Tuner Suggestions?
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 3,374
Likes: 86
From: Corbin KY
Tuner Suggestions?
I want to do some mods to the Z06 however it seems getting a hold of somebody to talk to about getting some work done has proven to be harder than it should be. I have called numerous Tuners on numerous occasions to get pricing and suggestion (different cams) however 9 out of 10 times I get a answering machine and the times I leave call back information I never get a call back?? I am looking at doing a Cam and heads package OR possibly a STS turbo setup however at this point I have not been able to get any information or pricing on either.
I find it really hard to believe that it is this difficult to find a company willing to take my money. I have been looking at places that are in numerous States far away from me however I am a little scared to even consider sending my car hundreds of miles away IF I can never get a hold of the place.
I am looking for suggestions on shops that I may have overlooked that are willing to answer the phone when I call and give me pricing on a couple different combinations.
I find it really hard to believe that it is this difficult to find a company willing to take my money. I have been looking at places that are in numerous States far away from me however I am a little scared to even consider sending my car hundreds of miles away IF I can never get a hold of the place.
I am looking for suggestions on shops that I may have overlooked that are willing to answer the phone when I call and give me pricing on a couple different combinations.
Intermediate
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 26
Likes: 0
Consider doing it yourself. If you are using the factory PCM, you will need a laptop or notebook computer, purchase TunerCats to reflash and DataMaster to log operational data to determine what needs changing. Consider an Innovate wide band O2 setup if you need to punish yourself with data overload.
My search for a tuner revealed the average chassis dyno cell operator is some variation of a racer owned business trying to capitalize on their dubious claims of competition achievements. ANY one trick pony can tune for max power, few, if any, can grasp drivability, emissions, or fuel consumption issues.
Several years ago after accumulating another 200,000 miles on my restomod C1, I too tried to locate a tuner to improve my rebuilt LT4's low rpm drivability after I changed cam (238-242 degrees, .587 lift) heads (AFR 195) and intake (Edelbrock LT4 Airgap) pistons (10.8 cr) and displacement (396 cu in). Drove 100+ miles to a Corvette only chassis dyno specialist in Maryland who proceeded to charge $650 and who promptly improved NOTHING, but claimed he picked up 15 horsepower at 6,000 rpm. BFD -- he made no drivability improvements and was immodest enough to try waving shiny objects as distraction from his failures, bragging he could tune spark timing in tenth of a degree increments. Yeah, as I later discovered, the software allows anybody to change timing in very small increments, but I doubt any measurement method could discern any resulting change, certainly not your default seat-of-the-pants accelerometer. The icing on the cake was he installed a second PCV valve, myopically overlooking the stock one already in place. Fortunately for my side, this was sufficient operator stupidity for the shop owner to refund my money.
Next I tried a well known tuner in the Detroit area. He fiddled and flashed, but no real improvement, but he did manage to identify a sluggish right bank O2 sensor that helped the idle quality.
One thing I learned looking over the shoulders of these two tuners is they both were using TunerCats and the chassis dyno cell operator used DataMaster and a tailpipe wideband O2 sensor. Don't get me started telling you of a third tuner, also in the Detroit area. According to his website, this former GM engineer and washed up drag racer held 10 US patents, was a multiple time NHRA class winner, and had branch offices in major cities worldwide. Turns out this puffed up bloviator was connected to at most 3 patents as a co-applicant on behalf of General Motors who was the actual patent holder. The worldwide branch offices were friends still working for GM.
If you can read, you can teach yourself to use any tuning/datalogging software. All that is needed is self-motivation to go do it. This wisdom came to me from John Lingenfelter when I visited his shop before his death.
BTW, just this morning I located and purchased a Chinese clone of GM's Tech 2 for $350 plus shipping. Compared to a US vendor selling the exact same item-for-item hard case enclosed Tech 2 for $4,400, the only difference between the two was the $3,900 acquisition cost savings.
My search for a tuner revealed the average chassis dyno cell operator is some variation of a racer owned business trying to capitalize on their dubious claims of competition achievements. ANY one trick pony can tune for max power, few, if any, can grasp drivability, emissions, or fuel consumption issues.
Several years ago after accumulating another 200,000 miles on my restomod C1, I too tried to locate a tuner to improve my rebuilt LT4's low rpm drivability after I changed cam (238-242 degrees, .587 lift) heads (AFR 195) and intake (Edelbrock LT4 Airgap) pistons (10.8 cr) and displacement (396 cu in). Drove 100+ miles to a Corvette only chassis dyno specialist in Maryland who proceeded to charge $650 and who promptly improved NOTHING, but claimed he picked up 15 horsepower at 6,000 rpm. BFD -- he made no drivability improvements and was immodest enough to try waving shiny objects as distraction from his failures, bragging he could tune spark timing in tenth of a degree increments. Yeah, as I later discovered, the software allows anybody to change timing in very small increments, but I doubt any measurement method could discern any resulting change, certainly not your default seat-of-the-pants accelerometer. The icing on the cake was he installed a second PCV valve, myopically overlooking the stock one already in place. Fortunately for my side, this was sufficient operator stupidity for the shop owner to refund my money.
Next I tried a well known tuner in the Detroit area. He fiddled and flashed, but no real improvement, but he did manage to identify a sluggish right bank O2 sensor that helped the idle quality.
One thing I learned looking over the shoulders of these two tuners is they both were using TunerCats and the chassis dyno cell operator used DataMaster and a tailpipe wideband O2 sensor. Don't get me started telling you of a third tuner, also in the Detroit area. According to his website, this former GM engineer and washed up drag racer held 10 US patents, was a multiple time NHRA class winner, and had branch offices in major cities worldwide. Turns out this puffed up bloviator was connected to at most 3 patents as a co-applicant on behalf of General Motors who was the actual patent holder. The worldwide branch offices were friends still working for GM.
If you can read, you can teach yourself to use any tuning/datalogging software. All that is needed is self-motivation to go do it. This wisdom came to me from John Lingenfelter when I visited his shop before his death.
BTW, just this morning I located and purchased a Chinese clone of GM's Tech 2 for $350 plus shipping. Compared to a US vendor selling the exact same item-for-item hard case enclosed Tech 2 for $4,400, the only difference between the two was the $3,900 acquisition cost savings.
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 3,374
Likes: 86
From: Corbin KY
Mutt
I have played around with tuning in my old Grand National days however I really do not want or have time to do the work to this car. I researched numerous tuners that do mechanical work along with the tuning and found a few that had good reviews and happy customers. Some of these are NOT cheap however I am willing to pay good money for good service BUT if I have to make numerous calls and do not receive call backs just to get them to do the work and for me to agree to pay thousands of dollars I do not have a good feeling (Remember the Hennessey shop ripping off all the Viper owners?) about sending them my car.
If I am unable to find a shop to do the work, I will look real hard at the STS kit or a Supercharger and maybe consider doing it myself.
I have played around with tuning in my old Grand National days however I really do not want or have time to do the work to this car. I researched numerous tuners that do mechanical work along with the tuning and found a few that had good reviews and happy customers. Some of these are NOT cheap however I am willing to pay good money for good service BUT if I have to make numerous calls and do not receive call backs just to get them to do the work and for me to agree to pay thousands of dollars I do not have a good feeling (Remember the Hennessey shop ripping off all the Viper owners?) about sending them my car.
If I am unable to find a shop to do the work, I will look real hard at the STS kit or a Supercharger and maybe consider doing it myself.
Racer
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 277
Likes: 60
From: Whitehall Pennsylvania
Hello,
Just to chime in, I had a good experience with PCM for Less. One shop is in N.C and the other is in Ohio. I ordered (from their website in N.C.) a custom order PROM chip for my 1993 383 stroker 6speed car.
The results are day and night (for drivability and performance).
They even examined a data log that I e-mailed to them. I had a bad passenger side 02 sensor and PCM for Less did the troubleshooting for me.
The car is 100% spot on compared to the Prom chip that it came with when I purchased it. Check them out in STOW, OHIO.
If you have any more questions, shoot me a PM.
Later...
Just to chime in, I had a good experience with PCM for Less. One shop is in N.C and the other is in Ohio. I ordered (from their website in N.C.) a custom order PROM chip for my 1993 383 stroker 6speed car.
The results are day and night (for drivability and performance).
They even examined a data log that I e-mailed to them. I had a bad passenger side 02 sensor and PCM for Less did the troubleshooting for me.
The car is 100% spot on compared to the Prom chip that it came with when I purchased it. Check them out in STOW, OHIO.
If you have any more questions, shoot me a PM.
Later...
Advanced
Joined: Apr 2012
Posts: 52
Likes: 0
From: Salt Lake City Utah
SCCA,
Collectively you have some good feedback. I have a highly modified 93 C4. (see signature line) PCMforless has tuned it pretty well. I am going to send them some more data and I am confident they will nail the tune. PCMforless is great in my opinion. You will need a TTS datamaster or another program that can gather data for them. You will need a AUDL1 and cable1 to connect your laptop to the ALDL port in your vette. Here is a link to MOATES where you can buy it. http://www.moates.net/aldu1-and-cabl....html?cPath=64 It is compatible with the following programs TunerPro RT, TTS Datamaster, TunerCat reflash for LT1, WinALDL, and EFI Live V4(OBD1). I also sent them a copy of my A/F ratio per RPM print out from a dyno session I had. I had an STS rear Turbo on a 95 trans am I had. It was great (700hp) and PCMforless tuned that via mail order. I don't see a C4 having the room to run the piping for an STS set up. I believe pro charger has a bolt on kit for our C4's. Good luck with your project. I hope this helps.
Collectively you have some good feedback. I have a highly modified 93 C4. (see signature line) PCMforless has tuned it pretty well. I am going to send them some more data and I am confident they will nail the tune. PCMforless is great in my opinion. You will need a TTS datamaster or another program that can gather data for them. You will need a AUDL1 and cable1 to connect your laptop to the ALDL port in your vette. Here is a link to MOATES where you can buy it. http://www.moates.net/aldu1-and-cabl....html?cPath=64 It is compatible with the following programs TunerPro RT, TTS Datamaster, TunerCat reflash for LT1, WinALDL, and EFI Live V4(OBD1). I also sent them a copy of my A/F ratio per RPM print out from a dyno session I had. I had an STS rear Turbo on a 95 trans am I had. It was great (700hp) and PCMforless tuned that via mail order. I don't see a C4 having the room to run the piping for an STS set up. I believe pro charger has a bolt on kit for our C4's. Good luck with your project. I hope this helps.
Drifting
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 1,592
Likes: 6
From: Cresson TX
I want to do some mods to the Z06 however it seems getting a hold of somebody to talk to about getting some work done has proven to be harder than it should be. I have called numerous Tuners on numerous occasions to get pricing and suggestion (different cams) however 9 out of 10 times I get a answering machine and the times I leave call back information I never get a call back?? I am looking at doing a Cam and heads package OR possibly a STS turbo setup however at this point I have not been able to get any information or pricing on either.
I find it really hard to believe that it is this difficult to find a company willing to take my money. I have been looking at places that are in numerous States far away from me however I am a little scared to even consider sending my car hundreds of miles away IF I can never get a hold of the place.
I am looking for suggestions on shops that I may have overlooked that are willing to answer the phone when I call and give me pricing on a couple different combinations.
I find it really hard to believe that it is this difficult to find a company willing to take my money. I have been looking at places that are in numerous States far away from me however I am a little scared to even consider sending my car hundreds of miles away IF I can never get a hold of the place.
I am looking for suggestions on shops that I may have overlooked that are willing to answer the phone when I call and give me pricing on a couple different combinations.
Cheers,
