Advice/Help!
Le Mans Master
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 7,088
Likes: 1,829
From: Metro Detroit Michigan
Originally Posted by goinpostol
I have already postponed a wedding...
Good luck sneaking mod money out of your wife's purse once you're married.
There was a whole thread about this a while ago.......ways to sneak mods past the wife. Secret bank accounts, having parts delivered to work instead of home, "having some new hoses put on" (turbo install) etc.
Last edited by Warp Factor; May 26, 2006 at 02:52 PM.
Thread Starter
Instructor
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 228
Likes: 0
From: Seven Valleys Pennsylvania
I cut one of our first dates short because I got a call that my Procharger had arrived at home. I rushed her through lunch so that I could get home to open the package. She still doesen't get it
Premium Supporting Vendor
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 5,241
Likes: 21
From: Knoxville Tennessee
I prefer JE pistons and Crower Rods.
You can get a set of JE's custom made with rings for about $900, Crower Rods are about $540 per set.
I would not waste your money on pistons if you are not going to lower the compression some. It is a good idea to lower it some. Even with off the shelf pistons you are going to be able to easily get to 9.5:1
DO NOT waste your money on some exotic head gaskets... you can get a pair of GM MLS head gaskets from summit for $30.
Good head studs, rods and pistons will be your friend. The head studs are expensive, but VERY worth it IMO.
This is like anything.. you will get 100 different opinions from 100 different people. I build my own stuff. I know what I like to use and I know what I have used.
You can get a set of JE's custom made with rings for about $900, Crower Rods are about $540 per set.
I would not waste your money on pistons if you are not going to lower the compression some. It is a good idea to lower it some. Even with off the shelf pistons you are going to be able to easily get to 9.5:1
DO NOT waste your money on some exotic head gaskets... you can get a pair of GM MLS head gaskets from summit for $30.
Good head studs, rods and pistons will be your friend. The head studs are expensive, but VERY worth it IMO.
This is like anything.. you will get 100 different opinions from 100 different people. I build my own stuff. I know what I like to use and I know what I have used.
Thread Starter
Instructor
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 228
Likes: 0
From: Seven Valleys Pennsylvania
Originally Posted by chriswtx
Also there was a thread a while back where ECS and A&A both said they have seen stock rods bend on FI motors and neither will use stock rods anymore for boost...
Eagle 6.125" Ibeam SIR6125BBLW $215 from flatlander racing
Eagle 6.125" Ibeam SIR6125BBLW $215 from flatlander racing
Thanks alot
I went to their web site which had a ton of info/deals however I'm not sure these rods will work for LS1 since they don't come up under LS1 options...
Le Mans Master
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 5,970
Likes: 20
From: San Marcos Texas
Yes, there not LS1 specific rods but they will work. Most of the guys on LS1tech are not running on center LS1 rods. You can get the LS1 on center specific Hbeams CRS6125O3D on sale for $385 from http://www.trtturbo.com/ ask for Billy he can order them for you.
Here is Eagle rods parts list for the LS1 right off their web site..
http://www.eaglerod.com/products/Che...S1%20rods.html
"SIR" I-beam connecting rods
part no. length pin notes and options price
SIR6125BBLW 6.125" bushed .927" wrist pin 265.33
SIR6200BBLW 6.200" bushed .927" wrist pin 305.33
SIR6250BBLW 6.250" bushed .927" wrist pin 305.33
"ESP" H-beam connecting rods
part no. length notes and options price
CRS6100L3D 6.100" Stock length LS1 rod. Uses .927" wrist pin 625.33
CRS6125B3D 6.125" .927" wrist pin 502.67
CRS6200B3D 6.200" .927" wrist pin 625.33
CRS6250B3D 6.250" .927" wrist pin 625.33
CRS6300B3D 6.300" .927" wrist pin 625.33
CRS6125BLW 6.125" .927" wrist pin, lightweight, 550g 625.33
CRS6200BLW 6.200" .927" wrist pin, lightweight, 560g 625.33
CRS6250BLW 6.250" .927" wrist pin, lightweight, 570g 625.33
"ESP" on-center H-beam connecting rods
part no. length notes and options price
CRS6125O3D 6.125" Uses .927" wrist pin call
CRS6200O3D 6.200" Uses .927" wrist pin call
Here is Eagle rods parts list for the LS1 right off their web site..
http://www.eaglerod.com/products/Che...S1%20rods.html
"SIR" I-beam connecting rods
part no. length pin notes and options price
SIR6125BBLW 6.125" bushed .927" wrist pin 265.33
SIR6200BBLW 6.200" bushed .927" wrist pin 305.33
SIR6250BBLW 6.250" bushed .927" wrist pin 305.33
"ESP" H-beam connecting rods
part no. length notes and options price
CRS6100L3D 6.100" Stock length LS1 rod. Uses .927" wrist pin 625.33
CRS6125B3D 6.125" .927" wrist pin 502.67
CRS6200B3D 6.200" .927" wrist pin 625.33
CRS6250B3D 6.250" .927" wrist pin 625.33
CRS6300B3D 6.300" .927" wrist pin 625.33
CRS6125BLW 6.125" .927" wrist pin, lightweight, 550g 625.33
CRS6200BLW 6.200" .927" wrist pin, lightweight, 560g 625.33
CRS6250BLW 6.250" .927" wrist pin, lightweight, 570g 625.33
"ESP" on-center H-beam connecting rods
part no. length notes and options price
CRS6125O3D 6.125" Uses .927" wrist pin call
CRS6200O3D 6.200" Uses .927" wrist pin call
Corvette Stories
The Best of Corvette for Corvette Enthusiasts
Top 10 Most Expensive Corvettes Ever Sold on Bring A Trailer
Brett Foote
10 Things Every Corvette Owner Needs (2026 Edition)
Michael S. Palmer
8 Most "Only Corvette Owners Understand" Quirks and Problems
Pouria Savadkouei
10 Reasons the C6 Z06 is Still A Performance Benchmark After 20 Years
Joe Kucinski
How Much Horsepower Every Corvette Engine "LOST" in 1972
Joe Kucinski
Top 10 DOs and DON'Ts for Protecting Your Convertible Top!
Michael S. Palmer
Top 10 Most Explosive Corvettes Ever Made: Power-to-Weight Ratio Ranked!
Joe Kucinski
150 hp to 1,250 hp: Every Corvette Generation Compared by the Specs That Matter
Joe Kucinski
8 Coolest Corvette Pace Cars (and Replicas) of All Time
Verdad Gallardo
Le Mans Master
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 5,970
Likes: 20
From: San Marcos Texas
Originally Posted by mdhmi
My rods were $700. Just seems like the wrong area to cheap out. Just my .02.
Mark
Mark
Why?
Anything over $550 for rods is a waste of money. When have you ever seen a blown LS1 motor because of a failed aftermarket rod....
Never. Plenty of guys running 1000+hp with inexpensive Eagle, Scat, Compstars, never seen a motor lost because of a rod failure....
What is the difference between an on center and otherwise, and what are the advantages/disadvantages?
The on center is refering to the an offset that they make between the small end of the rod and the large end. Early Chevys had the cylinder bores offset a little from the crank throws, the LS1 cylinders are on center with the crank throws..Pushing the pin in the center reduces side loading on both the piston and rod bearings. The big ends are offset to compensate for the fact that the cylinder bores are .035" out of step in a fore-aft direction when compared to the crank journals (both the rod and main bearing journals). The piston pin is offset laterally (if you view the engine from the back or the front). The idea with the piston pin offset is to allow the piston to rock back and forth in a more gentle manner (as opposed to slapping back and forth) as the piston transitions through top and bottom dead center. Of course this problem is more pronounced when everything is cold and not up to operating temperature because the piston to cylinder wall clearance is much greater when cold.
Quote form HPE
Offset pins are for noise reduction in OEM pistons when they are cold. It causes the pistons to be able to rock over at TDC in a very nice and controlled manner this greatly reducing any cold piston noise when the clearances are still greater than normal running temp.
On-Center rods like the ones I got Eagle to start making and selling for our little LS1 are different from the normal SBC rods which are NOT on-center but are offset sideways at the big end since the cylinder bore off set is less that the width of the rod journals. The SBC cylinders are off set or set back from bank to band around .880 and yet the rod journal width is 1.900 and half of that is .950 so the difference in rod width and cylinder bore offset is .070 or .035-ish per rod.
On the LS1 the rods are centered on their big ends and have no chamfer on the sides since the LS1 cranks have a rolled fillet and are right in the middle of their respective .950 wide spaces on that same 1.900 wide rod journal (for both rods)! The cylinder off set was adjusted to that same .950 width so now these rods are centered at each end and the rod small end is centered in the piston instead of being .035 sideways like if you use an SBC rod in an LS1 or an LS1 rod in an SBC.
The big ends on the rods are the ones that are actually offset but of course they are attached or connected to the rod journals on the crankshaft and can only move side to side with whatever side clearance has been engineered into them.
Of course this rod offset is from front to back of the engine or side to sode on the crank and is related to the cylinder bank offset and not towards or away from the thrust sides of the cylinder like the piston offset is.
You are right that not all piston makers put pin offset in their pistons. Wiseco and Diamond do and I think some Mahles. It is a nice thing on a street piston mostly. Most piston are not offset unless you option them that way as on a custom or they are oem. Any normal 2 valve piston that has 4 valve reliefs is an off set piston that can be used on either side
Can the SBC rods be adapted to an LS1?
Yes, they are all the time you just need enough pin boss width compared to your pin end width on the rod you are using.
On-Center rods like the ones I got Eagle to start making and selling for our little LS1 are different from the normal SBC rods which are NOT on-center but are offset sideways at the big end since the cylinder bore off set is less that the width of the rod journals. The SBC cylinders are off set or set back from bank to band around .880 and yet the rod journal width is 1.900 and half of that is .950 so the difference in rod width and cylinder bore offset is .070 or .035-ish per rod.
On the LS1 the rods are centered on their big ends and have no chamfer on the sides since the LS1 cranks have a rolled fillet and are right in the middle of their respective .950 wide spaces on that same 1.900 wide rod journal (for both rods)! The cylinder off set was adjusted to that same .950 width so now these rods are centered at each end and the rod small end is centered in the piston instead of being .035 sideways like if you use an SBC rod in an LS1 or an LS1 rod in an SBC.
The big ends on the rods are the ones that are actually offset but of course they are attached or connected to the rod journals on the crankshaft and can only move side to side with whatever side clearance has been engineered into them.
Of course this rod offset is from front to back of the engine or side to sode on the crank and is related to the cylinder bank offset and not towards or away from the thrust sides of the cylinder like the piston offset is.
You are right that not all piston makers put pin offset in their pistons. Wiseco and Diamond do and I think some Mahles. It is a nice thing on a street piston mostly. Most piston are not offset unless you option them that way as on a custom or they are oem. Any normal 2 valve piston that has 4 valve reliefs is an off set piston that can be used on either side
Can the SBC rods be adapted to an LS1?
Yes, they are all the time you just need enough pin boss width compared to your pin end width on the rod you are using.
Premium Supporting Vendor
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 5,241
Likes: 21
From: Knoxville Tennessee
Originally Posted by goinpostol
So based on what I think I just read, the on center are the better choice but they will be louder?
For me though.. it is peace of mind. I spent extra money on pistons too, just to get it how I wanted it.