as u all have noticed i spent the last few days bashing the half-wit and incompetent motor builders in the industry (sorry my nerves are shot after 7.)..seldome a week goes buy without another cf member telling of a nightmerish build or a failure of some sort...why dont we have a builder that cimes in on issues..just post anything about building any part of a motor and get 50 contradicting answers....there has got to be someone out there who has been around long enuf to cut through all the bs and give us the right answer...the going answer is spend more money!!! but i have found building engines that cost from 30 grand to 3 grand they all fail the same.. give me some thoughts on what we can do to find/invite a decent builder to be a member and give us good advice.... thanks,
george

 

..... There are dozens of engine builders on this site daily ... what would you like to know ? ... When someone experiences multiple failures perhaps he needs to look in the mirror to discover the common element ... engines are complicated , but not ... the high-buck builds are usually built with the best parts and have a high degree of reliability built in ... this costs money ... but if the engine is abused whether through its use or by operator error , its life expectancy will be greatly diminished ..........

 

I've heard great things about Pete K's motors, and he's in PA

I had a bad experience with a builder and decided I'm going crate. Problem is finding a trustworthy builder that knows what he's doing.

 

Last time a builder started a thread on how he machined the engine block many people started with their "I do it this way".

If you search, you will find few threads on many members that did their build up. All those members' threads were extremely helpful for my LT4 build up. I got to say that after reading and analyzing all of them at the end they were almost identical (different parts and goals). I sent lots of PMs to them and they always lend me a hand.

My LT4 was a PITA, I wanted to squeeze every horse power possible and keep it California SMOG legal and it passed.

Id like to say thank you to all of you once again!!!

 

Engine building is not rocket science it is common sense. I have never been an engine builder per se but I do have a couple of them out there running well. One was my own 800 horse 468 with Crower mechanical injection. I also have a blown Pontiac and a blown 440 Chrysler that are doing well,( the Pontiac was a bitch) Actually I lost contact with the Mopar but the last I heard it was running 10's on Sportsman (M/T) tires.
I had one engine let go in my drag racing days, had an oil screen fall out of the pump, it let go going through the lights at 8000 rpm! Gawd what a mess that was.
Anyway enough about my engines. Quality parts is number one, a complete balancing of all rotating parts, and a super clean environment are necessary along with meticulous care to detail, if it ain't right don't think it'll be okay because it won't. Make it right even if the engine has to come apart again.
I won't even make any assumptions regarding your setup but from I have read in your posts about various sensors etc. being omitted and a made up harness, I am wondering if there is something there that would give you grief. I'm just asking to bring the subject up,,, I don't know.

 

beleive me i have looked in the mirror and found the out.
1.some builders know how to make drag racing engines that run for 20 sec max..
2 after taking advice from several reputable engine builders found out later that advice to be bulls***
3 the more money you spend the bigger peice of S*** u get.
the best of my motors were the cheapest
4 a builder cant give you a price or warrenty because they cant build decent engines. if a builder had confidence in his ability experience and quality of parts he used why on earth wouldnt he warrenty his product..even for racing.....if a part fails its ure fault not mine get better parts...especially when the builder pics them with an open checkbook... the it hapens some times line doesnt float with me any more. buy the way that why buisness owners have liability insurance...buy it use it!!!! thell tell u if i warrentied my prouduct i would go out of buisness bingo get out!!!
5 act like a professional have an aproved tunner that u recomend and work with!!!! the its his fault and finger pointing between engine builders and tunners is absolutely (i cant even think of a word that describes my frustration)
6 if you dont know find out..
7 if you cant do it find someone that can
8 looking in the mirror i see if i treated my buisness like most engine builders treat theres i would be out of buisness 10 years ago




im looking for talking about a guy that builds engines all day every day.[/B] and when a contradiction is offered he can say thats wrong and heres why.... im in now way pointing this stuff at you personaly just your industry..and what im looking for in an engine builder...

 

If you're looking for an engine builder who will warranty a race engine,,,,, good luck.

 

exactly my point YOU did all the thinking not your builder lets find someone that know this stuff himself

 

why in the world not!!!! theu have liability ins that covers crap like this give me one good reason why they cant

 

Because they can't control what the buyer of the engine is going to do to it. You have to admit there's a lot of strange people with strange ideas.

 

there going to put it in a car and race it with a rev limiter. a radiator,oilcoller and anything else recomended but the builder

do you know of anyone who ever went out with the intention of blowing up??? it all part or componet failure..or incompentence....

 

we used to get into good old barn ratteling dibates like this back in the old days here on cf it calms my nerves!!!

 

Then let 'er rip, but your making a nervous wreck out of me.

 

The best engine builder in the world for You is YOURSELF.

In the past I paid to have engines built.

They failed.

I taught myself & had guidance from an old time mechanic back home & became best friends.
He is gone now.
His lessons taught to me I share with everyone here on C4 nightly.

If you want to pay some one from the group on C4,

TPI 421 Jim would be my only choice.

I love building my own motors.

You can learn also..............You are ready to after 7 engines letting go.

Took me just 2 engines letting go paying others in Chi town area to decide to build my own.

Brian

 

An engine builder can only control the parts and clearances he builds the motors with. The tuning of a motor has a lot to do with whether the motor survives. The builder can't and shouldn't warranty a motor that has run too lean or had too much timing resulting in detonation, a holded piston or a holed block. If he builds a 7000 rpm safe motor should he be responsible if a driver catches 1st instead of 3rd while downshifting and revs it up to 9000 rpm? No builder can afford a Lloyds of London insurance policy for every motor he builds.

 

Truth.

 

im afraid you both are right... i think thats why in racing the 2nd or 3rd generation guys do so well they ve had lifetimes to cut through the bull.....loyds of london not needed a million dollar policy costs hundreds not thousands....atleast in building but i imagine we have higher coladeral damage issues.. if my guy fixes a 5 dollar electric switch and it burns down a 500,000 dollar house its covered..(thankfully never had to use it )

 

exactly why they should recomend or work with a tuner or tunners.. its and industry flaw and a big one.......

 

I know You are an Avid Road Racer in your C4.
Just how fast do run down the straight away(s) ?
Over 140 MPH ?

All left hand turns ?

Or a mix of sweeping left & right hand turns that are over 400 feet in length ?

With sticky racing slicks,
A C4 should be able to corner well over 1 g or even 1.3 G's.

That would be enough G force to uncover the oil pickup screen.
Long sweeping high speed turns will easily uncover the pickup screen & allow air to be sucked in then.
Even 1 million dollars $$$$ spent,
the engine would still blow up then.
No oil to the main & rod bearings for several seconds while the engine is screaming away from 5K to 8K+ RPM's.

Its an expensive upgrade>>> dry sump oil system.
Sure you know that allready.
Swinging oil pickup tubes & trap doors in oil pans for road racing are GIMICKY to me.
They don't work in roundy- round dirt track late model cars- wet sump oil systems.
At best they maybe corner .95 g's.
Can't see it working too well in a road race prepped C4 that corners over 1G easily.

Brian

 

your a geat guy and have helped me alot but read the second and third line of you post why do you think they failed abuse buy you ??? or incompetence of another builder?????. is tpi 421 jim a buisness we could send guys too????