A/C CONVERSION R-12 to R-134
Thread Starter
Safety Car
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 3,842
Likes: 230
From: SANTA CRUZ CA
Re: A/C CONVERSION R-12 to R-134 (85 Dave)
Thanks, 85 Dave. Was there a concern about leaks before you installed the conversion, if so, how did you check for leaks before, and after installation?
Drifting
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 1,726
Likes: 1
From: COCOA Florida
Re: A/C CONVERSION R-12 to R-134 (oldman)
If you have a system with at least 50 psig pressure in it you can use a spray bottle of water and liquid detergent (dish wash soap....strong ) and spray it on all the fittings and connections. if lots of bubbles come up then you have found a leak. don't forget to check around the clutch assembly for leaks.
Thread Starter
Safety Car
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 3,842
Likes: 230
From: SANTA CRUZ CA
Re: A/C CONVERSION R-12 to R-134 (oldman)
Thanks for the responses. The kit I just purchased includes a "sealant" that is supposed to renew the old seals. We shall soon find out. :cheers:
Melting Slicks
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 3,388
Likes: 1
From: X
Re: A/C CONVERSION R-12 to R-134 (oldman)
If I were you, I would suck it up and spend the extra cash for R-12. But if you insist... http://www.id-usa.com/default2.htm
Le Mans Master
Joined: Nov 1999
Posts: 8,512
Likes: 3
From: Memphis, Tn
Re: A/C CONVERSION R-12 to R-134 (oldman)
Thanks, 85 Dave. Was there a concern about leaks before you installed the conversion, if so, how did you check for leaks before, and after installation?
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Thread Starter
Safety Car
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 3,842
Likes: 230
From: SANTA CRUZ CA
Re: A/C CONVERSION R-12 to R-134 (JonM)
Thanks for the input, JonM. I have given the option considerable thought. My first consideration is the A/C is never used in my climate (on the coast of Monterey Bay). Lack of use probably dried out the seals allowing the R12 to escape. My vette doesn't move with the top "up". The only time I would use A/C would be on my few trips to the high desert of Reno, NV. I just returned from there, where the temp was in the mid-90s, and it was not comfortable with the top up or down, and no "air". R12, in this area, costs $60-$75/lb., and it is going to become more expensive as inventories are depleted. To have the system serviced, it is a $300 bill for a two pound system, including labor. (Back in the 1980s, when I had my fish-boat, the refrigeration system contained 15 pounds of R12, and freon was $2.00/lb. You never left port without a spare 30lb. can, as leaks were a common event, and not many fish buyers want "stinkin" fish.) So it comes down to $300 for a system that I rarely use, or $40 for a second rate system.
Thread Starter
Safety Car
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 3,842
Likes: 230
From: SANTA CRUZ CA
Re: A/C CONVERSION R-12 to R-134 (85 Dave)
I agree, 85 Dave. (See my response to JonM) JonM is correct in suggesting for me to stay with the R12, as it is a superior refrigerant. If I were younger, and used the A/C on a regular basis, I would keep the R12 system. At my age I don't even by green bananas.
Thanks to all for the responses!!!! :cheers:
Thanks to all for the responses!!!! :cheers:
Safety Car
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 4,286
Likes: 4
From: Guam
Re: A/C CONVERSION R-12 to R-134 (oldman)
I have to agree that R12 is superior. And it is still available. But it is not allowed to be used on newer vehicles. I have kept all my R12 vehicles unconverted. When you add refrigerant, make sure that you do not overcharge it.
:cheers:
:cheers:
Le Mans Master
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 7,839
Likes: 22
From: San Diego, Ca
Re: A/C CONVERSION R-12 to R-134 (oldman)
If you have the time and inclination, why not get licensed at http://www.epatest.com. and then buy all the R12 you need. This spring, Autozone started dumping it's R12 inventory at anywhere between $10 & $14 a can. Face it (as Autozone has), there isn't a real big demand for the stuff anymore and it doesn't have an infinite shelf life. (Once those cans and drums start rusting - watchout!) 4 cans would be plenty to evacuate & recharge your Vette (assuming you have a typical 2.25 lb capacity). Better though to fix whatever is leaking first, especially if it's the shaft seal. That just puts a bunch crud in the system and if you end up with enough of it, the type of refigerent you use will be the least of your problems.
Thread Starter
Safety Car
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 3,842
Likes: 230
From: SANTA CRUZ CA
Re: A/C CONVERSION R-12 to R-134 (oldman)
Thanks Sharky Guam and SunCr. I've just made a wonderful decision. I opened the hood, located my tools, and then asked myself: why am I doing this? It is going to be winter soon, and the vette won't be traveling very far in the next 5-6 months, so why bother? The kit went back to the store, the hood went down, and I am have a cold beer thinking of the very nice people you get to "meet" on the vette forum. :cheers: :cheers: :cheers: :cheers:
Racer
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 412
Likes: 0
From: corvallis or
Re: A/C CONVERSION R-12 to R-134 (SunCr)
I agree with Sun dont use the stuff with sealer in it your asking for more problems than good. As far as retrofit I have no problem with that. I do them all the time at work with out problems. My 84 puts out 38-40 deg air on the 100 degree ride home everyday with 134 in it. I converted because I installed an automatic adjusting orfice tube to improve slow speed cooling when the condensor has little to no airflow in stop and go trafiic.
Thread Starter
Safety Car
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 3,842
Likes: 230
From: SANTA CRUZ CA
Re: A/C CONVERSION R-12 to R-134 (jefft84)
Got it, jefft84, and thanks. I logged your profile contact numbers in my address book for future reference. You are a valuable source of info for the forum. :blueangel:
Le Mans Master
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 5,159
Likes: 1
From: Indiana
Re: A/C CONVERSION R-12 to R-134 (oldman)
According to this link, http://autorefrigerants.com/Envirotechnical.htm R-134A will ignite at 5.5 psi and 368 degrees. R-12 ignites at 1585 degrees F under the same pressure. That may be a consideration if you are converting a system that is known to have a bad leak and/or could have a catastrophic failure.
This site has a lot of different options for both R-12 and R-134 systems. Make your own decisions and use your best judgement.
Randy
This site has a lot of different options for both R-12 and R-134 systems. Make your own decisions and use your best judgement.
Randy
Instructor
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 126
Likes: 0
From: Nashua NH
Re: A/C CONVERSION R-12 to R-134 (oldman)
No need to convert anymore. There is a replacement for R-12 - R-406A. Patt Goss (Motor Week on Maryland Public TV) does not do conversions in his shop anymore but just loads the system with 406A. You have to change the fittings since each type of coolant has its own fittings. If you do convert to 134A you need to change the dryer and the orifice but Patt does not think it is worth it.
Thread Starter
Safety Car
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 3,842
Likes: 230
From: SANTA CRUZ CA
Re: A/C CONVERSION R-12 to R-134 (c4md)
Thank you, c4md. That is really useful info. I have yet to hear any of my A/C techs mention R-406A out here on the "left coast". I will inquire around tomorrow to see if "we" have received the latest refrigerant. Your info is much appreciated.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 7,839
Likes: 22
From: San Diego, Ca
Re: A/C CONVERSION R-12 to R-134 (oldman)
406A is 55% R22 - great for a fixed system like your home. Can leak like crazy without barrier hoses. It's also 4% isobutane and considered unacceptable by the EPA. Can you say KABOOM?