Short shifter choices
Thread Starter
Burning Brakes
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,228
Likes: 1
From: Dallas Texas
Short shifter choices
I am trying to decide between the B&M Ripper Shifter and the Hurst Billet/Plus short shifters. I read the tech articles and from that it seems the Hurst is the better choice, but it seems the only fault of the B&M is the effort too high. If you guys with either of these shifters could let me know their opinion, I'd really appreciate it. Also, a pic of a B&M installed would be great, I an curious where the shifter handle is with it's large throw reduction.
PS, I already tried search and didn't get much on the B&M.
Thanks!
PS, I already tried search and didn't get much on the B&M.
Thanks!
Burning Brakes
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 998
Likes: 8
I'm curious on this too. Do either of these shifters reduce shift throws while maintaining the stock shift row effort? I would not get a short throw if it changed the effort on my 6 speed. Right now, I could be rolling to a stop light from 3rd or 4th gear, and just tap the stick out of gear and it slides into neutral so smoothly. I don't want to lose that quality.
Thread Starter
Burning Brakes
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,228
Likes: 1
From: Dallas Texas
Both short shifters will increase effort. From what I've read, the Hurst increases effort 1.4x and the B&M increases 2.5x. I've never shifted a stocker, so I don't know what would be considered acceptable, but personally I would not mind some extra effort.
Race Director
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 11,671
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From: Lake Wylie SC
You're going to see two sides to this question. It's like Ford vs Chevy each side is sure theirs is best. I'm on the Hurst side and love the throw and feel. I play at auto-X and the shifter makes things quicker and more positive. My advice is to try and drive a C4 with each shifter. We all know that's almost impossible. So, my next piece of advice is to look at both shifters, lay them side by side and you'll see a difference. Besides, the Hurst shifter *****, white and black, are 
.
.
Last edited by Strick; Nov 23, 2004 at 01:09 PM.
Thread Starter
Burning Brakes
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,228
Likes: 1
From: Dallas Texas
Originally Posted by 96GS#007
Religion and politics would be easier to discuss.
On that note, anyone in the Seattle area who will let me play with their shifter?
I'm actually leaning to the hurst side myself, but I have just not heard or read much about the B&M so I didn't want to charge ahead without hearing the other side.
Last edited by ninetyfivevette; Nov 23, 2004 at 01:08 PM.
Team Owner
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 40,156
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From: San Pedro CA
I have the Hurst, and I love it...
however, there does seem to be a factional issue here... the drag guys prefer the B&M, the road course/autocross guys prefer the Hurst.
I suspect, from what I have read, that because the B&M is even more firm than the Hurst, fatigue comes into play - drags are 1/4 mile at a time, autocross and such are many shifts, up and down.
As suggested, try them both out.
There is no difference in installation... they are both a bitch, and best saved for when the clutch is replaced - just a thought.
however, there does seem to be a factional issue here... the drag guys prefer the B&M, the road course/autocross guys prefer the Hurst.
I suspect, from what I have read, that because the B&M is even more firm than the Hurst, fatigue comes into play - drags are 1/4 mile at a time, autocross and such are many shifts, up and down.
As suggested, try them both out.
There is no difference in installation... they are both a bitch, and best saved for when the clutch is replaced - just a thought.
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Team Owner
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From: I'm the walkin dude I can see all of the world...
St. Jude Donor '03
Originally Posted by 96GS#007
Religion and politics would be easier to discuss.
You need to find a couple cars that you can sample. This is definitely a personal preference item.
You need to find a couple cars that you can sample. This is definitely a personal preference item.
I am a Hurst man though.
Thread Starter
Burning Brakes
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,228
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From: Dallas Texas
I like the look of Strick's Hurst setup. If someone would post of pic of their B&M, that would be great. I really appreceiate the replies guys.
Luckily I will be installing the shifter with the trans out of the car since I am doing a ZF6 swap.
Luckily I will be installing the shifter with the trans out of the car since I am doing a ZF6 swap.
Burning Brakes
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 994
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From: Jamison PA
Originally Posted by bogus
I have the Hurst, and I love it...
however, there does seem to be a factional issue here... the drag guys prefer the B&M, the road course/autocross guys prefer the Hurst.
however, there does seem to be a factional issue here... the drag guys prefer the B&M, the road course/autocross guys prefer the Hurst.
Elite Torch Red Member
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From: Exit 89 GSP,Lakewood,NJ The Land Of Mojo
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St. Jude Donor '03-'04-'05-'06-'07
I've driven both, when I do it, it will be a Hurst.
Melting Slicks
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 3,375
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From: Northern CA
I put a Hurst in my 96. It is what the stock shifter should have been. Effort is up a bit but it's not something I notice. I do notice the greatly reduced shift throw and slightly lower shift ****. The lower shift **** is now where it should have been.
Funny part is, had the factory designed their shift lever and mechanism like the Hurst, it would have been a bit cheaper to build in addition to performing better.
I have played around a bit grabbing the Hurst lever about 1/2 way down to simulate an ultra short throw shifter like the B&M. I don't think a B&M would pose any problem, but it wouldn't be quite as pleasant as the Hurst.
No matter what you want out of your shifter, I don't think you can go wrong with the Hurst. There is real but small chance that the B&M might seem excessive.
One thing to consider is that neither one narrows the shift pattern as much as it shortens it. The BM pattern will end up wider in proportion to it's short throw than the Hurst or a stock one.
Funny part is, had the factory designed their shift lever and mechanism like the Hurst, it would have been a bit cheaper to build in addition to performing better.
I have played around a bit grabbing the Hurst lever about 1/2 way down to simulate an ultra short throw shifter like the B&M. I don't think a B&M would pose any problem, but it wouldn't be quite as pleasant as the Hurst.
No matter what you want out of your shifter, I don't think you can go wrong with the Hurst. There is real but small chance that the B&M might seem excessive.
One thing to consider is that neither one narrows the shift pattern as much as it shortens it. The BM pattern will end up wider in proportion to it's short throw than the Hurst or a stock one.
Drifting
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 1,485
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From: Champaign, IL
St. Jude Donor '05
My friend has a B&M shifter in his Grand Sport and it's sweet. 
Just sitting in the car or driving the car normally it feels like it's taking a noticible amount of effort to shift but there's a firm crisp snap when it goes into gear. I autocrossed his car Sunday and before racing I was worried but as soon as I was out on the course it felt great and I never noticed it the rest of the day.
it's nice to have good friends when your car is in the shop all summer
Just sitting in the car or driving the car normally it feels like it's taking a noticible amount of effort to shift but there's a firm crisp snap when it goes into gear. I autocrossed his car Sunday and before racing I was worried but as soon as I was out on the course it felt great and I never noticed it the rest of the day. it's nice to have good friends when your car is in the shop all summer
Advanced
Joined: Aug 2001
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From: Wailuku Hawaii
There's one more choice that's between the Hurst and the B&M. White Racing Products makes another one, but it takes more work to install and requires a small modification to the transmission housing.
I have the Hurst and it's a nice improvement over stock. I think a little shorter throw would be nice though. I'm thinking installing the Hurst shift ball may have an effect of shortening the throw a little because the stock **** is tall.
I have the Hurst and it's a nice improvement over stock. I think a little shorter throw would be nice though. I'm thinking installing the Hurst shift ball may have an effect of shortening the throw a little because the stock **** is tall.
Drifting
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 1,477
Likes: 87
Originally Posted by Skippy
The B&M shifter throw is unbelievably short and positive compared to the stock shifter. And yes, the effort is quite a bit more than stock also.
Thread Starter
Burning Brakes
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,228
Likes: 1
From: Dallas Texas
Thanks a lot guys. I ended up going with the Hurst and a Hurst shifter ball off ebay last night. It was fairly inexpensive, 107 for the shifter and 28 for the ball. Gotta love ebay
Team Owner
Joined: Oct 2004
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From: altered state
St. Jude Donor '05
Originally Posted by ninetyfivevette
Both short shifters will increase effort. From what I've read, the Hurst increases effort 1.4x and the B&M increases 2.5x. I've never shifted a stocker, so I don't know what would be considered acceptable, but personally I would not mind some extra effort.
Put a Ripper on my T-56-Love it!