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Ran a few searches on it. And many people have had the same issue. Usually with the 95/96 cars. But yeah, I'm pretty certain it wasn't all the way in now that I think of it.
So someone correct me if I'm wrong. A bad slave would show up as weird clutch engagement. Bad master would be rough shifts or clutch pedal goes straight to the floor. Only asking cause i've read over the years that masters and slaves for these cars are hit and miss.
I ain't sayin' you have to do this, but pull off the entire shifter assembly from the trans; send it to Bill Bourdeau at ZFdoc; he can rebuild it, there are small u type joints and bushings that deteriorate over time..He can repair / replace all that; and while he has it, he can shorten the shifter throws. I had him do the whole enchilada on my 96 and it was a huge improvement.
Ran a few searches on it. And many people have had the same issue. Usually with the 95/96 cars. But yeah, I'm pretty certain it wasn't all the way in now that I think of it.
So someone correct me if I'm wrong. A bad slave would show up as weird clutch engagement. Bad master would be rough shifts or clutch pedal goes straight to the floor. Only asking cause i've read over the years that masters and slaves for these cars are hit and miss.
I ain't sayin' you have to do this, but pull off the entire shifter assembly from the trans; send it to Bill Bourdeau at ZFdoc; he can rebuild it, there are small u type joints and bushings that deteriorate over time..He can repair / replace all that; and while he has it, he can shorten the shifter throws. I had him do the whole enchilada on my 96 and it was a huge improvement.
If I had to do it all over again I’d go this route as well. My hurst is nice but have had binding problems with it since install. Not so bad but every now in then it won’t go into gear.
If I had to do it all over again I’d go this route as well. My hurst is nice but have had binding problems with it since install. Not so bad but every now in then it won’t go into gear.
1. Youtube the ranger method for clutch fluid. It is mainly for C5+ Cars, but works well I've found even with our system. I do it once ever 2 to 3 months. Not everytime I hit the gas station. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gBbsy0LjUvE
2. Do not go buy shifting "roughness" or "notchiness" by just sitting in the car trying to shift with the engine off and the clutch depressed.
3. Fill the fluid to the "low" line. You are correct, the rubber bellow will push the fluid to the full line when you install the cap.
Check it after a few days if it is low, time to to replace both master and salve in my opinion. Jim Jandik is retired but he may still rebuild the originals if you call him. He rebuild mine back in 2012 I believe.
Hope you are doing well Brandon!
Why wouldn't you do a complete fluid change at that point? If the clutch dust is making it's way all the way to the reservoir, imagine how much is still in the slave.
Why wouldn't you do a complete fluid change at that point? If the clutch dust is making it's way all the way to the reservoir, imagine how much is still in the slave.
I had a similar thought. The Ranger method is surely helpful in freshening up the fluid and is a good maintenance practice. If the Ranger method stirs up the entire system and yields 80-90% fresh fluid, I might do that going forward just for simplicity (plus I don't always have a helper to pump the pedals for me). But, while a traditional fluid bleed (out through the slave fitting) is perhaps dirtier and more difficult, it would yield nearly 100% fresh fluid. I just wonder if 80% vs 100% fresh fluid makes much difference when I'm doing this service every year?
Last night: I bled it the way @9T3VETTE suggested about having the master full, leaving cap on and removing slave. Bench bleed it, then attach clutch line first. No matter what, this **** doesnt want to get bled. And i've tried every way. All 3 components are new. Master, slave, and line. I'll check for leaks again at the clutch line fittings. Anyways, while doing this last night, I took the boot off the old slave out of curiosity.
Last night: I bled it the way @9T3VETTE suggested about having the master full, leaving cap on and removing slave. Bench bleed it, then attach clutch line first. No matter what, this **** doesnt want to get bled. And i've tried every way. All 3 components are new. Master, slave, and line. I'll check for leaks again at the clutch line fittings. Anyways, while doing this last night, I took the boot off the old slave out of curiosity.
it (almost?) looks like someone packed that with grease to retard leaking in the (very?) short term?
Possibly. I spoke to ZF Doc about this. He says not to do full pump strokes. Says to do 1 inch stroker till bubbles are gone. What a journey lol. Next update will be when she is fully bled.
Bummer you are having so much trouble, it can be frustrating as hell. On the bright side, once it's bled and working properly you shouldn't have to touch it!
Anyone done it this way before? I'm referring to what I circled in red. I tried it. Pushing the rod in is like bench pressing. At least to me. So I got tired of pushing the rod in pretty fast. I was doing it myself, so couldn't see if bubbles were coming out or not by doing it that way.
Bolted the slave back up. Pumped the pedal by letting my foot slide off the clutch. **** ton of small bubbles came out, and continue to do so. Where I circled in this pic below, there fluid coming out of that area. I didn't notice it until I would push on the rod by hand. Is that why these bubbles don't go away?
Anyone done it this way before? I'm referring to what I circled in red. I tried it. Pushing the rod in is like bench pressing. At least to me. So I got tired of pushing the rod in pretty fast. I was doing it myself, so couldn't see if bubbles were coming out or not by doing it that way.
Bolted the slave back up. Pumped the pedal by letting my foot slide off the clutch. **** ton of small bubbles came out, and continue to do so. Where I circled in this pic below, there fluid coming out of that area. I didn't notice it until I would push on the rod by hand. Is that why these bubbles don't go away?
Bump Same question that I listed in the quoted text.
I've pumped the pedal several times since. Fluid hasn't leaked out of that spot. It'll only leak out of there if I unbolt the slave, and push on the rod with my hand. Will that cause my system to never be bubble free?
Bill says not to pump the clutch pedal fast, or even all the way down. Says it'll aerate the fluid. Instead, he says to pump it with 1-2inches of pedal travel. He tells me after 75-100 pumps, bubbles should be gone. They aren't. It's embarrassing i've had to ask all these questions, on what is a simple task. I'm sure you guys are just as annoyed as I am. I apologize. But, I'm dedicated as a **** with these cars. And if I take it to a shop, they'll charge me for not fixing it. And doing/telling me what I already know/did.
Everything is new. No leaks from the back of the master, none from the clutch line/fittings. Pulled off the slave, took the rod out. Shined a light inside the boot. No leakage either.
Time to try something else? this is from the factory service manual, so for what its worth, are rugs or floor mats bunched up under the clutch pedal preventing full travel of the clutch pedal? and,
the clutch pedal arm rides on some nylon bushings; are these worn, damaged, or (maybe) missing entirely?
In my 96 I removed the spacer between the firewall and the clutch master cylinder and replaced it with a fabricated one approximately one half as thick; this modification allows the piston in the master cylinder bore to move farther, increasing the amount of clutch fluid displaced when the clutch pedal is depressed. Now admittedly my clutch is an aftermarket (SPEC stage 3 plus), but I replaced EVERYTHING, not just hydraulics, with new (total cost just in parts $2K), and decreasing the spacer thickness was the last thing needed to get it all to work together. I did everything in consultation with Bill Bourdeau aka ZFdoc, including having him shorten and rebuild the shifter mechanism.
If you simply cannot get the clutch to release and engage properly, at some point you may have to drop the trans and see what's going on inside the bellhousing. Sorry. You heard it here first.
Oh no, the clutch releases/enages perfect. It always has, even with the old leaky master and slave. It's just that the bubbles never go away, and thus making gear engagement harsh.
05-01-2019, 04:15 PM
Same question that I listed in the quoted text.
