Sorry, another air conditioning question.
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 407
Likes: 0
From: Alma AR
Sorry, another air conditioning question.
When I got my 1990 Coupe out of staorage the air conditioning wouldn't cool the car. The automatic sensor turns the fan on high. That leads me to believe that it's trying to cool the car, but the system is out of coolant.
If this is the case, can I determine this myself without going to a shop? Also, since all the R-12 is now gone, what kind of replacement do you recommend. I've heard of a product called envirosafe (ES-12a) that is compatable with the oil in the system. I know that R134A needs to have the oil changed, and I'd rather not do that. Lastly, since the system has been vented to the atmosphere for an unknown amount of time, should I replace the accumulater/dryer? Thanks for any help anyone can give me.
If this is the case, can I determine this myself without going to a shop? Also, since all the R-12 is now gone, what kind of replacement do you recommend. I've heard of a product called envirosafe (ES-12a) that is compatable with the oil in the system. I know that R134A needs to have the oil changed, and I'd rather not do that. Lastly, since the system has been vented to the atmosphere for an unknown amount of time, should I replace the accumulater/dryer? Thanks for any help anyone can give me.
Burning Brakes
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 811
Likes: 0
From: OH
St. Jude Donor '06-'07-'08-'09
Re: Sorry, another air conditioning question. (PBnf)
You can have your A/C system recharged with R12 - it is still available - even though it is no longer made in the US. There is a lot of virgin and reclaimed R12 out there. After 13 years, it would be a good idea to change the accumulator anyway - they do not last forever. The conversion to 134 is not that big of a deal if you have a competent shop do it. I had my 86 coupe converted last year at the dealership I bought it from. Despite what manufacturers may say - there is no direct drop in replacement for R12. Even if it is compatible with the mineral oil used with R12, by law the charge fittings have to be changed to a unique connector. If you change to one of the alternative refrigerants - you may not be able to have your A/C system serviced by any service center because they may not have the equipment necessary to hook up to the alternative fittings. If you convert, stick with 134, any A/C shop in America will be able to work on it then.
Check out http://www.aircondition.com - there are some really helpful people there.
Dan
[Modified by nitrous1, 4:17 PM 7/4/2003]
[Modified by nitrous1, 4:19 PM 7/4/2003]
Check out http://www.aircondition.com - there are some really helpful people there.
Dan
[Modified by nitrous1, 4:17 PM 7/4/2003]
[Modified by nitrous1, 4:19 PM 7/4/2003]
Le Mans Master
Joined: Apr 2000
Posts: 5,589
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From: DrunkDefender
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St. Jude Donor '07-'10
Re: Sorry, another air conditioning question. (PBnf)
I'd go ahead and swap it over to 134 with a retro kit. I think they are about $30 from the dealer.
Racer
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 308
Likes: 0
From: San Antonio TX
Re: Sorry, another air conditioning question. (Dr. Evil)
My advice, stay away from the retrofit kits. Without any knowledge or advice I used one on my wife's old van. It worked great for a while. I told my stepfather about it, who is an ASE Certified Master Mechanic, he said the 134 is not compatible with the seals and o-rings in a R12 system and over time will eat them up. After about 6-8 months of cold A/C mine quit and would not hold another charge.
I would suggest taking it to a shop and having it properly converted, which consists of new connectors, seals, o-rings, and a full charge. Not sure how much $ though, I just got rid of the van. I'm in Southcentral Texas so A/C is a must.
The A/C mishap cost me the price of a '03 Jeep Liberty :confused: .
I would suggest taking it to a shop and having it properly converted, which consists of new connectors, seals, o-rings, and a full charge. Not sure how much $ though, I just got rid of the van. I'm in Southcentral Texas so A/C is a must.
The A/C mishap cost me the price of a '03 Jeep Liberty :confused: .
Le Mans Master
Joined: Apr 2000
Posts: 5,589
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From: DrunkDefender
CI 1-2-3-4-5-6-7-8 Veteran
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St. Jude Donor '07-'10
Re: Sorry, another air conditioning question. (HapAFcop)
HapAFcop, security police right? I'm in CE but I did a year as an augmentee with our SP unit here. Interesting work but back on topic. When I say the retro kit I mean if you're going to do it, do it right and go ahead and change everything. The kit is just one more thing to buy. Usually if the compressor lets go on one that old the accumulator is bad too. Might as well do it all and not worry about it. I know its exspensive but its better than no AC or having it back in the shop again.
Racer
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 308
Likes: 0
From: San Antonio TX
Re: Sorry, another air conditioning question. (Dr. Evil)
How ya doin'? Good to meet another AF vette owner. I just got mine and I'm lovin' it. Yes, I'm an SP and in 15 years I've had to rely on my brothers and sisters in CE many times; so, THANKS! :flag
I was talking about one of the $25-$30 do-it-yourself kits you can buy at Wal-Mart or Autozone. I used one without knowing any better. STAY AWAY FROM THOSE KITS. :reddevil
I was talking about one of the $25-$30 do-it-yourself kits you can buy at Wal-Mart or Autozone. I used one without knowing any better. STAY AWAY FROM THOSE KITS. :reddevil
Pro
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 715
Likes: 0
From: Warner Robins GA
Re: Sorry, another air conditioning question. (PBnf)
I've heard of people having problems after being told they can simply use the retrofit kit and be done with it. Usually it runs great at first then the o-rings disintegrate.
On my dad's truck a few years ago, we did quite a few things to make sure it was done right. We changed all the o-rings, changed the accumlator dryer and orifice tube, emptied the compressor and flushed the system to get rid of the R12, vacuumed it down, then charged it.
O-rings should cost a couple of bucks. Accumulator should be about 25, orifice tube is 2 for a regular or about 20 for a variable. We had to pay someone about 40 bucks because we didn't have the chemicals to flush it ourselves, but we vacuumed it down ourselves. The oil and coolant was about 20 bucks altogether.
This was about 3 years ago and it hasn't given us any problems yet. It should be less than 100 bucks if you have the equipment to do most of the labor yourself.
On my dad's truck a few years ago, we did quite a few things to make sure it was done right. We changed all the o-rings, changed the accumlator dryer and orifice tube, emptied the compressor and flushed the system to get rid of the R12, vacuumed it down, then charged it.
O-rings should cost a couple of bucks. Accumulator should be about 25, orifice tube is 2 for a regular or about 20 for a variable. We had to pay someone about 40 bucks because we didn't have the chemicals to flush it ourselves, but we vacuumed it down ourselves. The oil and coolant was about 20 bucks altogether.
This was about 3 years ago and it hasn't given us any problems yet. It should be less than 100 bucks if you have the equipment to do most of the labor yourself.
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Drifting
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 1,292
Likes: 0
From: Beavercreek OR
Re: Sorry, another air conditioning question. (PBnf)
I may be wrong , but I've been told freeze 12 is a compatible direct replacement and works well. However, I stuck with the r-12 anyway :flag
Le Mans Master
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 7,839
Likes: 22
From: San Diego, Ca
Re: Sorry, another air conditioning question. (hngacurv)
Frezze 12 is 80% R134; never understood any reason to use it in lieu of just doing an R134 conversion. It needs to go into an "empty" system; failure to use a compatible oil or changing out the accumulator can lead to same "black goo" that you can end up with if you don't do this with an R134 conversion. As posted earlier, if you do use it, no shop is going to touch your a/c system; so what's the advantage? To me, it's better to find out why the old stuff leaked out first, fix the leak, and then do the conversion or stick with the old.