It also works on large diesel generators, but I wouldn't do it even so.
Compound Forced Induction
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Racer
Joined: Feb 2010
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Compound Forced Induction
I've been salivating about this since I first read about it in Jeff Hartman's book about Tuning Engine Management Systems, where they put a Camry V6 in place of an MR2's 4 cylinder, put on a TRD (Magnusson) supercharger and THEN put on a big turbo...has anyone ever done a 'Vette like this ? I dream of a big inch stroker with a TVS2300 blower and a BIG rear mounted Borg Warner turbo with a 5 inch exhaust side...talk about a power curve ! Please discuss...
Drifting
Joined: Apr 2011
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From: Tulsa Ok
Talk about heat soak. Guy on another forum bought a CTS-V that had a PD and twins. Sold the PD shortly after because it was a waste and made less power than what the twins could do all by themselves.
It's neat but nothing more.
It's neat but nothing more.
Last edited by danieloneil01; Apr 26, 2014 at 08:11 PM.
Racer
Joined: Apr 2007
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From: Austin TX
Melting Slicks
Joined: Sep 2004
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Most people find that they make more power for the same boost presure win turbo only as you don't have the drag of the supercharger! You do get a bolstered low end performance, but not as much as a SC only car as you can't run the SC at peak boost pressure.
Much better to size the turbo (s) correctly for the power you need. If you are really worried about the lag then you can use n2o to help light the turbos off.
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Racer
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They described that Camry like a big block Chevy, an abundance of low end torque and then the quiet rush of turbo top end...doesn't sound like heat soak to me. The blower drive belt was actually putting power back into the engine when under full turbo boost. Read his book...it's really a great book, not just for that either. He has books on turbo and supercharging also. I have all three. He's worked on some really amazing, diverse projects, often along side Bob Norwood, who has done more for forced induction in America than probably anyone...well, maybe him and Corky Bell from Cartech and Ken Duttweiler.
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Racer
Joined: Feb 2010
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Have you seen that company that has twin turbo kits for 03-04 Cobra Mustangs and GT500s ? I wouldn't call that a waste either...I think it's HP performance. And the 03-04 has a tiny MP112 blower I think, not even a TVS...
Instructor
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 210
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From: So. Ill. Ill
They described that Camry like a big block Chevy, an abundance of low end torque and then the quiet rush of turbo top end...doesn't sound like heat soak to me. The blower drive belt was actually putting power back into the engine when under full turbo boost. Read his book...it's really a great book, not just for that either. He has books on turbo and supercharging also. I have all three. He's worked on some really amazing, diverse projects, often along side Bob Norwood, who has done more for forced induction in America than probably anyone...well, maybe him and Corky Bell from Cartech and Ken Duttweiler.
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Feb 2010
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A TVS isn't a twin screw like a Whipple, Lysholm or Kenne Bell , and, for example, the ZR1 and Edelbrock E-Force kits put the intercooler on top of the blower...Lingenfelter stacked 2 intercooler cores on their new Camaro ZL1.
Turbos make TONS of heat, being that exhaust gas is feeding one side of the turbo, not to mention the compressing of the air to make boost, it's just easier to put a large air to air intercooler in front of the radiator to bring temps back in line with ambient...with a sufficiently large supercharger intercooler radiator and remote tank for cooling water, I don't see heat as being a problem for a TVS with their high helix rotors, especially in a drag racing scenario where you could fill the container with ice water between rounds...hell, while we're at it, run intercooler spray bars on the turbo air to air I/C and shoot some nitrous across the cores while I'm at it.
Turbos make TONS of heat, being that exhaust gas is feeding one side of the turbo, not to mention the compressing of the air to make boost, it's just easier to put a large air to air intercooler in front of the radiator to bring temps back in line with ambient...with a sufficiently large supercharger intercooler radiator and remote tank for cooling water, I don't see heat as being a problem for a TVS with their high helix rotors, especially in a drag racing scenario where you could fill the container with ice water between rounds...hell, while we're at it, run intercooler spray bars on the turbo air to air I/C and shoot some nitrous across the cores while I'm at it.
Last edited by c6silver; Apr 27, 2014 at 05:18 PM.
Melting Slicks
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From: Sammamish WA
WA Events Coordinator
Melting Slicks
Joined: Nov 2003
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From: In front!
They described that Camry like a big block Chevy, an abundance of low end torque and then the quiet rush of turbo top end...doesn't sound like heat soak to me. The blower drive belt was actually putting power back into the engine when under full turbo boost. Read his book...it's really a great book, not just for that either. He has books on turbo and supercharging also. I have all three. He's worked on some really amazing, diverse projects, often along side Bob Norwood, who has done more for forced induction in America than probably anyone...well, maybe him and Corky Bell from Cartech and Ken Duttweiler.
Last edited by Y2KRoadster; Apr 28, 2014 at 01:45 AM.
Drifting
Joined: Mar 2011
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From: Richardson TX
But, then again, the engine made something like 1600 horsepower, as much as 2000hp. But that was from a 26 liter engine. Today there are guys making 2000hp from twin turbo ~6 liter engines....
Again, its a cool concept and idea, but for LS engines, it wouldn't perform much if any better than a conventional turbo or supercharger setup, and it would produce more heat and be more complicated.
If you want more low end boost look into anti-lag setups, its a more practical idea than slapping on an extra supercharger. But then again, the guys with big cube (400+) F/I engines make more than enough low end grunt. If you add more low end torque, you'll just break more tranny parts and spin more tires.
Last edited by PhysicsDude55; Apr 28, 2014 at 04:19 PM.
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Feb 2010
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Bro...it doesn't matter what you have read, or what was done to a Camry. NO ONE does this. There are semi-streetable Vette's and Vipers in the 6's on 10.5 DR's, and plenty that are fully streetable in the 7's...and they are twin turbo'd. It's a neat idea, nothing more. Stop trying to defend something with no proven and sustained results. I'm sure the people you ranted on about know their stuff about the physics behind the application; however, until they can prove it with real, track/street proven results, then it doesn't matter if they have 20 degrees from MIT.
Yeah...because that has something to do with a V8 application. Hey bro, the space shuttle just upgraded it's boosters. Why can't the Corvette's run solid fuel and rockets? They make more power than any supercharger or turbo ever could.
Yeah...because that has something to do with a V8 application. Hey bro, the space shuttle just upgraded it's boosters. Why can't the Corvette's run solid fuel and rockets? They make more power than any supercharger or turbo ever could.
Melting Slicks
Joined: Jul 2008
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From: Houston Texas
2018 Corvette of Year Finalist
2017 C5 of Year Finalist
I'm not arguing that this concept doesn't work as I've seen it done on other vehicles. As people have mentioned, it isn't the best application on a vette and keeping an ice tank filled on the street isn't practical for me. If you decide to try it out, please post up your results.
Melting Slicks
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 3,002
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From: Houston Texas
2018 Corvette of Year Finalist
2017 C5 of Year Finalist
I think people have discussed pros and cons in this thread. Everytime someone mentions an alternative, you bring up a Camry engine in a MR2 or other vendor's compound kits on mustangs. Post up real world results on what those cars ran at the track and how successful they are in competition.
Atleast mention what your goals are for the build. Are you doing this just to do it? Have you ever owned or driven a vette with forced induction? I'm just asking to get a point of reference for what types of power you have experienced in your lifetime.
What do you see as the pros and cons on a C5/C6 corvette with compound boost?
Atleast mention what your goals are for the build. Are you doing this just to do it? Have you ever owned or driven a vette with forced induction? I'm just asking to get a point of reference for what types of power you have experienced in your lifetime.
What do you see as the pros and cons on a C5/C6 corvette with compound boost?
