thinking about an f1c and wondering how much the stock ls6 can handle? i also see alot of people using the stock ls6 crank and just upgrading rods and pistons? is the stock crank forged or why do people do this? also who sells full forged rotating assemblies that arent stroker kits? i dont want a 383 or anything and dont want to move to an ls2 because i dont think a whole new engine is necessary when i could just get the rotating assembly?

 

the stock ls1 crank is more than good enough for 800rwhp so what would the point be in putting in a stock stroke forged crank?

the cost to RR and engine and then do the needed machine work to set up the bottom end corectly runs the cost up to the point that most people just buy a forged short and sell their stock short block. most of the shops will sell a forged ls1 347 for around $3000.00 where pistons/rods/berings/machine work/assembly runs more than that.

as to the going with a newer block ls2/ls3 there are several pluses to that path due to the larger bore and the fact that the ls2/ls3s are stronger blocks and you can get into aforged and stroked ls3 416 for around $4500-5000. in reality there is like a $800 diff between a ls1 and an ls3 so in most cases why not go ls3

 

Plus more RWHP out of the unit.

 

but dont you have to get new harnesses for the ls2 to run the maf and things like that? and are the motor mounting points the same or do you have to modify those as well? i would think that all the added work to do a motor swap with new harnesses and what not would rack up the bill pretty quickly instead of just honing the stock block and putting new internals in? if a forged 347 is only $3000 and a forged ls3 is $4500-$5k than thats a $1500-$2k difference not just $800?
im going to procharge it so im not worried too much about how big the motor is since i can just add boost if its forged?

 

You dont have to get much at all. Give BLOWNZ06 on here a p.m. he did my swap for me. But only a little in knock senors. Not bad at all..

 

the adapters cost $300, included in the 800 the only real diff is the knock sensors get relocated to the side of the block (not much work at all) the 3000 on recent check it is like 3500 for stock crank where the full blown ls3 is stroked and costs 4300 + 300 adapter kit a stock crank ls3 is close to the same price (now) as a ls1.


if you go with forged rods and pistons you will need to reballance the assembly. the R&R on a C5 being what it is I would never slap a new rotating assembly into a ls1 and reinstall it without doing the machine work and truing up all surfaces.

in the end the ls2/ls3 slips into a c5 without much work at all, the front and rear covers are diff (included in the $300 kit) the knock sensors mount on the side (extention wiring in the kit) and the cam sensor is in new location (wiring in kit). the ls2/3 is almost idintical to the ls1 in exterior dim's, and has larger cylinders as well as stronger block.

right now TSP is selling the ls2 with stock crank for $100 less than the ls1 (you still need the $300 kit for the swap) to me it is a no brainer to correct my previous post the cost diff between a stock crank ls1 and a stock crank ls2 is less than $500.

 

bottom line is you are going to have at least $4k in an engine swap/rebuild either way you go (1500 rods, pistons, bearings, misc, 1000 in machine work, 500-1000 in assembly etc then R&R) so you might as well get the most for your $$$$

I'm about a tight as they come and buy most of my parts used, I keep trying to find a deal on engine parts to do what you are looking at but keep comming back the the conclusion that after it is all said and done the forged short block deals from a vendor beats the heck out of rebuilding my ls1 (even with used parts by the time you do the machine work), and this is before you figure that you can sell you short block for something even if it is a small amount.

Good luck with your build.

 

It really is a shame to pull apart a good running motor for a rebuild.Depending on your mileage you could get 8-$1200 for a good running LS1.Take that away from $3500 for the forged short and you have one hell of a deal on a motor that can make big power.Add some 317 heads for 3-$500 and you can't lose.If you're real tight you can run the LS6 cam and intake.It's best to buy from a well known LS shop but I have seen some killer deals go by in the classified section lately for used low mileage forged short blocks.Just make sure you do your homework either way.
Good luck.

 

haha well for only $1000 bucks i dont know if id rather have the fun and blow the motor or sell it but thats just me i like to have fun haha! my motor only has 49k miles on it and its an 02 z06 ls6. if i can get $1000 bucks for my motor then ill sell it and if not ill slap the procharger on there and wait til it blows! any offers?! will my ls6 heads fit on the ls3 based 418? if i buy a whole new shortblock i dont want to spend any more money on anything else than just the shortblock and not having to add this and that and adding an extra 2k on top of the shortblock?

 

I didn't even realize it's an LS6.Doh.Makes it worth even more.Low mileage too.I bought a low mileage LS6 short 1 year ago for $1100 and thought I got a great deal.I sold it 3 months later for the same money and had 4 guys who wanted to buy it.

 

ok well in that case i guess ill try to sell it! can i reuse my ls6 heads and manifold and everything else on the ls3 shortblock? is there anything else besides the adapter kit for $300 that i would need?

how much whp can you run on a ls6 before it blows anyways? ive heard about 600whp is the limit?

if i spend that much on a new motor how much does the 418 normally put out whp?

 

do yourself a favor contact any one of the forum vendors that sell shortblocks and tell them what you are planning they will give you a list and a price for exactly what you need. your question has been answered about as well as any of us can without getting down to specifics.

as to the limmit of a ls1 (ls6 in your case) stock bottom end it depends on your tuner but 600rwhp is acheivable.

the rwhp of a 418 is very dependant on the rest of your setup and how much cam you are willing to put up with, 400 rwhp NA is possable but then so is 550 rwhp, under boost with all the right mods you could push 1000 rwhp out of a good forged 418 (being able to use 1000rwhp is another story) this is why everyone here has been pointing you away from what you were planning to begin with because the forged and stroked ls3 puts you in a whole diffrent leage for not that much more money. this is not to say that the rest of your C5 will support the HP that the 418 will produce it is just that the engine will not be your weak link in the future.

the other side of this conversation you could just run a limited amount of boost and make around 600rwhp for a long time without rebuilding anything, if you are careful and your tuner knows what they are about. by the way you will find that even at 600rwhp your drive train will be a weak link.

BTW you might want to look into getting some 317 heads and just selling your ls6 as a long block, you will get much more for a low milage long block that is factory sealed and the cost of used 317 are very low at the same time the lower compression of the 317s can help out with your boost.

anyway hope this helps

 

thanks for all your halp man! dont get me wrong i would love to have the 418 and be somewhere around the 450whp mark but for the same price and power range it seems FI is just simpler and easier and will get me the power i want and i dont lose as much drivability, mpg's and everything else that comes with built motors. i will eventually have both a built motor (probably 418) and a blower but the question now is which comes first and which is more practical while i have to drive the car at least 3 days out of every week?

 

now i'm confused at first you were asking about forging your ls6 and we recomended that you not do that but instead IF you were to go forged that you would be money ahead to just get a forged short instead of rebuilding yours. as I stated above if you are looking for 550 to 600 rwhp out of a blower you can stick with the stock bottom end and the 550-600 rwhp range is also the point where most other things in the car start to become weak links. the main point to keep in mind is that pulling a perfectly good low mile ls6 apart for a forged bottom end is not a smart move money wise.

by all means put a blower on it set up for less that 10# get a good tuner and upgrade your clutch, that should put you around 550 rwhp and be about as DD friendly as anything. keep in mind that a 418 does not have to have a monster cam in it and can be just a DD friendly as a stock ls6 or even more so because of the higher level of low end TQ.

anyway good luck

 

sorry if im confusing i will eventually have a 418 and a blower but for now im wanting the most DD friendly cost effective way of getting the power i want and for now i think the blower will get me there without losing too many mpg's or losing drivability.

 

uuuuh yea this is true but is kind of a change in the discussion

yes for the power level you are looking for just go with a good blower package but keep in mind the bottom end will let go without warning if you get anything wrong (i would look into a meth kit for insurance)

Good Luck