Rear suspension consideration
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 317
Likes: 1
From: Maple Valley WA
Rear suspension consideration
I recently started replacing all the 120k mile rubber bushings in my rear suspension with poly and wow, what a difference. The feel for the road and the rear suspension is now greatly improved even though I've only done the control arms so far. The strut rods are next as the lateral stability of the rear end is really mushy.
It's this mushiness (don't you love the technical term?) that leads to my question. Now, I'm no engineer and I know this thing works, but I can't quite help feeling that in a rear lateral slide that undue stresses are being placed on those tie rods and that camber control could be greatly enhanced by adding some sort of strut rod to the top of the knuckle.
Any experience/thoughts on this?
Jay
It's this mushiness (don't you love the technical term?) that leads to my question. Now, I'm no engineer and I know this thing works, but I can't quite help feeling that in a rear lateral slide that undue stresses are being placed on those tie rods and that camber control could be greatly enhanced by adding some sort of strut rod to the top of the knuckle.
Any experience/thoughts on this?
Jay
Drifting
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 1,861
Likes: 4
From: Houston TX
Re: Rear suspension consideration (Mr6spd)
Your thoughts are absolutely right. That's why the C5 went to an arangement that has a top member.
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 317
Likes: 1
From: Maple Valley WA
Re: Rear suspension consideration (CorvetteZ51Racer)
So, I'm guessing nobody or no company has addressed this, right? I haven't taken a look at the rear since last weekend before I started thinking about this, but I'm going to see what it would take to add an upper strut rod to the knuckle. Any suggestions? ANyone have any pix/links of the C5's rear suspension setup?
Jay
Jay
Melting Slicks
Joined: Apr 2000
Posts: 3,198
Likes: 2
From: Northern CA
Re: Rear suspension consideration (JayH)
Not trying to dissuade you, but that sounds really tough. Our cars have 5 locating members, and your addition would be the 6th. If it's not done correctly it's just going to bind up.
Team Owner
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 24,337
Likes: 25
From: San Diego , CA Double Yellow DirtBags 1985..Z51..6-speed
Re: Rear suspension consideration (JasonL)
You'd have to free up the halfshafts somehow. Otherwise, you'd have binding as the strut rods fought against the half shaft to maintain camber.
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 317
Likes: 1
From: Maple Valley WA
Re: Rear suspension consideration (CentralCoaster)
If I were to install a strut rod for the top of the knuckle at static ride height then that rod would take the job of controlling camber away from the half-shaft and actually leave it subjected to less severe operating angles at any given moment of stress to the rear.
Since the half shaft itself does not cause any changes to camber (the cause comes from lateral force applied through the tire(s),) there would be no conflict between it and an added strut rod. No?
Jay
Since the half shaft itself does not cause any changes to camber (the cause comes from lateral force applied through the tire(s),) there would be no conflict between it and an added strut rod. No?
Jay
Burning Brakes
Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 1,013
Likes: 9
Re: Rear suspension consideration (JayH)
The C4 camber is controlled by the half shaft and the camber rod below it. To do the conversion that you are talking about, you will need to change the half shaft attachement. Either the axle housing end or the drive hub end must be changed so that the half shaft will be able to float right to left. otherwise the suspension would bind with the addition of a top link.
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Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 317
Likes: 1
From: Maple Valley WA
Re: Rear suspension consideration (Mr6spd)
...and the suspension will bind because as it cycles the distance from the point at the hub/bearing to the output yoke on the diff changes. OK
I'm guessing that the outboard end can't be made to float because the bearing assembly needs the pressure on the inner race from the stub shaft and axle nut. That leaves the inboard half shaft connection. I'll take a look at my FSM tonight to see what can be done about that.
Jay
I'm guessing that the outboard end can't be made to float because the bearing assembly needs the pressure on the inner race from the stub shaft and axle nut. That leaves the inboard half shaft connection. I'll take a look at my FSM tonight to see what can be done about that.
Jay
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 317
Likes: 1
From: Maple Valley WA
Re: Rear suspension consideration (JayH)
Nope, that won't work either. Looks like the only option is to replace the half shafts with ones that have a slip and splines built into them.
Then for the upper arm(s)...Looks like a solid bar, from knuckle to knuckle, attaching where the sway bar currently mounts and anchored to the diff would do the trick.
I'm wondering if all the extra weight and dollars would really be worth it.
Jay
Then for the upper arm(s)...Looks like a solid bar, from knuckle to knuckle, attaching where the sway bar currently mounts and anchored to the diff would do the trick.
I'm wondering if all the extra weight and dollars would really be worth it.
Jay
Burning Brakes
Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 1,013
Likes: 9
Re: Rear suspension consideration (JayH)
Here is a link to slip joint equipped half shafts (used for Viper upgrades):
http://www.gounitrax.com/UNITRAX/pages/viper.html
So that part is easy.
http://www.gounitrax.com/UNITRAX/pages/viper.html
So that part is easy.
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 317
Likes: 1
From: Maple Valley WA
Re: Rear suspension consideration (Mr6spd)
Thanks for the link but I bet I can get those fabbed at a local driveline shop for a lot less $$ than unitrax wants.
The hard part is finding a suitable way to attach the new arm at the diff... :crazy:
Jay
The hard part is finding a suitable way to attach the new arm at the diff... :crazy:
Jay
Melting Slicks
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 2,148
Likes: 1
From: Chandler AZ
Re: Rear suspension consideration (JayH)
You're talking about tons of work to fix something that ain't broken. With solid bushing, adjustable camber rods, and the right shock / spring rates, I can corner almost 1g on street tires.
If you're generating more side load cause you're running Hoosier RS303 slicks, replace your U-joints, then goto Exotic Muscle and pick up heim-jointed camber rods, toe rods, and trailing links. These will not deflect- period! You should also do offest bushings up front for more neg camber. And at this point (if you're a decent driver) you will be leaving C-5's in the dust....
If you're generating more side load cause you're running Hoosier RS303 slicks, replace your U-joints, then goto Exotic Muscle and pick up heim-jointed camber rods, toe rods, and trailing links. These will not deflect- period! You should also do offest bushings up front for more neg camber. And at this point (if you're a decent driver) you will be leaving C-5's in the dust....