New Member and hood quality question
12-13-2016, 11:08 PM
#1
Advanced
Thread Starter
New Member and hood quality question
Hello All, I know there is a new member introduction thread, but since I also have a tech question, and I only plan on really posting in the C4 threads, I figured it would be a good place to introduce myself.
My name is Blake, I live on the Space Coast of Florida, and I am a certified auto-phile!
I became a corvette owner completely by accident. I was actually in the middle of restoring a 1985 monte carlo SS that I had done a 5.3 lm7 swap into, but as it is a G-body, the rust issues are getting the better of me. Plus as an initial cost saving measure, I hooked the LM7 up to the original TH2004r, which it torched in exactly 3 weeks of not even too abusive driving.
Meanwhile, one of my best friends purchased this amazingly unbeaten 1986 Dark Red Metallic a4 corvette. We cruised around in it for a few months, and enjoyed the stock tpi torque thoroughly. Then one day, as these things go when you purchase a 30 year old car, even though we had more records, and receipts, than there are pages in a History textbook, and the car was so clean you could eat off of it, about 6 months after he bought it, the flat tappet cam wiped out, the timing gear jumped, and basically he was left with a piece of garage art. We proceeded to rebuild it, doing all the wrong things, we bought some skip white nkb heads, used a custom ground loyd Elliot LTx cam I had from a previous LT4 Trans Am GT project, we used ebay no-name tie bar sbc lifters, we tried to grind down a plastic cam button we got from autozone, we used a timing gear setup for some other application, some c3 ramhorn headers (don't ask). Eventually we got the thing buttoned up, drove it around the block, and the ebay no-name tie bar lifters gave up the ghost, and gouged the cam again.
By This time I talked to my wife, I figured I could pick up the car for a steal, get it going properly this time, and flip it, and then use the proceeds from the flip to get the body work done on my Monte Carlo, and finish installing the 4L80e I picked up for it. She gave me the OK, and we picked it up.
I was able to pick this cherry ride up from him for a steal, and am going to do things correctly this time. I just purchased a complete matched valvetrain from one company
Specifications :
Cam Kit Brand
Howards Cams
Manufacturer’s Part #
CL110245-12
Cam Style
Hydraulic Roller
RPM Range
1800 - 5400
Intake Valve Lift
0.500
Exhaust Valve Lift
0.510
Advertised Intake Duration
278
Advertised Exhaust Duration
284
Intake Duration @ .050
225
Exhaust Duration @ .050
231
Lobe Separation (degrees)
112
Fair idle, Street & mild performance usage
Crisp throttle
It came with the retrofit roller cam, with retrofit roller lifters, and pushrods. It may seem like a mild cam for the heads, but more on that later).
I have a 4L80E that I had rebuilt that came out of a 454 3500 from 94 or so, which I have ready to go in, when the 700R4 inevitably dies. Grumpy's Stickies mentioned the Transmission center conversion tailshaft kit, but not only is that 4l80e into a c4 conversion kit no longer listed on their website, when I contacted them about the part and my application they told me they had no part matching that description and basically acted like I was crazy.
After some additional searching, I found a thread with PeteZR1, where he stated that he was also having a custom tailshaft machined, and his tailshaft wouldnt require the swapout of the output shaft that the transmission center kit required. That was the end of the trail though, and I couldn't find any other threads or pictures about this kit.
I reached out to him a couple of weeks ago, and apparently he made a run and still has a few left. I am seriously considering this route, however if anybody has any pictures, reviews, or experience with it, it would be much appreciated. Since he discussed it on a forum, I imagine some forum members must have purchased it, so any info on quality, fit and finish, and durability would be much appreciated.
Now comes the good stuff hahaha
I also have purchased two M21 armored personnel carrier manifolds that had the removable 3 bolt flange that sell cheaply on Ebay all the time. By grinding off the front manifold extension, these bad boys bolted straight up to the stock exhaust on the vette with no modification other than some yanking, banging, and cursing.
Now that they are on the car, and I have verified fitment and space concerns, my ultimate plan is to run a crossover pipe from the passenger side to the drivers side, and I have a whole bunch of different forms of 3 bolt/vband/t4 turbo mount flanges in a box that ive collected over the years, and I believe that I can run a single T4 turbo slightly off the drivers side manifold, basically as a Bolton.
I have had several conversations with Jeff Linfert of Linfert performance (Megasquirt Guru) who lives in my town, and I am planning on taking the car down to show him to discuss some options with. Ultimately I am assuming my project will look very similar to MentalSocket/ZZ3 Astro's IROC project, which is serving as a major inspiration for my build. I am also looking at the old HP performance (I know I know, they were terrible about delivery, but it did seem to be a decently designed kit) kit for ideas as well.
My plan is to run a megasquirt 2 v3 (and hopefully my 80's bar graph lcd gauges will still work), and I would really like to use the Efi Connection SBC timing cover and dummy distributor with a COP setup.
Both ZZ3Astro, and HP performance ran turbos in the 60mm range, so for the turbo, I purchased a Borg Warner S366 with a .91 a/r turbine housing. Based on the compressor maps, and the mostly stock tpi motor, I think this turbo would be pretty happy in the 10-11 lb. boost range. I am not looking to make 1000 horsepower. I am looking for a reliable 500 -550 to the wheels on around 10-11 lbs of intercooled boost, so I think this turbo can reach that goal. given the improved head flow from the NKB heads.
Treadstone makes a passenger side inlet, center top outlet Intercooler which looks like it will bolt right up where my stock tpi airbox originally sat, so I plan to use that.
My Last Question is on hood fitment. It Goes without saying that I am going to beef up the cooling system on my corvette, however I am thinking with the turbo, I want an additional Avenue of Heat Extraction, and I would also like the ability to upgrade to a Holley Stealth Ram, and I had been shopping around the cowl hoods. I Guess ACI Bought the Toledo Pro mold, and they make a good looking 2 inch cowl hood, and from the pictures they have of the finished hood installed, it looks like a very good fit and finish product.
BUT! Then I saw the new Duraflex Stingray Z hood. (Press Photo included below). Before you flame me, I do think that that hood would look really good if I just keep everything the stock color, except for blacking out the actual heat extractor vents themselves, and not continuing the black onto the hood stripe tomfoolery on the catalog model below.
They say it adds 7/8ths of an inch of height over the stock hood, and there is a little bit of room to remove a bit more material in a pinch, so I am just about 90 percent sure that hood will clear a Stealth Ram. The Stealth Ram is exactly 1 inch taller than the stock TPI manifold, and its not like the hood sits directly on the TPI and contacts it, or else we'd all have hole's in our hoods by now.
Styling tastes aside, has anybody seen one of these hoods in person? How is the fit and finish? Prep work involved?
Thanks for reading my epic novel.
Sincerely,
Blake
My name is Blake, I live on the Space Coast of Florida, and I am a certified auto-phile!
I became a corvette owner completely by accident. I was actually in the middle of restoring a 1985 monte carlo SS that I had done a 5.3 lm7 swap into, but as it is a G-body, the rust issues are getting the better of me. Plus as an initial cost saving measure, I hooked the LM7 up to the original TH2004r, which it torched in exactly 3 weeks of not even too abusive driving.
Meanwhile, one of my best friends purchased this amazingly unbeaten 1986 Dark Red Metallic a4 corvette. We cruised around in it for a few months, and enjoyed the stock tpi torque thoroughly. Then one day, as these things go when you purchase a 30 year old car, even though we had more records, and receipts, than there are pages in a History textbook, and the car was so clean you could eat off of it, about 6 months after he bought it, the flat tappet cam wiped out, the timing gear jumped, and basically he was left with a piece of garage art. We proceeded to rebuild it, doing all the wrong things, we bought some skip white nkb heads, used a custom ground loyd Elliot LTx cam I had from a previous LT4 Trans Am GT project, we used ebay no-name tie bar sbc lifters, we tried to grind down a plastic cam button we got from autozone, we used a timing gear setup for some other application, some c3 ramhorn headers (don't ask). Eventually we got the thing buttoned up, drove it around the block, and the ebay no-name tie bar lifters gave up the ghost, and gouged the cam again.
By This time I talked to my wife, I figured I could pick up the car for a steal, get it going properly this time, and flip it, and then use the proceeds from the flip to get the body work done on my Monte Carlo, and finish installing the 4L80e I picked up for it. She gave me the OK, and we picked it up.
I was able to pick this cherry ride up from him for a steal, and am going to do things correctly this time. I just purchased a complete matched valvetrain from one company
Specifications :
Cam Kit Brand
Howards Cams
Manufacturer’s Part #
CL110245-12
Cam Style
Hydraulic Roller
RPM Range
1800 - 5400
Intake Valve Lift
0.500
Exhaust Valve Lift
0.510
Advertised Intake Duration
278
Advertised Exhaust Duration
284
Intake Duration @ .050
225
Exhaust Duration @ .050
231
Lobe Separation (degrees)
112
Fair idle, Street & mild performance usage
Crisp throttle
It came with the retrofit roller cam, with retrofit roller lifters, and pushrods. It may seem like a mild cam for the heads, but more on that later).
I have a 4L80E that I had rebuilt that came out of a 454 3500 from 94 or so, which I have ready to go in, when the 700R4 inevitably dies. Grumpy's Stickies mentioned the Transmission center conversion tailshaft kit, but not only is that 4l80e into a c4 conversion kit no longer listed on their website, when I contacted them about the part and my application they told me they had no part matching that description and basically acted like I was crazy.
After some additional searching, I found a thread with PeteZR1, where he stated that he was also having a custom tailshaft machined, and his tailshaft wouldnt require the swapout of the output shaft that the transmission center kit required. That was the end of the trail though, and I couldn't find any other threads or pictures about this kit.
I reached out to him a couple of weeks ago, and apparently he made a run and still has a few left. I am seriously considering this route, however if anybody has any pictures, reviews, or experience with it, it would be much appreciated. Since he discussed it on a forum, I imagine some forum members must have purchased it, so any info on quality, fit and finish, and durability would be much appreciated.
Now comes the good stuff hahaha
I also have purchased two M21 armored personnel carrier manifolds that had the removable 3 bolt flange that sell cheaply on Ebay all the time. By grinding off the front manifold extension, these bad boys bolted straight up to the stock exhaust on the vette with no modification other than some yanking, banging, and cursing.
Now that they are on the car, and I have verified fitment and space concerns, my ultimate plan is to run a crossover pipe from the passenger side to the drivers side, and I have a whole bunch of different forms of 3 bolt/vband/t4 turbo mount flanges in a box that ive collected over the years, and I believe that I can run a single T4 turbo slightly off the drivers side manifold, basically as a Bolton.
I have had several conversations with Jeff Linfert of Linfert performance (Megasquirt Guru) who lives in my town, and I am planning on taking the car down to show him to discuss some options with. Ultimately I am assuming my project will look very similar to MentalSocket/ZZ3 Astro's IROC project, which is serving as a major inspiration for my build. I am also looking at the old HP performance (I know I know, they were terrible about delivery, but it did seem to be a decently designed kit) kit for ideas as well.
My plan is to run a megasquirt 2 v3 (and hopefully my 80's bar graph lcd gauges will still work), and I would really like to use the Efi Connection SBC timing cover and dummy distributor with a COP setup.
Both ZZ3Astro, and HP performance ran turbos in the 60mm range, so for the turbo, I purchased a Borg Warner S366 with a .91 a/r turbine housing. Based on the compressor maps, and the mostly stock tpi motor, I think this turbo would be pretty happy in the 10-11 lb. boost range. I am not looking to make 1000 horsepower. I am looking for a reliable 500 -550 to the wheels on around 10-11 lbs of intercooled boost, so I think this turbo can reach that goal. given the improved head flow from the NKB heads.
Treadstone makes a passenger side inlet, center top outlet Intercooler which looks like it will bolt right up where my stock tpi airbox originally sat, so I plan to use that.
My Last Question is on hood fitment. It Goes without saying that I am going to beef up the cooling system on my corvette, however I am thinking with the turbo, I want an additional Avenue of Heat Extraction, and I would also like the ability to upgrade to a Holley Stealth Ram, and I had been shopping around the cowl hoods. I Guess ACI Bought the Toledo Pro mold, and they make a good looking 2 inch cowl hood, and from the pictures they have of the finished hood installed, it looks like a very good fit and finish product.
BUT! Then I saw the new Duraflex Stingray Z hood. (Press Photo included below). Before you flame me, I do think that that hood would look really good if I just keep everything the stock color, except for blacking out the actual heat extractor vents themselves, and not continuing the black onto the hood stripe tomfoolery on the catalog model below.
They say it adds 7/8ths of an inch of height over the stock hood, and there is a little bit of room to remove a bit more material in a pinch, so I am just about 90 percent sure that hood will clear a Stealth Ram. The Stealth Ram is exactly 1 inch taller than the stock TPI manifold, and its not like the hood sits directly on the TPI and contacts it, or else we'd all have hole's in our hoods by now.
Styling tastes aside, has anybody seen one of these hoods in person? How is the fit and finish? Prep work involved?
Thanks for reading my epic novel.
Sincerely,
Blake
12-15-2016, 07:43 AM
#2
Drifting
Sounds like a fun project.
For the hood; i have seen the pictures on ebay often and noticed they are all digital.
As in not a picture, created in a software application, aka fake.
Makes me not want to trust them.
For the hood; i have seen the pictures on ebay often and noticed they are all digital.
As in not a picture, created in a software application, aka fake.
Makes me not want to trust them.
12-15-2016, 09:21 AM
#3
Race Director
Member Since: Feb 2002
Location: Compound in the Grove, Ga.
Posts: 11,328
Received 910 Likes
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2020 C3 of the Year Finalist - Unmodified
2019 C4 of Year Finalist (performance mods)
2018 C4 of Year Finalist
2015 C4 of the Year Finalist
St. Jude Donor '16
2020 C3 of the Year Finalist - Unmodified
Welcome.
12-15-2016, 10:48 AM
#4
Advanced
Thread Starter
I noticed that too Gibbles. I do know that its essentially a brand new product, but you'd think they would take the time to install one for marketing purposes. Although I do know that Duraflex usually gets around a Soild B for a grade as a composite panel company. People are generally much happier than not with duraflex products in general. I just don't like to be the guinea pig with body work.
12-15-2016, 10:57 AM
#5
Race Director
Welcome to the club. Good luck with the project. 
12-25-2016, 08:18 AM
#6
Instructor
Have you been able to find any more info on this hood? I'm looking at one, too. there's a extreme dimensions rep on the c6 forum. i pm'd him, and he didn't have any pics either.
12-31-2016, 03:15 PM
#7
Advanced
Thread Starter
In the mean time, update!!!
The front brace on the manifold clashed with the stock 86 accessories, and hit the firewall when swapped side to side. A little time with the cutoff wheel, a little time on the bench grinder, and it's ready for sanding and high temperature paint! Then i'lI recontour the inside of the manifold so that the center merge flows upwards instead of downwards, and then it'll be crossover pipe time! I'll post more pictures after porting and paint.
09-14-2017, 01:52 PM
#8
Advanced
Thread Starter
Project Stall
Well, I started the project on the manifolds, but believe it or not, I still haven't gotten the car back after all this time. I posted this as a response in one of the regional forums who was asking for an opinion on the Vette Doctors, but I figured it would make a good update, explaining why there hasn't been more progress.
I dropped off the car above, a running driving working A/C 1986 corvette with a near mint interior off to him in June of last year. They kept it outside unprotected for months, until I started showing up all the time to check on the status.
They finally tore it down to the short block, and it turned out the issue was a lifter bit the dust and tore up the cam lobe. They quoted me 1500 dollars in parts, and another 2k in labor to put it back together. Granted that price was for a retrofit roller cam, retrofit lifters, and a bunch of other stuff associated with it, but at this point, I just wanted the car back, so I went and bought a GM flat tappet 350hp 327 cam, new reputable aftermarket parts comp cams lifters, etc. I dropped off everything they needed down to the gaskets and seals for a whopping 400 bucks, last August.
It is September 14th 2017, and They have never called me again. I am in the middle of the home buying process right now and perpetually 2 weeks from closing, so I don't want the lender complaining if I drop 3k in the middle of the process (because they will), and between the lender dragging their feet, the title company dragging their feet, now this hurricane, some screwups by the builder, I've been trying to close for 2 months now, and Irma has pushed that back probably into October now.
I drove by there after hours the other day, and although I can't verify it, I am fairly certain they have pushed it outside as a basket case. I don't trust the mechanic thats working on it, it seems like every time I talk to him, he says something else that either doesn't make sense, or is just patently wrong. Tried to tell me that there is a problem with the heads, and that the pushrod hole was not in the right spot, and thats what caused the lifter to fail. Yes. Chew on that for a moment.
The last 4 times I saw it, not a thing had been done, and my parts were in a cardboard box. I haven't said anything, but as soon as we close on the house, I am going to go down there an raise hell. Also, as this has gone longer and longer, and I have talked to other Vette owners, and local gearheads, this seems to be the general consensus for the shop.
I was planning on getting this thing back 8 months ago, and starting on a turbo project, but thats clearly not going to happen. I am probably going to have to threaten him, get a court order, pull my car out of there and hope they havent scattered the parts all over the shop, take it to another shop, pay them to put it back together, and then sue the Vette Doctors for the cost to cover.
The worst part is, I don't even really want the car anymore. Originally, I was going to put a T56 in this when I got it back, and then I realized I needed a Dana 44 to take the abuse, and after crunching the numbers and combing the markets, it really is a no brainer to just sell mine, and then get a 6 speed ZF car (possibly a Vert!). So at this point when I get it back, I plan to sell it so that I can get an 89/90 ZF 6 speed as a better starting point, but at this point, I have no idea when that will be.
I dropped off the car above, a running driving working A/C 1986 corvette with a near mint interior off to him in June of last year. They kept it outside unprotected for months, until I started showing up all the time to check on the status.
They finally tore it down to the short block, and it turned out the issue was a lifter bit the dust and tore up the cam lobe. They quoted me 1500 dollars in parts, and another 2k in labor to put it back together. Granted that price was for a retrofit roller cam, retrofit lifters, and a bunch of other stuff associated with it, but at this point, I just wanted the car back, so I went and bought a GM flat tappet 350hp 327 cam, new reputable aftermarket parts comp cams lifters, etc. I dropped off everything they needed down to the gaskets and seals for a whopping 400 bucks, last August.
It is September 14th 2017, and They have never called me again. I am in the middle of the home buying process right now and perpetually 2 weeks from closing, so I don't want the lender complaining if I drop 3k in the middle of the process (because they will), and between the lender dragging their feet, the title company dragging their feet, now this hurricane, some screwups by the builder, I've been trying to close for 2 months now, and Irma has pushed that back probably into October now.
I drove by there after hours the other day, and although I can't verify it, I am fairly certain they have pushed it outside as a basket case. I don't trust the mechanic thats working on it, it seems like every time I talk to him, he says something else that either doesn't make sense, or is just patently wrong. Tried to tell me that there is a problem with the heads, and that the pushrod hole was not in the right spot, and thats what caused the lifter to fail. Yes. Chew on that for a moment.
The last 4 times I saw it, not a thing had been done, and my parts were in a cardboard box. I haven't said anything, but as soon as we close on the house, I am going to go down there an raise hell. Also, as this has gone longer and longer, and I have talked to other Vette owners, and local gearheads, this seems to be the general consensus for the shop.
I was planning on getting this thing back 8 months ago, and starting on a turbo project, but thats clearly not going to happen. I am probably going to have to threaten him, get a court order, pull my car out of there and hope they havent scattered the parts all over the shop, take it to another shop, pay them to put it back together, and then sue the Vette Doctors for the cost to cover.
The worst part is, I don't even really want the car anymore. Originally, I was going to put a T56 in this when I got it back, and then I realized I needed a Dana 44 to take the abuse, and after crunching the numbers and combing the markets, it really is a no brainer to just sell mine, and then get a 6 speed ZF car (possibly a Vert!). So at this point when I get it back, I plan to sell it so that I can get an 89/90 ZF 6 speed as a better starting point, but at this point, I have no idea when that will be.
09-14-2017, 05:34 PM
#9
Melting Slicks
Props to you for being so patient and well mannered about all of that, there is no money to be made on these cars, having an 89 6 speed myself I can assure you they are outstanding cars, I looked for the old body style and interior with the 6 speed which only leaves you to an 89.
05-18-2020, 09:04 PM
#11
Advanced
If any company contracted to do work on my C4 or C6 vetts and treated them like that I would get a good lawyer and a tow company to recover my property and sue for the damage. then I would publish photos of the damage and the name of the company with anyone that would listen there is no excuse for unprofessional conduct like that. I ran a Ford bodyshop for 20 years and never treated a customers car that badly, would have been fired in a heart beat if I did.!!
05-18-2020, 09:43 PM
#12
Drifting
That sucks but your tell tell sign should have been that 40+ Vettes are parked there year round and they don't have 20 full time mechanics.
05-19-2020, 05:46 AM
#13
Drifting
Member Since: Jun 2018
Location: Brisbane Australia
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C4 of Year Finalist (performance mods) 2019
Man this is a terrible story. That was a beautiful car and it has been completely ruined by these goons.
Apart from all the obvious damage why did they remove the fuel trapdoor? Did they remove your fuel pump for some reason, and is the tank now full of water? This sort of negligence is criminal in my opinion.
I’m so sorry to hear this story.
Apart from all the obvious damage why did they remove the fuel trapdoor? Did they remove your fuel pump for some reason, and is the tank now full of water? This sort of negligence is criminal in my opinion.
I’m so sorry to hear this story.