Yes I am the second owner of a stock 1984 corvette. I know it has 205 HP and 290 Tor. But I dont understand how, I have raced several cars that have a lot more HP than me. I have raced new mustangs, 5.0 mustangs cars that some people think are fast like ram air Firebird (not sure about this one to much traffic) and I have done very well. Of course these have been on the streets and not the 1/2 mile tracks. But how does a car have only 205 feel so much stronger. Oh I have never owned a V8 before I am only 21 but to me it feels very very strong. I dunno if it is because of the weight but can someone help me understand. Also I need some tips on some performance what should I do to it and what do u think it will run after putting ur suggested parts on it. One last thing guys, do u know what my car will run factory, and what do u think it could run for a good price. (just basic stuff I am not a wealthy person haha) Maybe exhaust, headers, chip, I dunno maybe more.
Let me know thanks a lot
:steering: :chevy

 

What you are feeling and seeing the result of is low end torque. Your 84 is going to make sligihtly more torque than a new LS1 car and a ton more torque than any Mustang because you've got more displacement.

Acceleration is a function of mass and force, more torque = more force. So where does horsepower come into play? Horsepower is a function of torque and RPM. So to make high horsepower you must either make a ton of torque down low, or the engine has to be able to rev very high. This also means that for example if there are two cars, A & B you can see some interesting results.

Just for argument sake, assume car A makes 300 pounds of torque and does so from 1000-4000 rpms, and 4000 rpm's is the redline. Assume car B makes 200 pounds of torque across the board but will rev to 7000 rpms. Which car is faster? Depends on the race. For playing around in traffic where you might not be able to get above 4000 rpm's, car A will be faster. Why? Since car A makes more torque from 1000-4000 rpm's, it also makes more Horsepower for that given RPM. Now in a longer race car B will come into it's own. It will make more horsepower and will be able to utilize it. It will also be able to hold each gear longer, allowing the torque multiplication of the gears to work for it longer. You see when car A has to shift, it's effective torque put to the ground will be slashed. Since car B is still in first ger it will effectively be putting more power to the ground than car A.

So why are you winning street races against "faster" cars? Your 84 makes torque down low and then runs out of breath up top fairly quickly. For the conditions you describe you have been lucky enough to be in right in your sweet spot and have been able to take advantage of that. Unfortunately if you go out to the local drag strip you'll see a different story. You'll have the higher HP cars at the launch but sure enough they will pull away from you.

So ideally for the fastest car you make torque AND turn high revs. Most cars have a compromise somewhere in the middle. Crossfires and Tuned Port cars tend to favor more low end grunt while LT1's and LS1's tend to favor more top end power. The one thing you can rest assured is that the higher horsepower car WILL win the race if the race is long enough.

As for performance mods, a chip is essentially useless. Headers and exhaust will always help. The more air you can move in and out of the motor, the more fuel you can add and the more power you can make.

:cheers: And welcome to the forum. BTW, I'm 21 as well. It's good to see some younger guys out there are finally able to afford vettes.

 

Most of the updates I've done came from the CrossFire Forum....sorry I don't have the URL,
But I'm sure someone on this forum can give it to you....
Lots of great info there....Mine is an '84....
tony
:thumbs: :flag


[Modified by oldace84, 10:09 AM 4/28/2003]

 

Crossfire Injection Forum http://www.crossfire.webhop.net/

 

Us 21 year olds have to keep it real!

 

Yeah dude, I'm 15 (learners permit), and I've raced a few mustangs myself and even some idiots in full size trucks, and four cylinder eco cars. And I've spanked everyone no trouble at all. The hardest was a '96 mustang GT, he pulled up beside me at the stoplight, (his windows were tinted so dark I couldn't see his face, but I just wanted to race. I would have nailed it, but as I said before, I've only got my learners permit, and my dad was riding with me. But anyway, when the light turned green, I hit the gas and held it half way down, before I knew it I was at 60 and I had him by four or five car lengths. I held him that far back for at least a mile, (and keep in mind, my foot never moved from the spot I put it to first), I got up to 75 and I finally heard my dad's screaming, so I backed out of it, and in five seconds the mustang went by. That freaked me out, that I could out do a car with close to 300hp, with 215 (K&N filter, raised timing), so I asked my dad when we got home, and he simply said, "Torque.", the mustang has a 302 and you've got a 350, so therefore more torque means faster take off. Anyway, if you want to make some power with cross fire then you'll have to do this, buy an X-Ram intake, 2030 compucam, trick flow heads, some high flowing hedders, as well as gutted cat and some good mufflers ( I would reccomend flowmasters), after you do all that you should have 350+hp, and close if not more than 400lbs of torque/ft. That may satisfy you, but as for me my sights are set a little higher, I want to take that dodge viper to cleaners, all five hundred horses of it. Anyway, good luck, and I'll talk to you later.

 

Not to burst your bubble, but I see a few :bs flags here.
First of all an '84 CF vette is a low 15 second car, MAYBE a high 14 with an exhaust and K&N..'Tis a known fact..

Now racing a Mustang GT, (which by the way is not 300HP, only 215HP), and if the guy is really racing should have been able to pass you EASY once you hit 40-50.. You do have more torque and at lower rpms, for a better launch, but he should have caught you, considering you were 'half way down'.. Also you say you kept him at 4-5 car elngths for about a mile? And you only got up to 75mph? U actually think he was racing?
Once again, I am glad people are having fun with their vettes, but let's keep things real.. :D

 

AHHH! To be young again. No thanks. If 145 HP (350 minus 205) were that easy to come by, I'D have it. A Crossfire Viper eater? "Hire a teenager...while they STILL know it all." AHHH! To be young again. No THANKS!!!

RACE ON!!!

 

Okay dudes, maybe he wasn't racing, but why was "hugging" me at the stop light then. No, I'm not BSing anyone, I know I took him to the cleaners for at least a mile, when I backed off thats when he finally started gaining some speed. Personally I don't care for being ragged about something that actually happened, (regardless if he was racing or not, I took him, and I was just telling you from my point of view what happened), so get off my case about this and help me get that LT-1 in and running (ha,ha,ha) so I can actually make you guys believe me when I spank someone. By the way, when did I ever say I was a cross fire viper eater? I said once I finished installing the LT-1 and modding it I'll be able to "eat vipers for lunch". Anyway, talk to you later.

P.S. Please don't ban me for getting a little hot under the collar there, I was just making a rebuttle.

 

If that mustang was only 215 hp and not 300 then how would the mustang be able to pull away with no trouble. ummm don't think so some how.
If the mustang was 215hp it would have been fairly close thing with a stock cross-fire.

Do i sense the usual anti cross-fire BS. :bs

What so many people seem to forget is that under the cross-fire manifold sits a 350 chevy much like any other.
All you have to do is change the manifold / bore the throttle bodies and away you go, potentially as tuneable as any other vette.

So i say to you all NO MORE ANTI CROSS-FIRE BS :mad :mad :mad

:rant: :rant: :rant: :rant: :rant:

 

I'm not "busting" Crossfires, but one must learn to be realistic. Hell! I own (and love) one.

Anyone see reference to an LT1, here? I must have failed to read between the lines. I wonder what else I missed? AHHH! To be young again...

 

With about $200 and a lot of elbow grease your crossfire can be a LOW 14 second car. Add heads, cam and headers, and it will be a low 13 second car.

See my sig.

OOPS!! I forgot they dropped the sigs. Here are my mods and times:

'84 Red/Red, Z51, Ported Manifold, Swirl Plates Removed, K&N, ADS Superchip, Shift Kit, gutted cat
14.159@94.8MPH
Member USS ZAD Crew - Fuel Specialist
NHRA Member


[Modified by Nitro Junkie, 9:38 PM 4/30/2003]


[Modified by Nitro Junkie, 9:39 PM 4/30/2003]


[Modified by Nitro Junkie, 9:40 PM 4/30/2003]

 

Dude, what the h@ll are you talking trash to me for? I haven't hassled you, and when I said what I did in that post I was just telling how to make power with a cross fire. And the reason I want to get rid of my cross fire is because the thing has nearly 200k miles on it and I don't want to rebuild it, and I just really favor the LT-1. One more thing, I've had enough with all the anti teenage remarks from you, you're really starting to irrtate me :rant: , so get off it you middle aged p$@ck. Anyway I've got to go.

 

Ummm first of all I think u misunderstood his remark a bit. Did it hit too close to home? Was it too real and that is why it bothered you? :lol:

Now once again being realistic, a 215HP rustang GT with a decent driver already has 10HP over a CF vette, and could get into the high 14's stock..
I don't say nothing anti-CF as they are still vettes, but just being realistic..
That's like saying your CF vs a TPI vette and it would be 'close' as the TPI only has 25 more HP (in 85).. Hardly.. It is almost a second faster in ther 1/4..
:nono:

And once again if you race someone for a mile, I dunno about your car, but usually you should be able to hit 140-150+... Get your car info and stats and speeds right, and then we can continue discussing things civilized here.. :lurk:

 

Under that intake sits a normal 350? So if I take the Holley 2 barrel 85 cfm off my '52 Ford and strap that to my L98, I'll still have a good running low end car?

First off, I think you're taking this CFI talk a little too personally, and on the same page, I think you're giving that intake a bit too much credit. It only took GM 2 years to realize it wasn't any good for making power and that it wasn't a true FI system. Even the '57's were multiport. With NICE BIG ports.

 

:nono: Know your enemy! :lol:

1979-1993 Mustangs are known as "Fox-Bodies" (4th Generation)

Year Displacement Horsepower
1983 - 1984 5.0L 4 bbl Carburetor 175hp
1985 5.0L 4 bbl Carburetor 210hp (new carb manufacturer)
1985 5.0L T.B. FI 180hp
1986-1993 5.0L SEFI Speed Density & MAF 225hp
1993 Cobra 5.0L SEFI 235hp

1994-Present are known as SN95 (5th Generation)

Year Discplacement Horsepower Torque
1994-1995 5.0L OHV 215 @ 4200 285 @ 3400
Cobra 5.0L OHV 240 @ 4200 285 @ 3400
1996-97 4.6L SOHC 215 @ 4400 285 @ 3500
Cobra 4.6L DOHC 305 @ 5800 300 @ 4800
1998 4.6L SOHC 225 @ 4750 290 @ 3500
Cobra 4.6L DOHC 305 @ 5800 300 @ 4800
1999-02 4.6L SOHC 260 @ 5250 300 @ 4000
Cobra 4.6L DOHC 320 @ 6000 317 @ 4750
2001 Bullitt 4.6L SOHC 265 @ 5250 315 @ 4000
2003 Mach I 4.6L DOHC 305 @ 5800 320 @ 4200
2003 Cobra 4.6L SC DOHC 390 @ 6000 390 @ 3500

I remembered that Horsepower TV dyno'd a 1998 Mustang and it was 171rwhp. Thats a 50+ hp loss! They put exhaust, intake, computer, and a few odds and ends and got it to 190rwhp. That was after $900+ in perfromance parts :lol:

Take Care. :flag

 

Quote:Now once again being realistic, a 215HP rustang GT with a decent driver already has 10HP over a CF vette, and could get into the high 14's stock..

I would normally agree that more HP makes a faster car. This being said, the two cars in question would probably perform very close in a straight up 1/4 mile race. Although the Mustang has a 10 Hp advantage, it also weighs about 400 more pounds that the Vette. The Vette should take the line first, do to the Torque, but it's HP peaks around 5000-55000 RPM and will
run out of steam at about 50 MPH or so, this is where the Stang should catch up. The Stang would normally be a few tenths faster but, if the driver has a manual and dosen't know how to launch, the the Automatic Vette should have a better chance, the Stang would just sit and spin while the Vette has already reached the 60' mark. As for the 4-5 car lenghths, well, the driver of the Stang really must have been a beginer, if infact he was triing to race. A lot of times, I get people reving their engines and holding the line, not to race but, just to see me take off. I guess they know Vettes are fast and want to watch it scream.

 

A crossfire vette's max HP is at 5000-5500rpms? It can even pull that far?
Never knew that.. Thought it was basically the same shortblock parts as an early TPI (85-86 1/2) with just a very crappy dual TBI intake.. :confused:

 

It was just an example, Sorry I thought I had posted that, I guess I didn't. I really didn't know what it was at the time.

 

Dude every one needs to chill, We all love corvettes here a corvette is a corvette. Regardless what year, they all are great. Now about poopiestangs, WHO CARES ok we all know vettes are way better cars. Vettes are faster better at handleing and just a better car. And my thoughts on CFI, I love mine ya i did just have to put lifters in it this week, that cost me 500.00 for labor and everything thats not bad, considering i got it for 4,000. Its a one owner never been abused. My car is fast enough I have never had trouble with many FACTORY cars. So every one chill VETTES RULE.
:chevy :chevy :chevy :chevy :chevy :chevy :chevy :chevy