Must be true, if it is posted on the Forum. Who needs supporting documentation?

 

If you listen to the people who are peddling a cure, it is probably way less since they are assuming a worst case scenario. I would suspect that my gas in the tank is longer lasting than the gas in my gas can that I use for filling up the lawnmower since it sits in the shed venting to atmosphere.

Sure, there is a degradation but how much? Is that enough to cause concern?

 

Of course not! The amount of people here that play the Chicken Little card is amazing. There are thousands and thousands of cars that sit on dealer lots, compounds etc. far longer than 30 days and have no adverse effects. If you measure out a cup of rice for a recipe and drop 10 kernels on the floor, are you going to tell me your meal tastes different? Same thing. With the exception of those here who have heavily modded engines, the vast majority have the same equipment as you would find in a beat up Chevy halfton lumbering down the road. A Chev engine and a Chev transmission. Nothing more, only in a prettier package.

 

If I get a free meal or at least a discount, you bet it tastes worse. Lol.

Yes but who likes to think they're in possession of an ordinary car?

 

Yeah? Did you even look at the link that I posted for you?

It's odd that you came on here asking about "bad gas" as your root cause....but you seem convinced that it is bad gas.

 

Exactly. I've managed fleet maintenance for fleets of over 100 vehicles for the past 25 years. ALL SEASONAL, since it's always been at ski resorts. We have vehicles that sit for ~6 months in through the winter...and other vehicles that sit ~6 months through the summer.

Guess what happens when we fire them up, after their off season/6 months of sitting?

 

I wonder if Boeing Aircraft knows this? They have about 450 planes grounded for about a year. Grounded planes are empty?

 

Hello there guys,

Here is some information from Bob Villa's Website:

"Ethanol-blended gas lasts up to three months.

According to the U.S. Energy Information Administration, most gasoline sold in the U.S. is “E10” gas made of 90 percent petroleum-based gas and 10 percent ethanol (ethyl alcohol). Ethanol-blended gas usually has a shelf life of up to three months because of the high speed at which ethanol oxidizes. Because ethanol is hydrophilic (a.k.a., water-loving), it will also readily absorb any water or humidity in a sealed container resulting from condensation, causing both moisture contamination of the fuel and the eventual separation of the fuel into distinct gas and ethanol layers. Generally, the higher the ethanol content in the gas, the shorter its shelf life, so E15 (15 percent ethanol content), E20 (20 percent ethanol), or E85 (85 percent ethanol) gas will expire sooner than E10 gas will.

Pure gasoline keeps for at least six months.

Petroleum-based gasoline without any ethanol will still succumb to oxidation and volatile compound evaporation in a sealed container or tank, but these processes usually occur more slowly in pure gasoline, so you can usually expect it to last at least six months when properly stored. Because pure gas is hydrophobic (a.k.a., water-hating), it doesn’t absorb water or humidity as ethanol-blended gas does, which allows you to avoid moisture contamination and fuel separation issues."

I knew a little group of naysayers would jump up and down regarding my "Suggestion" of using B&G 44K Fuel System Cleaner. It is fine, you don't need to use it as that is your prerogative. Just because YOU don't trust commonly sold products like the B&G products is your issue.

I PERSONALLY HAVE USED THE B&G PRODUCTS (Dozens of times) WITH GREAT SUCCESS! Therefor I see no reason for me not to recommend or suggest that they be used. I am confident in the quality of the product and am sure it will do what it is supposed to do. If I had never tried it (with good results) I would not suggest or recommend it to anyone.

The 30 day life of the oxygenated gasoline is something I have been told by several folks in the gasoline industry and Chemical Engineers from the Department of Energy. I have supplied you something from Bob Villa suggesting 90 days lifespan and explaining to a small degree why it goes bad.

If you choose to leave oxygenated gasoline in your vehicles for six months then you will be the one out there cleaning the fuel system to get it running again. I dump all gasoline out of yard equipment every fall after the leaves are done. When I use Oxygenated gasoline in lawn equipment I make sure it has a fuel treatment in it.

On all the Ski Equipment you maintain do you by chance run the carburetor out of fuel before shutting it down for the season? Or are additives used to regenerate your old gasoline. "Mechanic In a Bottle" is the perfect thing as it rejuvenates old gasoline and makes it burn again.

The point is that Oxygenated Gasoline will not last as long as Regular Gasoline. Additives are available to help either type of gasoline last longer and some of them are quality products.

P.S. Boeing Aircraft do not use gasoline or E10.

I always kept my fuel tanks full in my Cessna to keep water from condensing inside the fuel tank. I flew often enough the fuel did not have a chance to go bad. Piston Engine Aircraft are not supposed to use the oxygenated fuels at all.

 

I for one, have no problem whatsoever believing my car is nothing special. That's because I am a realist. I am happy and proud of my own accomplishments. I am also happy and proud of the accomplishments of my children and grandchildren. Proud of my car??? Really! A car is nothing more than a workhorse or a hobby to collect our spare time. Washing and waxing(even when already spotless), tinkering and replacing this or that, even installing "instant horsepower" dodads, knock yourself out. As I said, it is a hobby and if that makes you happy, then good on you. But treating these pieces of metal, plastics and rubber as if they are beings is a bit irrational I believe. If your car has the record ET at your track or if you consistently win autocrosses you enter, that is no reflection on your car!! It is a reflection of your skills and abilities to make it capable of doing these things. Sometimes I think some people watched too many episodes of Knight Rider while on LSD. Every time I see a grown man on here calling their car their "baby", I almost gag.

 

I looked back and initially didn’t realize that “DONT THINK SO” was an actual link you sent. Now I see it. Very informative, so thank you! That doesn’t mean you will never get a bad tank of gas.
Not sure what you mean by odd. Isn’t this forum a Corvette community where we help one another and look for suggestions and recommendations?
One of my best friend is a retired chemist for BP, and after hearing about my issue, said absolutely do not rule out a bad tank of gas. I reached out to this forum for additional feedback, as others here are extremely knowledgeable and have had first hand similar experiences with their C4. I’m not big on additives, but water in gas can really send mixed symptoms of failing components. FYI...GM recommends fuel system/injector additive in their new cars and trucks at each oil change when Top Tier fuel is not available.
Bottom line, why replace parts if there is a possibility that the fuel might be the culprit? If not, of course I will I will proceed as needed. Nothing to to lose with a new fresh tank or two..nothing ventured nothing gained!

 

Who is Bob Villa and what are his credentials?

I looked at the EIA part and all it says is that we have ethanol in the gas. Perhaps you can point out where it mentioned the shortened lifespan with some numbers so we know exactly how long we have till it isn't tolerable.

OK. You claim success with the B&G stuff. Show me the lab tests and proof. Ever ask why the company relies on testimonials and not publish the proof they have already gotten before making the claims?

30 days before what happens suddenly? Are you claiming that up to day 29 it is perfect and suddenly, past day 30 it is unusable? I would suspect that it doesn't suddenly age so there should be a graph of how long before it is no longer usable. THAT is far more important information so I can decide if and when I should toss the gas.

BTDT with the watercraft. The injectors weren't that bad when I cleaned them when you look at the couple of "before and after" reports. Granted it was an incredibly small sample size and therefore statistically insignificant. We were told to fill up the tanks before storage and we usually store by October and can't use it till at least May.

 

Nor does it mean you are very likely to get a tank of bad gas. Eons ago, I had a beater car that seemed to have issues after you drive it for a while. It was suggested to be bad gas. Every time we dumped a can of gas dry, it perked up immediately. One day, we found out that it was the cat glowing cherry red and all we had to do was stop for a while and it gets better. After which, we cut off the cat and it never had the dying issue again.

I believe he is saying that you are trying to convince yourself that it is bad gas. IOW you are trying to justify the opinion as opposed to form an opinion.

I wouldn't rule out the bad gas but I would think it is quite unlikely but possible.

Have you sucked out some fuel to even do a "Look See"? Have you checked fuel pressure? Checked if the injectors are Multecs and if not, are they in good shape?

IF you really think so, why not suck out all the gas and try a different station? One that gets tons of traffic.

 

Bob Villa is the real life version of Tim The Toolman. Self proclaimed expert on everything.

 

LOL Isn't that what we do?

 

I think he was the pitchman for Sears, a soon to be defunct company or at least, one in trouble

 

I"ve never used BG(sic) products in my cars.....see the pics in the link I provided. I'd call that: "WITH GREAT SUCCESS"

I'm not saying "it doesn't work" -we actually use a different BG product at work (for a different purpose) and it does work. I'm saying, YOU DON"T NEED IT. Plain old gasoline already has more than enough detergent already in it. See pics in my linked thread.



Bob Villa??? You mean the guy that restores homes, on TV??


That's not what we see. I don't see that at home, I don't see it at work. Mowers, snow blowers, snowmobiles, side-by-sides, ATV's, pumps, packers, chainsaws, trucks....they all run fine after sitting 6 months.


No. Nope, the old gasoline burns just fine, fall or spring, w/o additives, voodoo or other religious rituals.

 

If B&G products did not work they would not be around as long as they have been. Most every dealership I have spoken with uses the B&G products to get their customers cars running better.
It would be great if they could afford to remove the injectors and flush and adjust them on a flow bench but that is not economically feasible.
Hence B&G made a product which is used before the injectors are removed for a several hundred dollar servicing. This is why B&G products are selling well as an optional method of cleaning the injectors.

"Six months
If stored properly, ethanol-free gas can last up to six months. It is not as likely to succumb to oxidation or evaporation. E10 gas has a three-month shelf life maximum. This makes ethanol-free gas ideal for storage compared to E10

The Pros and Cons of Non-Ethanol Gas - Salem & Portland ..."

Here is a link to an actual review of the B&G 44K product.: https://www.carbibles.com/bg-44k-fuel-system-cleaner/

Take a look at the Amazon reviews of the product:
Now take a look at this site and you can see who uses it in your own area. On my map it showed over 50 sites that use it in my county alone. Here is the link: https://www.bgprod.com/find-a-shop/

Here is another from "The Fuel Expert": https://thefuelexpert.com/bg-fuel-injector-cleaners/A Street Automotive uses BG 44K®, the number one fuel injector cleaner! In a recent survey, dealership service managers chose BG 44K® 6 to 1 over the next aftermarket supplier.

"BG 44K® is 11 ounces of high quality detergents and additives that you pour right into the gas tank to restore performance and gas mileage. It vanquishes deposits in combustion chambers, intake manifolds, ports and on valves and restores flow in fuel injectors. Basically, it cleans the entire fuel system!"

You did say that "We Don't NEED it".

That may be true in a "perfect" world but why are over fifty shops in my county alone using this product if it does not work or is not needed? Wherever there are fuel injectors there is a "need" to clean them without removing them.
Maybe your environmental conditions allow the gas in your part of the country to last a bit longer. Here in Virginia the humidity is very high and we are 100' above sea level. Here in Northern Virginia "We need it" as this crappy fuel clogs up injectors often around here.

A diesel manufacturer called me one day when they were having trouble with some of their engines in Bolivia. The problem was that they assumed that the entire country of Bolivia was colder than it actually is. They had generators that went into service down in a part of Bolivia that was hot and dry. I told them it was simple what they were running into, they needed a diesel fuel additive to keep the bacteria from growing in the diesel fuel gumming up the high pressure pump and the injectors. In Florida I had to use the Diesel fuel additives to prevent the growth of junk in my Boat's fuel system. At least after I pitched the old gasoline sucking Chrysler 318 over the edge...

As an Engineer who installed Remote Power Systems in places where the generator had to last years between maintenance calls I had to learn about this subject. My generators were always powered by air cooled diesels from single cylinder up to 6 cylinders. I installed sites out in the empty quarter of Saudi Arabia all the way up into the frozen tundra of Alaska. I have built remote Village Power Systems where I brought the village's into the 20th century by supplying them with Electricity and running water. In every system I set up I always put the diesel additive to keep the fuel from developing the microbes.

 

This may shed some light on the "expert opinion" from above. It is a copy and paste from the article mentioned.

Disclosure: BobVila.com participates in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for publishers to earn fees by linking to Amazon.com and affiliated sites.

In addition, here is another copy and paste outlining the "qualifications" of the said author.

Manasa Reddigari

ABOUT THE AUTHOR

Manasa Reddigari has tackled topics ranging from computer software to home remodeling in her more-than-a-decade-long career as a writer and editor. During her stint as a scribe, she's been featured by leading outlets in the real estate, home improvement, and lifestyle niches such as Trulia, Stikwood, and Brit + Co. Her design philosophy is, if you can dream it, you can DIY it! Connect with her on her website, copyhabit.com, or LinkedIn to find out what she's been writing about lately.

 

Well....one thing is for sure; BG products definitely treats ctmccloskey's psychology...that's for sure. We "Get it", CT. You like the stuff. You believe in it.

*I said we don't need it b/c we don't. Did you look at the pics in the link that I posted above?
*I have no f'n CLUE, why you're talking about diesel storage tanks, bacterial microbes and diesel generators. (?) OP has a gasoline powered car and likely doesn't deal with fuel storage tanks of any kind. What do you think?
*I HIGHLY doubt that our world is "perfect". What do you think? The place(s) I work is "special"? You should take note that I've worked at multiple ski resorts around the country; Maine, Vermont, Colorado, and Utah. Do you suppose all of those places were "perfect"? I'm going to go ahead and say, "I doubt it". Incredibly, we didn't use additives for any of the machinery at any of the resorts for gasoline powered equipment.
*Fuel injectors typically, already get cleaned by the detergent that already comes in gasoline. Did you look at the pics in the link that I posted above?
My '92 LT1 has nearly 200,000 miles on original injectors. I've never put an ounce of BG (or any other elixir) into it. How can that be!?

 

They used to think the sun revolved around the earth too for the longest time. Going off that, the sun would still be going around the earth. Just because people are stupid enough to go along with "It is only a few bucks. What do you have to lose?" and feed their crap does NOT show the crap works. A test in an accredited laboratory using standard testing practices and the results published for critique does.

Let me ask you this. Which is easier to sell? A $500 job to clean the injectors or a $10 can every so often that is fueled by imagination? IIRC there was an article about people selling off their SUVs and trucks because of the sticker shock at the pump. Never mind that they have a new car payment or the insurance costs more. I pay less today at the pump so it must be better. First thing people say to me at the pump when I have my Ford Excursion with the 44 gallon tank (which I run to empty) is "OMG!! IT TAKES over 40 gallons to fill!!!". Well, I could fill it 10 gallons at a time and use the same fuel volume but it probably would be more palatable than 44 gallons a time./