When you click on links to various merchants on this site and make a purchase, this can result in this site earning a commission. Affiliate programs and affiliations include, but are not limited to, the eBay Partner Network.
While a valid way to conduct the factory cam timing. You can be up to 3 degrees off in either direction if you do it this way. There is that much play in the sprocket pins. My driver side Intake cam was a full 3 degrees off at 117 degrees. With that kind of investment in an a engine. Take your time and do it right. It’s not hard.
H
Now wait a second here....is ^that^ procedure in the FSM? I'm confused.
Now wait a second here....is ^that^ procedure in the FSM? I'm confused.
Ron, I apologize for hijacking your thread...... Tom, since you poked your nose into this tread I will give you my “opinion” on this subject. You can take it or leave it. I worked in the Automotive business for 40 years. Thirty of that with Mercedes-Benz. Many years of that time was spent as a factory rep supporting dealers with technical problems. Virtually every single time I got to a dealer with an “unsolvable” technical problem it turned out that the “professional” technician had tried to short cut the diagnostic procedure in the manual because he thought he knew it better. We would ask, did you do this per the manual... no. Did you do that per the manual.... no. We would then back track through the diagnostic procedure and sure enough problem solved. Did the short cuts sometimes work, sure. Did the procedure in the manual always find the problem, no not always. But I can tell you the manual was more often than not right.
By telling people the manual is irrelevant because you know it all is both foolish and doing a disservice to people who truly, like the OP in the other thread, don’t know what they are doing. It sould be the the basis for any diagnosis. Anything else is just guesswork. Neither you nor I know more than the engineers that wrote that manual. There are people like Cliff (Dynomite) who through much trial, error and research have learned their way around an LT5 engine and become experts. In my opinion however even Cliff would have become an expert much faster had he used the manual early on.
So please, can we put this BS to rest and at least agree to disagree?
H
By telling people the manual is irrelevant because you know it all is both foolish and doing a disservice
Neither you nor I know more than the engineers that wrote that manual.
So please, can we put this BS to rest and at least agree to disagree?
I don't think we need to. What we need to do, is actually read what each other is actually typing.
1. I don't believe that I ever said that "the manual is irrelevant". In fact, I don't think that I said anything remotely close to, or similar to that. If I did...please quote where I said that so that I can fix it, would you?
2. You're right. Neither you or I know more than then engineers who wrote it. I completely agree. So why are you advocating a non-FSM cam timing procedure? Because you KNOW. Other people know some stuff too. I simply said, essentially, that not everyone needs an FSM for every thing; some can diagnose w/o the FSM. IDK why, but even though we'd successfully proven that in the other thread, it escalated from there.
Then I come on this thread (not for reasons re: the FSM) and I see you advocate a non FSM procedure, and DD taking interest. See what I'm seeing?
I totally agree that the FSM is a valuable tool (and I've clearly stated that already, several times), especially for less experienced folks. Totally agree. I'm good about the damn FSM. As you were.
This is NOT hijacking Ron's thread but adding to the information for Ron and others.....
I did use a manual early on and less now since I have posted most of that information in one form or other as part of my signature.
Also...…...some 60 text messages more or less to Marc Haibeck over time with specific technical questions of which Marc ALWAYS responds over night incorporating the information in some form or other in some 300 posts cited in my signature (Thank you Marc)
Also...….most prolly do not remember Jeffvette who was my original mentor who IS an expert of experts on the LT5 and who occasionally corrects me in text messages when he sees I am in need of additional information (Thank you Jeff)
The technical information in my signature changes from time to time as experimentation leads to new and interesting ways to diagnose, modify or repair LT5 components and systems
Hans mentions Trial and error...…..I once dropped a Throttle Cable Screw into the injector housing which screw ended up rattling around in a cylinder (had to pull engine and replace one Cylinder liner, Piston, rings, rod bolts) but in process experimented with new ways to pull, time, install the engine with headers attached
Thanks for sharing this Cliff. Jeff and the rest of Team LT5 just got done campaigning our race car with the LT5 @ Laguna Seca for Lucky Dog this weekend. Still dialing it in - but we had the pleasure of having Randy Pobst drive for 30 min - and he set the weekend's fastest lap time!! We are pleased! Randy is a true gentleman!
Thanks for sharing this Cliff. Jeff and the rest of Team LT5 just got done campaigning our race car with the LT5 @ Laguna Seca for Lucky Dog this weekend. Still dialing it in - but we had the pleasure of having Randy Pobst drive for 30 min - and he set the weekend's fastest lap time!! We are pleased! Randy is a true gentleman!
I have the factory service manuals and they are indispensable. Also I know the guy who "wrote the book:" pretty good too. But even with the manual I found it helpful to just search around and get some good old real world experience and help out the WAZOO guys do a few pulls. It's a pretty big job and I have to admit although it's satisfying to do the work, I'd rather have the fold to hand it back over to talent like JL who put it together.
It's great seeing the quality parts and getting my hands dirty. Yesterday the tranny came out and I also stabbed a distributor in the old 68 convert and sold it. That will help pay for getting the LPE back on the road
time to order up some MLS gaskets from Marc
I'll miss the old gal, she had the looks but not the moves
Hey Ronny - we are running Marc's gaskets on the race car - they work great! What a wonderful thing Marc has done for us by getting those produced! Sorry to hear that the LSV is down - but you'll have her purring again soon!
Hey Ronny - we are running Marc's gaskets on the race car - they work great! What a wonderful thing Marc has done for us by getting those produced! Sorry to hear that the LSV is down - but you'll have her purring again soon!
engine is out. clutch and flywheel look really good but I'm looking to upgrade there. headers need to be stripped and recoated, new intake and cam cover, dress up,, new bolts,
I have some new coils but I'm nervous as they seem to be modern china junk repo
any really hot coils and spark plug wires? I used magnecores and I loved the performance but they started to "clunk" after only 3 years. time for new ones.
MLS gaskets for sure, a bit more compression, porting, and looking to optimized cam timing and see if I can sneak up on 540 rwhp
Thanks for sharing this Cliff. Jeff and the rest of Team LT5 just got done campaigning our race car with the LT5 @ Laguna Seca for Lucky Dog this weekend. Still dialing it in - but we had the pleasure of having Randy Pobst drive for 30 min - and he set the weekend's fastest lap time!! We are pleased! Randy is a true gentleman!
Dwight, Glad to hear the race car ran well. There's more left in it, I'm sure.
Ron, good luck man. I assume you're leaving the bottom end untouched, and just tweaking the top end a bit?
Thanks for sharing this Cliff. Jeff and the rest of Team LT5 just got done campaigning our race car with the LT5 @ Laguna Seca for Lucky Dog this weekend. Still dialing it in - but we had the pleasure of having Randy Pobst drive for 30 min - and he set the weekend's fastest lap time!! We are pleased! Randy is a true gentleman!
Hello Dwight!
Been a while since I seen you posting in here... Dont know if you remember me when I was at the 2009 gathering...That was the year Graham Behan presented the prototype engines... Cool stuff... Jeff was cool enough to let me shack up in his hotel room since the rooms were sold out.. You, your brother, Jeff and myself had dinner at the Outback maybe.... IIRC... Also hung around Beech Bend a day or 2 after and watched the white ZR-1 rip a few 10 sec 1/4 times. Was that Franks car?? I also met with the OP Ron at Beech Bend...
Sorry for getting off course here guys.... Tomorrow I will meet with Hans, Paul Workman and several other members for the first annual RMR Rocky mountain Run.... Looking forward to it....
engine is out. clutch and flywheel look really good but I'm looking to upgrade there. headers need to be stripped and recoated, new intake and cam cover, dress up,, new bolts,
I have some new coils but I'm nervous as they seem to be modern china junk repo
any really hot coils and spark plug wires? I used magnecores and I loved the performance but they started to "clunk" after only 3 years. time for new ones.
MLS gaskets for sure, a bit more compression, porting, and looking to optimized cam timing and see if I can sneak up on 540 rwhp
Hey Ron - why not just go with the stock units from GM for the coils? They work great! When I tried some aftermarket stuff, only had misery. Why not AC Delco spark plug wires? Lemme know if you can't source them. I might know someone who bought about 20 sets!
Are Marc's gaskets a bit thinner than stock? Is that where your increased CR is coming from? If not, how are you planning to increase the CR? Keep us updated!
Hello Dwight!
Been a while since I seen you posting in here... Dont know if you remember me when I was at the 2009 gathering...That was the year Graham Behan presented the prototype engines... Cool stuff... Jeff was cool enough to let me shack up in his hotel room since the rooms were sold out.. You, your brother, Jeff and myself had dinner at the Outback maybe.... IIRC... Also hung around Beech Bend a day or 2 after and watched the white ZR-1 rip a few 10 sec 1/4 times. Was that Franks car?? I also met with the OP Ron at Beech Bend...
Sorry for getting off course here guys.... Tomorrow I will meet with Hans, Paul Workman and several other members for the first annual RMR Rocky mountain Run.... Looking forward to it....
John
Hey John - it's been a while, hasn't it? I remember Frank's car breaking a U joint and having JVD take care of business for him. Ron would have had his baseball cap on and a smile on his face! The only thing that interrupts that smile is a 415 blasting by on the drive back to the hotel from the Museum! LOL
Enjoy the Rocky Mountain Run - looks like it should be a good time!
Dwight, Glad to hear the race car ran well. There's more left in it, I'm sure.
Hey Todd,
Thanks for the quick work with the chip! Yeah - funny how not having the ground connected to the engine can cause issues! Once we got the secondaries actually delivering fuel, we got our power back! She's about 11:1 AFR at the moment, and roughly 385 RWHP, so we have a lot of leaning out to do with you, and then we should see at least 50 crank hp! Randy sure liked it! His first comment once he came around 11 and onto the front straight: "WOW - this thing is a ROCKET!!! WooHoo! Bye bye people!!!" as he passes 5 cars! LOL
See video of our 4th driver Cem: this is during qualifying:
engine is out. clutch and flywheel look really good but I'm looking to upgrade there. headers need to be stripped and recoated, new intake and cam cover, dress up,, new bolts,
I have some new coils but I'm nervous as they seem to be modern china junk repo
any really hot coils and spark plug wires? I used magnecores and I loved the performance but they started to "clunk" after only 3 years. time for new ones.
MLS gaskets for sure, a bit more compression, porting, and looking to optimized cam timing and see if I can sneak up on 540 rwhp
Ron,
If you can find them, I would use the MSD coils. Had them in the motor for over 10 years. Not a hiccup. Also, I have a set of the MSD 8.5 wires which are NLA from MSD. I did swap them out for the Magnacors from Ligenfelter just to try something else. If u r interested in the MSD wires let me know.
If you can find them, I would use the MSD coils. Had them in the motor for over 10 years. Not a hiccup. Also, I have a set of the MSD 8.5 wires which are NLA from MSD. I did swap them out for the Magnacors from Ligenfelter just to try something else. If u r interested in the MSD wires let me know.
update, the LT5 now has the cam covers off and is getting freshended up. we looked at the secondaries and they were mildly ported. good bless those checker *****. Evolution (Demps) will be doing the build. We are planning on the following and would LOVE feedback as there is wisdom in many council
1. Port heads, the secondary is around 34 so it has some room to grow
2. New rings and bearings The old gal has 104k miles and it's worth it to freshen it up and look things over
3. Eliminate EGR and update headers. The headers are pretty nasty with the coating starting to peel, the EGR stuff will be removed and the holes welded/plugged (cleaner) That EGR bracket is cast iron and strong enough to pull a truck. Must weigh 10 lbs to route a bit of exh gas. Hmmm.... weight is hiding here.
4. Of course a fresh finish. I'm saying goodbye to those old sigs from the "big 3" but as I told Demps, this beast has the heart of a dragon and will be breathing fire and have the looks to match.
5. Dress up bolts
Soooooo...... to help pay for all of this I'll be selling off some stuff
EGR setup, cam cover bolts, and some old rare stuff coming out of hiding to help support the build
Thanks very much for advice. I think for now I may go with the stock coils already in there and just throw some stock GM wires on it. They work and they are cheap.
My clutch disk looks great but as many will attest, the fidanza with a stock disk just isn't quite up to the task at the drag strip.
I think at this point I'm going to just replace the clutch disk and stay with the fidanza, I'm interested in the RAM 9.5 dual disk, but some folks are reporting issues, and I think one aspect of the "survival of parts" at this level is the low intertia fidanza combined with a bit of clutch slip off the line. Love to hear feedback here.
heads haven't come off yet but showed tell tale signs of blown head gasket
heads are off and I'll post up some pics. pan is coming off and we'll pull the pistons and rods and clean the old gal up for the next dance.
I've been steady scraping about 10 lbs of grease off the LSV from many miles of smiles, long over due. Radiator was serviced 4 years ago and was about 40 percent clogged up
new dewitts fans going in to hopefully tame the beast with the AC on which has been a challenge. We hope to scare up a few new furry ponies while were at it as the porting reflected pretty conservative tech back in the day.
I did notice a bit of minor pitting on the cam lobe, but lifter looked pretty good so it will soldier on. cam chain guide cracked, leaking dowdy washer, and even with the new pan gasket, pan was leaking again.
I looked over the front bolt on nerf bar and it's a bit rusty and WAY too heavy, and overall the frame was groty. Love to fab up something a bit more reasonable as taking weight off the nose of the car is a very good thing.
overall the frame is now all spiffy clean now and ready to host the heart of the beast and hopefully wear out some tires soon
my summer cruising is a bit down on vettes as the 68 sold, and the 2003 tt needs some attention as well. Time to turn lemons into lemonade, the dragon heart will have a very new look sans sigs, but I'm not out to please collectors, this LSV stays with me!!
07-14-2018, 07:48 PM
