This has been an ongoing problem since end of last summer and it's driving me crazy...

When I try to start the car in the morning after it has sat out all night and the temp outside is less than 60F, it takes forever to start the car, I'm talking like 5-10 minutes of just turning over, wait, turn over, wait and starting to start but dying then finally it starts and all is good.

After it does this and the car sits outside all day at work (about 10 hours) it starts right up, but it seems to start too easy, not even a full second to catch.

If it is warmer than 60F outside in the morning it has no problem and starts normal, about 2 seconds to catch.

I'm lost... :crazy: Any help from you guys, as always, is greatly appreciated.

 

Sounds like your cold start injector is not working. First check that the connector on the wiring harness is indeed plugged in to the injector. The cold start injector operated by the ECM only works below a certain temp and the ECM reads the coolant temp from the sensor under the TB on the front of the block. Check to make sure the connector on the harness is also plugged in to the sensor.

 

89 was the first year CSV was removed.

 

:cry I was hoping JFB's suggestion was the answer :cry

 

Do your coolant temperature sendors work correctly? If they are malfunctioning and not telling the ECM when the coolant is 99* or less, then your ECM won't go into cold start mode.

 

Not sure, what is the procedure to test them. I know the temp guage seems to be reading normal when I'm driving but I'm not positive. In the morning it goes form LO to 100 in a couple of minutes during warmup.

 

Sounds like they're operating fine.

 

The temp sender for the gauge and the sender for the ECM are SEPERATE. the Gauge sender is on the Pass Cylinder head, the ECM sender is on the front of the intake.

You should check the ECM for any codes that could point you in the correct direction


[Modified by -=Jeff=-, 2:41 PM 8/6/2002]

 

Extremely good point, why do I always forget this? For example in Diacom you see the ECM reading, yet the dash reads a few degrees differently.

 

No codes, (just that damn 33 that comes everyday). Is there a way to actually test the two senders themselves?

 

If anyone in your area has Diacom you could monitor the ecm coolant temp sensor.

 

OK,

Do you have the C68 electronic control for the A/C system. If you do, you can access what the systems thinks your coolant temp is. Not sure if that software goes that low. You can do the ECT temperature with a descent scanner. Usually very close to ambient on start up.

The Engine Coolant Temp Sensor (CTS) is a good place to start. After draining some coolant, you can remove the sensor, and check the resistance and compare with the ambient temperature/resistance chart in the service manual. The Chiltons manual also has the chart, around page 4-22. As the coolant temperature increases the resistance decreases. When the ECM sees high resistance, it thinks it's cold outside and pulses the injectors longer during start up. A digitial choke kind of. That code 33 may be contributing to the problem. The afternoon starts would seem to suggest it doesn't but pretty sure the look up tables may use MAP when determing pulse width, even on start up. Will see if I can find that out.

Or, you can just spend around $12 bucks at GM, throw on a new CTS and see what happens.

You could also check to see if there is secondary spark.

dlmeyers 90 coupe zf6 3 speed shocks

 

Thanks, I'll give this a shot and post the results. :cheers:

 

It is a whole lot easier to find a scanner and have a look at what the ECM is seeing from the sensor. This will only take a couple minutes, versus the disassy. and test time. Generally the sensor failure is Open or Shorted,... both will set ECM codes.

Something else to consider,..... Do you have fuel pressure when cold. i.e. Do you hear the pump spin up when you turn the key ON, not running.

There is an alt circuit that powers the fuel pump. The circuit comes alive when there is enough OIL pressure. i.e. Long cranking time.

 

Even on cars that have Cold Start Injectors, it was totally independant of the ECM. Has a Thermo-Time Switch that closes for a period based on temp that energizes the Cold Start Injector. No ECM involvement.