Hey guys, I have an 89 vette, automatic, and my problem is that when I stick the key in and turn it to start the car, sometimes it will turn over just fine and at other times it will turn over but its as if the battery is completely dead. If I wiggle the hell out of the key when I stick it in and turn it, sometimes it will turn over fine and sometimes it wont. Not sure if I need a new ignition lock cylinder or a new ignition switch. I bought a new ignition switch since its the cheaper of the 2 but finding a good pictorial and instructions on how to replace it has been a challenge. Any advice/help would be appreciated. -Tammy

 

Well if you bought the electrical aspect that mounts at the lower column I believe there are additional diagnostics that you need to do before maybe just replacing BUT since it's already purchased maybe use it anyway. If you can wiggle/shake key and make work, it might be assumed that the problem is either in the upper portion of the column in the rack/rod & pinion OR maybe actually the cylinder. You can normally confirm those issues if you can manually move the rod in the column to engage the switch and it works more frequently. It could be as simple as an adjustment of the switch on the column. Look at your newly purchased switch and you should see elongated mounting slots. Those are intended for adjustment.

I'm headed out the door and I can't offer more right now but will later.

 

Does security light work and is it on?

 

Listen to WVZR-1, he helped me get my ignition problem straightened out on my 89 a few years ago...One thing that does happen on these older cars is the thin vats wires on the lock cylinder break and cause intermitent operation,or no operation....This was one of my problems, the wires were broken almost completely off.....WW

 

OP/Tammy - reading your post it's difficult to sort out exactly what you mean. When it CRANKS it starts? Sometimes when you rotate the key to START it does NOT crank? If when you turn it to START and it does NOT immediately crank there's certainly a multitude of potential issues. If it's difficult to rotate to CRANK/START and a wiggle/jiggle frees it to get to CRANK/START then it's a mechanical issue that's possibly the cylinder, the rack/rod or plastic pinion in the upper column OR a simple adjustment like I mentioned in the earlier post.

Do you have two keys that work in the ignition? Does the same condition happen regardless of which key is used?

The small gear and the toothed rack in this image are potential mechanical failures at the top of the column. The pinion is in the center and the rack on the right.



The parts are only serviced in that package and an older column could likely use the bearings anyway but if you don't need/it's NOT the failure there's no need to buy.

The "security light" if it's on occasionally and is "always on" when you have the cranking issue isn't to be assumed to be a key cylinder failure but it's one of the possibilities.

There's a couple of ways to do a diagnostic for a VATS failure.

First - how many keys do you have?

 

That sounds like a starter/solenoid issue.

 

Yes that's certainly one of her "potential" problems but until she returns and clarifies her original post it's difficult to help. The wiggle/jiggle of the key that she mentions is maybe the confusing portion. If the key rotates freely to "crank" and it cranks at times but at other times there's a "click/clunk" or nothing - solenoid? Maybe.

Something prompted her to think switch or cylinder to the point of purchase but that's not mentioned.

 

Yes it does. With no key in ignition and drivers door open, the security light blinks off and on at a constant steady rate. Shut the door and security light goes off.
With doors shut, I turn key to first position- no dash lights or information panel lights come on. When I try to crank it on over, the fan outside and inside kick on, the Service Engine Soon light comes on and stays lit, the Fasten Seat Belt light comes on and I hear 5 dings then it goes out, the little red battery icon light comes on and stays on, the Anti-lock light comes on then goes off in 1 second, the Low Coolant light comes on then goes off after 2 seconds, and the dash lights directly in front of driver do all light up but are dim. I recall always having an issue with my dash lights. Sometimes they would come on and sometimes they wouldnt.

 

I only have 1 key, and that "wiggling" of the key that I was doing before was not because of it being difficult to rotate. It turns just fine. It was really just a fluke that I discovered doing it would cause it to go ahead and crank over. I was mad and yelled a few obscenities and jiggled it out of frustration. I do need to tell ya though that for the past 4 days, I have jiggled the heck out of it and it hasent turned the engine over 1 time. You know how when your battery is dead and you try to start your car? That is exactly how it acts except, I have dash lights.

 

then test your battery and clean connections on it and the block behind it if it has one. you can have dash lights but not enough power to turn it over. and it's a good idea to get another key.

 

I have tested battery. Even took it to Autozone and had them check it for me. Checks out ok. Battery connections and cables are all clean.

 

Glad you mentioned that because I have taken the starter off and bench tested it. Also took it to Autozone and had them do a load test on it and it checks out fine.

 

I have taken the starter off and took it to Autozone. They checked out everything on it for me. Even put a load test on it and all checks out good. The reason I bought an ignition switch is because I thought maybe there was just a short or bad connection in the switch. I have not tore into my column just yet because from what Ive read, there are spring loaded parts in there and I can just see parts flying out at me and me not having a clue how they go back in. lol I dfont even know for sure if thats the problem or not yet.

 

I believe at this point it could be safe to assume you've a "key resistance" read failure because of either a bad key, the wires from the cylinder have broken or the contacts in the cylinder have failed. A Theft Deterrent Module is possible but very unlikely.

I would take your key to a local GM dealer parts dept and ask that they "drop" the key to check the resistance code. They've a box that accomplishes that. You could also if you have a digital multimeter read/check the value yourself OR ask a local shop to do it for you. If the dealer box doesn't read then the DMM read is important.




It would be important that the value fall between the MIN/MAX values somewhere in the chart. A value of something NOT in the MIN/MAX ranges of the chart would indicate a key failure, none of the values overlap.

That would be the NEXT check that costs nothing or very little. I wouldn't buy a new key just yet. Just see if you can establish a value.

If the GM box read the key you might consider buying an UNCUT key of the proper value and just inserting it into the cylinder, it should shut off the SECURITY light if it's a key failure, if it doesn't it might be considered then a failure of the cylinder or the wires. The key at the dealer is expensive, you might shop a local lock smith facility.

I don't see where you CONFIRM buying the electrical switch or the cylinder. Which?

If you bought a correct cylinder there are options for diagnostics.

 

mine was hit and miss I cleaned the block behind the battery and a new key. mine tested good but was worn. has worked perfect for the last eight years.
if it is a broken wire in the ign then it needs to come apart. but for $15 I would try the key first.

 

I had an intermittent no start and it was difficult to diagnose because it would start most of the time. My VATS is disabled in the chip but the VATS relay behind the dash is still in the circuit and was not always making contact. It has to be closed to enable the starter. Since I don't use VATS I bypassed the relay instead of replacing it.