Ok guys
Lets not start a war. I have seen big dyno #s with race gas no exhaust so on so forth.
If i have an APS kit with a forged motor fuel system What can i expect out of it.

I don't want no BS dyno #s I want real world so when i run up on a new ZO6 i don't get smoked.

How many of you guys have this kit & what are your power levels.

Thanks

 

Mr 44 Mag

Let me tell you that we made an honest 700 rwhp 772 rwt
We do not play with dyno #s I think that what we made is safe for a true street driving car. You can play games with race fuel or no exhaust systems to get big #s but you can't drive it on the street so what good is it. The APS kit is a good kit for a street car.



If you want more you will have to build it differently big pipes,turbos,intercooler fuel systems.

We do know a thing about turbo charging.......

 

we are on the same page

 

Only 2 replies come on people can we get more feedback on this post

 

The kit has not been out long enough to get many educated replies...

 

type APS in the search and you will have 2 weeks of reading material

 

If you are taking the kit out of the box, and running a full exhaust I can't see there being much over 700 RWHP in this kit. It's shown time and time again that there is a restriction, 11- 12 lbs and you're done. Build the engine around that and you will have a kick *** street car. My engine builder built my engine aroudn the fact it would se higher boost levels, which never came. If you want to start playing with piping/plumbing I'm sure there is more power in the kit. The same manifolds and turbo's are making 800 on the GTO's, or right there, so obviously there is a restriction, it will just take soem time to figure where it is. It has come to light recently that Peter from APS has said that he beleive the inlet pipes that are pancaked are the restriction. I'm sure it's a coincidence that it's several days after the Cartek boy's pulled huge numbers, but it is what it is. I don't care how the answers come out but I will be happy to see some answers
But realistic goals, plan on having one mean street car. Quick spool and gobs of torque. It will be more than enough. I have four setting on my boost controller and I run the lowest one, after that it's just retarded. A CBR 1000 was quite surprised to see nothing but tailights the other day on a 60 - 170 run, closed course. In time all things will come to head and there wil be little tricks. Sam just brought to light yesturday that the exhaust is god for about 50 - 60 RWHP. That's pretty huge!!! huge enough where I might be ordering one!! Teh real question is though, what are your expectations?
Dan

 

If you got a forged motor and want big power from a turbo the TTI X kit is the way to go.

SC's I would give ECS's Novi a shot. Either one will probably produce bigger numbers than the APS has.

 

That's an interesting comment.....Cartek just went 907 rwhp with the stock APS C5 twin turbo system on a Cartek built forged engine.....I'm quite sure that power level will match most other C5 off the shelf FI systems.

Peter

 

Dan, What are you cam specs and precise comp ratio?

Dan, We tested out own C5 ZO6 twin turbo car with a bone stock engine to 640 rwhp @ just 9 PSI on 93 octane fuel and I suspect that the air inlet ducts start to become restrictive at around 700 rwhp and 700 rwhp is obtained at around 12 PSI with a thorough tune and with a true low back pressure exhaust system.

Dan, I have been telling you guys for months now that a low restriction muffler is required for optimum performance, if you have high back pressure in the exhaust system this will definitely hurt power..........nothing new here.

From the APS web site,

Power at the Wheels and Turbocharger Boost Pressure, optional APS low back pressure mufflers, optional APS fuel system, 93 (R+M)/2 octane fuel (East Coast fuel blend).





Peter

 

It amazes me how so many people BELIEVE all the internet dyno #'s. This is the internet guys. I can say anything and I can do anything with photoshop.. LOL!! Ask yourself how many local cars are making the big #'s you are looking for? How many on here have ACTUALLY seen some of these cars on the dyno making these big #'s? I see a lot of he say she say comments. Hell most of the comments I read the people making the comments have never even seen a APS or TTI or HP or PTK/PTS or STS kit, but they can tell you which is best.. There are too many factors involved to just expect to bolt on a turbo kit and get 800rwhp. You have engine builders pointing at the kit. You have the manufactorers of the kit pointing at the engine combo. You have people saying not all tuners are equal. Just too many factors. Hell I even looked at someone's build list and 75% of the stuff on the list had nothing to do with making power. If you wanted to look like the current Mr. Olympia just going to the gym is not going to do it. The current Mr. Olympia's workout might not work for you. You will have to figure out what does. BUT you both will use the same basic exercises to attain your goal.

 

I'm not knock'n your system, but the conditions used to obtain those numbers are not real world. You cannot drive around the streets without an exhaust pipe but maybe you can down under.

Additionally, most guys are not running C16 gas to obtain there numbers.

The TTi X system has been proven over and over again to make bigger numbers then the APS system.

Whether that extra power is usable is another question. The name of the game is traction and if you don't have any you'll lose, period.

 

Thank You at least we are getting more feedback just what i was looking for info as my original post states

 

44mag - sent you a PM.

 

On a TT sytem, power is all about air flow. The ultimate air flow limit is determined by the turbos, and how much cfm they can flow.

Same turbos on a big cube motor will produce at less boost the same hp than a smaller cube engine at more boost, or two similar cubed engines, but one with considerable better heads and cam set up will produce better number at the same boost than a stocker for example.

However, ultimately is all about how much cfm the turbo can flow.
Obiviously if you max out a sytem at say 750 rwhp, and disconnect the exhaust, run open waste gates venting to ATM, and remove all air intake piping icluding filters, and chill the intercooler, you will increase this mazed out system from 750 rwhp.

Most of these small turbos can't even hold full boost to redline, I see the dyno graphs peaking at 5k rpm ,and droping 120+ rwhp on its way to 6500 rpms, a clear indication that the motor is running out of turbo.

If a particular turbo system can make 900 rwhp on say 15 psi, then the same set up, on a no so optimal headed combo should do the same, but say at 20 psi. We see that a lot On TT vipers with the same cubes, and TT systems, but using better flowing heads. The end result is same power at less boost, vs. higher boost.

 

Another thing to consider is Waste Gate Spring. On a system with low back pressure (2:1 ratio), you can usually see your max boost being double the spring presure on the waste gate. A 9 psi spring on the waste gate wil allow you to see a 18 psi max boost, again if the ratio of back presure to boost presure is good.

On some of these systems, where there are a lot of bends and restrictions to accomodate the system around the frame of the car, I'm sure the back presure is over 3:1 and possibly close to 4:1 in some cases. In systems like that, to potentially see 20 psi of boost, assuming the Turbos will flow and will allow you to achieve that, you probably will need a 15 lb. or higher waste gate spring.

Now your low boost is 15 lbs, and you might not even be able to run pump gas on it...

Lots of compromises to make big power....
Just my 02...

 

What are you goals? Is it not getting smoked by a stock C6 Z06? If that's that case any of the turbo kits will take care of that.

However, if it's anything other than that, you have to detail your goals.

The Vette Doctors did my STS and I'm running 600 rwhp, I met up against one of their head/cam C6 Z06, and my turbo kit wasn't enough.

 

Why are they flattened ?

Did Cartek find a way to keep them oval/round shaped ?

 

You can believe what you want, but I'll post what we've done.

749 RWHP through the exhaust on pump gas is what we got and there is more where that came from . That was with a usable air to fuel ratio. I've seen others here posting numbers with air fuel ratios in the low 14's for this kit . Look at the videos a little closer. That's NOT real world, but no one says anything.

I guess when your at the top and paving the way, everyone aims for you .

 

Interesting ! Whats that H/C Z making ... 560 - 570 WHP ?

A STS on 8 lbs boost (500 WHP) will hang even with a stock Z (465 WHP).

Looks like the Z's 300 lb weight advantage requires us to have an extra 40 HP (or more) to break even, or win outright.