One-to-Four grinding?
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 1,315
Likes: 15
From: Richmond Virginia
One-to-Four grinding?
When I decide to use the skip-shift light on my 1993 6-speed, when I go to shift to fourth, I have to push the **** as far as I can to the right, while pulling it down into fourth or else the gears grind (similar to when you try to put the car into gear without pressing the clutch).
I recently drove my grandfather's C5 6-speed for a week, and it was sooo much easier. All I had to do was just pull it down into 4th like I would normally. This is how I'd imagine that the skip-shift is supposed to feel, but I just thought it was normal until I drove that C5. I know that the ZF and Berg Warner are different transmissions, but are the skip-shifts in the ZF really that bad?
Thanks
-Jay
I recently drove my grandfather's C5 6-speed for a week, and it was sooo much easier. All I had to do was just pull it down into 4th like I would normally. This is how I'd imagine that the skip-shift is supposed to feel, but I just thought it was normal until I drove that C5. I know that the ZF and Berg Warner are different transmissions, but are the skip-shifts in the ZF really that bad?
Thanks
-Jay
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 1,315
Likes: 15
From: Richmond Virginia
Every gear shift not under the skip-shift is fine. The slave cylinder went out on me in June, and I had that replaced. I'm not sure when the trans fluid was last changed. Would bad fluid be a factor as to why it's grinding? The car only has 61,000 miles. I know I should be due for a fluid change soon.
Melting Slicks
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 2,075
Likes: 109
From: Longmont Co
If you can "decide" to use the light (I assume you are deciding to shift straight to 4th, like the light says to) then skip-to-4th has been eliminated. If you push the **** all the way to the right, aren't you going into 6th? What happens when you go 1st to 4th and the light isn't on?
Race Director
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 10,036
Likes: 346
From: Anaheim CA
The usual cause of a grind on a shift is that the clutch isn't disengaging completely.
That could be because you're not going down far enough on the clutch pedal or the hydraulics have a problem (air?). The mechanical parts of the clutch linkage could be worn.
That could be because you're not going down far enough on the clutch pedal or the hydraulics have a problem (air?). The mechanical parts of the clutch linkage could be worn.
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 1,315
Likes: 15
From: Richmond Virginia
If you can "decide" to use the light (I assume you are deciding to shift straight to 4th, like the light says to) then skip-to-4th has been eliminated. If you push the **** all the way to the right, aren't you going into 6th? What happens when you go 1st to 4th and the light isn't on?
No, whenever I shift, I push the clutch completely down to the floorboard. Would the stock clutch already be going out at 60,000 miles?
Melting Slicks
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 2,075
Likes: 109
From: Longmont Co
No. I mean that I can't pull the gear **** straight down, say as I would if I were to shift into second. In order for the skip shift not to grind, I have to physically push the gear **** over to the right, while it is still in first, and then go into fourth while still applying the pressure to right (so pulling down and pushing right at the same time). I don't mean going into 6th gear. The grinding occurs before the gear **** comes out of first, like say if someone were to yank the **** out of first without pushing in the clutch.
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 1,315
Likes: 15
From: Richmond Virginia
Not being able to shift straight down from 1st when the light is on means the 1to4 system is still active. That is how it is designed. If your grandfathers didn't do that, he has installed a bypass system (most people have). I'm still not real clear on what you are doing. When the light is on, you should depress the clutch, pull the shifter straight down into neutral (not pushing right while still in 1st), slide over to the 3-4 slot, and pull down into 4th. If you are pushing to the right when it is still in gear it will grind.
I don't mean pulling down as going into second, I mean pulling straight down into neutral, and then going into second. I have to apply physically push the **** to the right as I'm pulling it down.
I'm obviously not able to properly describe what's going on in word form. Once I get my car back from the shop later this week (window motor broke, so the window is stuck halfway down), I'll make a video and put it on YouTube.
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Burning Brakes
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 1,094
Likes: 68
From: Providence RI
You should not be able to shift from first to second when the one to four light is lit. This will cause the grinding you describe. The CAGS solenoid in the transmission actually prevents you from going into second, but you can grind if you force it. One to Four does not make the transmission go into 4th gear regardless of where you shift to, you have to go into fourth gear manually like any other manual transmission. I think you are over thinking how this system works.
When one to four is lit, pull down out of first, over to the middle/neutral area, then down into fourth. This should not cause any noise or be difficult. If you are using this motion, and it grinds when going into fourth, you have an issue. Hydraulic, transmission, something.
The CAGS eliminator could easily fix your problems. It is not a waste of time or money, because its free if you just disconnect it, but can cost around 20 if you buy the kit so you do not have open weather pack connectors which are prone to get wet, dirty, etc. It is much easier to disconnect it and see if your transmission still acts up rather than try to rev to 2100 or start in second, something i do not recommend unless you want to put a clutch in it.
Hope this helps.
Mike
When one to four is lit, pull down out of first, over to the middle/neutral area, then down into fourth. This should not cause any noise or be difficult. If you are using this motion, and it grinds when going into fourth, you have an issue. Hydraulic, transmission, something.
The CAGS eliminator could easily fix your problems. It is not a waste of time or money, because its free if you just disconnect it, but can cost around 20 if you buy the kit so you do not have open weather pack connectors which are prone to get wet, dirty, etc. It is much easier to disconnect it and see if your transmission still acts up rather than try to rev to 2100 or start in second, something i do not recommend unless you want to put a clutch in it.
Hope this helps.
Mike
Last edited by Deepa; Sep 16, 2012 at 03:05 PM.
Melting Slicks
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 2,075
Likes: 109
From: Longmont Co
Sorry, I still don't get what you mean. When the light is on, you should be able to pull straight down from 1st to neutral, then you need to slide over to the 3-4 slot, then straight down to 4th. If you can't do this then you have a problem.
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 1,315
Likes: 15
From: Richmond Virginia
When one to four is lit, pull down out of first, over to the middle/neutral area, then down into fourth. This should not cause any noise or be difficult. If you are using this motion, and it grinds when going into fourth, you have an issue. Hydraulic, transmission, something.
I know how to use the system, it's not that hard. Light comes on, push in clutch, shift to fourth. It's grinding before I can even pull it out of First.
Melting Slicks
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 2,075
Likes: 109
From: Longmont Co
I will say this again, I AM NOT TRYING TO SHIFT INTO SECOND. It is grinding while the gear **** is still "up" in first gear. It grinds before I can get it out of First before I can even get it into neutral.
I know how to use the system, it's not that hard. Light comes on, push in clutch, shift to fourth. It's grinding before I can even pull it out of First.
I know how to use the system, it's not that hard. Light comes on, push in clutch, shift to fourth. It's grinding before I can even pull it out of First.
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 1,315
Likes: 15
From: Richmond Virginia
Thanks for all the help guys!
Le Mans Master
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You don't have to by-pass it, you can just unplug it and get the same effect. That is what I did on my '90.
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 1,315
Likes: 15
From: Richmond Virginia
Yeah I've heard of people doing that. I've also heard a bit on getting dirt and road grime in the plug and causing the check engine light to come on. Also, I've heard that just unplugging it can cause codes to show up also even with the plug covered up. I haven't heard any problems with the skip-shift eliminator though. I'll feel better if I just go with my gut feeling and get it. It's only $12 at the shop near my house.
Melting Slicks
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 2,075
Likes: 109
From: Longmont Co
Oh, there is something wrong with it, it shouldn't do that. But if it only happens when the 1to4 is engaged, a bypass should be a cheap easy fix.
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 1,315
Likes: 15
From: Richmond Virginia
I plan to get that eliminator soon!
