntervangolf; Jun 9, 2010 at 10:38 AM.
Safety Car
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 3,651
Likes: 10
From: Apple Valley MN
The tranny bolts are pretty easy, and you don't have to unbolt the bellhousing to pull the engine. Last year I spun a rod bearing on my LT4 with about 46K on it. I pulled the engine myself, then took it to a shop that disassembled and inspected it, ground the crank, installed all new bearings and oil pump and timing chain, checked the heads for warpage, and reassembled it (my rings were fine and cylinders looked great) - I also bought a HotCam and had them install it. Cost me about $1600 in their parts and labor, plus a couple hundred for the cam, plus incidentals like hoist rental, etc.
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 492
Likes: 0
From: Minnesota
With light clean-up and porting of the cylinder heads, HOT Cam, electric water pump, and catback exhaust my engine made 363rwhp (dynojet).
The electric water pump frees up 5-7 hp.
Unless you plan to keep the car for a long time (then 383) and assuming it wasn't burning oil...
- I'd pull the engine and strip it to the short block
- Inspect the cam bearings and if they look good...
- replace the cam & lifters
- new timing chain
- pull the #1 main cap and peek at the crank
- have the cylinder heads cleaned up/inspected and then do some light pocket porting and port match the intake side to the GM "7777" LT4 intake gasket
- Port the intake runners to match the "7777" gasket
- custom tune
reassemble and reinstall
If the bearings look bad or it smokes, then it's time for a more complete rebuild (= $$$)
You can do the above for ~$2,500-$3,000, with most of that due to gasket and cylinder head work.
The electric water pump frees up 5-7 hp.
Unless you plan to keep the car for a long time (then 383
) and assuming it wasn't burning oil...- I'd pull the engine and strip it to the short block
- Inspect the cam bearings and if they look good...
- replace the cam & lifters
- new timing chain
- pull the #1 main cap and peek at the crank
- have the cylinder heads cleaned up/inspected and then do some light pocket porting and port match the intake side to the GM "7777" LT4 intake gasket
- Port the intake runners to match the "7777" gasket
- custom tune
reassemble and reinstall
If the bearings look bad or it smokes, then it's time for a more complete rebuild (= $$$)
You can do the above for ~$2,500-$3,000, with most of that due to gasket and cylinder head work.
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 492
Likes: 0
From: Minnesota
The tranny bolts are pretty easy, and you don't have to unbolt the bellhousing to pull the engine. Last year I spun a rod bearing on my LT4 with about 46K on it. I pulled the engine myself, then took it to a shop that disassembled and inspected it, ground the crank, installed all new bearings and oil pump and timing chain, checked the heads for warpage, and reassembled it (my rings were fine and cylinders looked great) - I also bought a HotCam and had them install it. Cost me about $1600 in their parts and labor, plus a couple hundred for the cam, plus incidentals like hoist rental, etc.
Race Director
Joined: Apr 2000
Posts: 15,344
Likes: 4,008
From: Texas
From a crank hp perspective it's in the 425 - 430 range.
