383 build below expected results
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 2,764
Likes: 375
From: Central Florida
Was the converter locked when they dynoed it?? (It looks like it was by the chart but....). If the converter was unlocked, that could be 50-100hp loss on a loose converter.
If it was locked, you are down atleast 100hp...or more. Hard to say without all the data and a good chart to analyze...
Take it to the track and see what it runs... If it goes atleast 132-133, you are probably ok.
If it was locked, you are down atleast 100hp...or more. Hard to say without all the data and a good chart to analyze...
Take it to the track and see what it runs... If it goes atleast 132-133, you are probably ok.
I will try to get more info from dyno
Thanks
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 2,764
Likes: 375
From: Central Florida
The question should have been "has anyone with this combo and the small blower (si trim) had trouble getting over 500 hp?" and stuck to that(sorry), I was told by a very reputable guy I may have problems......looks like he was right! Seems everybody else thinks the car should be doing better?
Thanks again for all the info.
Melting Slicks
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 2,590
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From: Nathalie VA
St. Jude Donor '15-'16-'17-'18
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 2,764
Likes: 375
From: Central Florida
???? Not sure, don't have paperwork it is still at shop with car, it was ordered through rpm to go with the trans and motor so it's whatever they recommend. I guess there is more I don't know, wouldn't all high perf. Stalls lock up?
Melting Slicks
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 2,590
Likes: 48
From: Nathalie VA
St. Jude Donor '15-'16-'17-'18
No, and if it is a lockup the tuner may have not had it locked on the dyno.
Last edited by CamminC5; Oct 11, 2015 at 01:22 PM.
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Jan 2014
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Likes: 375
From: Central Florida
Well I think he (tuner) was looking for more horsepower out of this based on comments by my mechanic, I'm sure he would know if it was "locked" or not so I would guess if he has control of that he would have locked it to get the most out of it, no?
Le Mans Master
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 9,993
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From: League City Tx
The tuner will know for sure if he locked it or not. Another way you can sometimes tell if it's locked or not is by looking at the torque curve on the chart. If the car has a stall speed converter and it's unlocked, it will usually have a big spike on the torque right at the start of the pull...and the peak torque numbers will be unusually high due to the torque multiplication from the converter flashing.
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From: Oviedo Florida
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Who was your tuner??? Mike Norris??
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 2,764
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From: Central Florida
Yes
I think he did the best he could, I was not there but they had a few things that croped up (tranny line blew, pcm would not load last tune). I think I got some bad advice about the motor to order for the blower I had? It seems to have a lot of torque early, but hp tops out and falls off, I'm still waiting for an actual dyno I can read.
Joe,
You going to melbourne this weekend?
I think he did the best he could, I was not there but they had a few things that croped up (tranny line blew, pcm would not load last tune). I think I got some bad advice about the motor to order for the blower I had? It seems to have a lot of torque early, but hp tops out and falls off, I'm still waiting for an actual dyno I can read.
Joe,
You going to melbourne this weekend?
Last edited by Forcedvert; Oct 13, 2015 at 08:50 AM.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Feb 2007
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From: Oviedo Florida
2024 C5 of the Year Finalist - Modified
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Yes
I think he did the best he could, I was not there but they had a few things that croped up (tranny line blew, pcm would not load last tune). I think I got some bad advice about the motor to order for the blower I had? It seems to have a lot of torque early, but hp tops out and falls off, I'm still waiting for an actual dyno I can read.
Joe,
You going to melbourne this weekend?
I think he did the best he could, I was not there but they had a few things that croped up (tranny line blew, pcm would not load last tune). I think I got some bad advice about the motor to order for the blower I had? It seems to have a lot of torque early, but hp tops out and falls off, I'm still waiting for an actual dyno I can read.
Joe,
You going to melbourne this weekend?
I am 154 (NCCC) in the country right now. I am determined to drop
lower on the list (ha-ha). I am glad I didn't tell you what my
hp numbers were, the last time we talked. My little 346 cu
puts out a lot more hp than your bigger engine. As you have
figured out it's all in the right combo of parts. And just remember
it's not the number but the performance of the engine that counts. See you soon.
soon.
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 2,764
Likes: 375
From: Central Florida
Adam--No, I have a full weekend (Sat and Sun) of auto cross.
I am 154 (NCCC) in the country right now. I am determined to drop
lower on the list (ha-ha). I am glad I didn't tell you what my
hp numbers were, the last time we talked. My little 346 cu
puts out a lot more hp than your bigger engine. As you have
figured out it's all in the right combo of parts. And just remember
it's not the number but the performance of the engine that counts. See you soon.
soon.
I am 154 (NCCC) in the country right now. I am determined to drop
lower on the list (ha-ha). I am glad I didn't tell you what my
hp numbers were, the last time we talked. My little 346 cu
puts out a lot more hp than your bigger engine. As you have
figured out it's all in the right combo of parts. And just remember
it's not the number but the performance of the engine that counts. See you soon.
soon.
I was dissapointed in the final number, but the motor runs well, I mostly got what I wanted the bigger motor has lots of torque down low and thats what I feel when on the gas
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 2,764
Likes: 375
From: Central Florida
Was the converter locked when they dynoed it?? (It looks like it was by the chart but....). If the converter was unlocked, that could be 50-100hp loss on a loose converter.
If it was locked, you are down atleast 100hp...or more. Hard to say without all the data and a good chart to analyze...
Take it to the track and see what it runs... If it goes atleast 132-133, you are probably ok.
If it was locked, you are down atleast 100hp...or more. Hard to say without all the data and a good chart to analyze...
Take it to the track and see what it runs... If it goes atleast 132-133, you are probably ok.
he did say it was a bear to dial in this car. He said "the AF should have been on the bottom and around 11.5/1 and 15* of timing up top", I asked him if it was a "conservative tune" and he said he tunes conservative as if it was his car but said he would only be 10 to 20 hp from max. He said converter was locked and data did not show much slip. I can't really ask him to do better because he is out of state guy that my mechanic hired. So I realize when I get my car back I will have to find a local/ in state tuner or do it myself with data logging and help from the pros on here.
Last edited by Forcedvert; Oct 19, 2015 at 09:31 PM.
Le Mans Master
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 9,993
Likes: 1,136
From: League City Tx
Still no chart sorry, but I emailed the tuner, he thought it would be at least 550 hp, he didn't want to make any suggestions because he did not build car he did say it was a bear to dial in this car. He said "the AF should have been on the bottom and around 11.5/1 and 15* of timing up top", I asked him if it was a "conservative tune" and he said he tunes conservative as if it was his car but said he would only be 10 to 20 hp from max. He said converter was locked and data did not show much slip. I can't really ask him to do better because he is out of state guy that my mechanic hired. So I realize when I get my car back I will have to find a local/ in state tuner or do it myself with data logging and help from the pros on here.
he did say it was a bear to dial in this car. He said "the AF should have been on the bottom and around 11.5/1 and 15* of timing up top", I asked him if it was a "conservative tune" and he said he tunes conservative as if it was his car but said he would only be 10 to 20 hp from max. He said converter was locked and data did not show much slip. I can't really ask him to do better because he is out of state guy that my mechanic hired. So I realize when I get my car back I will have to find a local/ in state tuner or do it myself with data logging and help from the pros on here.Well.. If all he told you was true, and he did tune it to 11.5 AFR, 15* and the converter locked, that's about all he can do for you...those numbers are definitely in the ball park..
IATs, KR (knock retard - timing retard from too knock sensors picking up knock) , timing retard from high IAT, heat soak from high engine temps etc, boost leaks, belt slip could ALL have an effect on power output and all of these variables need to be monitored while dyno/tuning.
You could throw it on another dyno, have them set the smoothing on 5 on the dyno software, and see what it makes.
Honestly, if it runs good, shows good/consistent boost, your AFR is in the correct range, I wouldn't worry about it. Drive and enjoy. Get it to the drag strip on some good tires and look at the trap speed... That's what tells you how fast your car is, not the dyno.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 7,767
Likes: 19
From: East Texas
Well.. If all he told you was true, and he did tune it to 11.5 AFR, 15* and the converter locked, that's about all he can do for you...those numbers are definitely in the ball park..
IATs, KR (knock retard - timing retard from too knock sensors picking up knock) , timing retard from high IAT, heat soak from high engine temps etc, boost leaks, belt slip could ALL have an effect on power output and all of these variables need to be monitored while dyno/tuning.
You could throw it on another dyno, have them set the smoothing on 5 on the dyno software, and see what it makes.
Honestly, if it runs good, shows good/consistent boost, your AFR is in the correct range, I wouldn't worry about it. Drive and enjoy. Get it to the drag strip on some good tires and look at the trap speed... That's what tells you how fast your car is, not the dyno.
IATs, KR (knock retard - timing retard from too knock sensors picking up knock) , timing retard from high IAT, heat soak from high engine temps etc, boost leaks, belt slip could ALL have an effect on power output and all of these variables need to be monitored while dyno/tuning.
You could throw it on another dyno, have them set the smoothing on 5 on the dyno software, and see what it makes.
Honestly, if it runs good, shows good/consistent boost, your AFR is in the correct range, I wouldn't worry about it. Drive and enjoy. Get it to the drag strip on some good tires and look at the trap speed... That's what tells you how fast your car is, not the dyno.
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 2,764
Likes: 375
From: Central Florida
Well I just got back from a test ride, I just got a Dewitt's radiator, spal fans, trans cooler(mounted under headlight) installed for heat and car felt better than it ever has, I think it is really dialed in much better everything is smoother, idle through wot. It is cooler today 85* but water temps never got over 209* with ac on, trans never got over 180* thanks to all who posted up on cooling options. Water was running over 245* with ac off and trans would keep climbing over 285*+. I will let you guys know what it does on a hotter day with longer drive times.
Last edited by Forcedvert; Oct 20, 2015 at 10:12 PM.
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 2,764
Likes: 375
From: Central Florida
Well.. If all he told you was true, and he did tune it to 11.5 AFR, 15* and the converter locked, that's about all he can do for you...those numbers are definitely in the ball park..
IATs, KR (knock retard - timing retard from too knock sensors picking up knock) , timing retard from high IAT, heat soak from high engine temps etc, boost leaks, belt slip could ALL have an effect on power output and all of these variables need to be monitored while dyno/tuning.
You could throw it on another dyno, have them set the smoothing on 5 on the dyno software, and see what it makes.
Honestly, if it runs good, shows good/consistent boost, your AFR is in the correct range, I wouldn't worry about it. Drive and enjoy. Get it to the drag strip on some good tires and look at the trap speed... That's what tells you how fast your car is, not the dyno.
IATs, KR (knock retard - timing retard from too knock sensors picking up knock) , timing retard from high IAT, heat soak from high engine temps etc, boost leaks, belt slip could ALL have an effect on power output and all of these variables need to be monitored while dyno/tuning.
You could throw it on another dyno, have them set the smoothing on 5 on the dyno software, and see what it makes.
Honestly, if it runs good, shows good/consistent boost, your AFR is in the correct range, I wouldn't worry about it. Drive and enjoy. Get it to the drag strip on some good tires and look at the trap speed... That's what tells you how fast your car is, not the dyno.
so they may be pretty strict now. I will report how car does when pushed on a hot day but felt good today!Thanks for your insight I really appreciate it
Adam
Le Mans Master
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 7,767
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From: East Texas
Not sure I can find a track here I can make a run on as this car is a vert, but I will ask around, a guy was killed here in Orlando a few weeks ago when he lost control and rolled over wall so they may be pretty strict now. I will report how car does when pushed on a hot day but felt good today!
Thanks for your insight I really appreciate it
Adam
so they may be pretty strict now. I will report how car does when pushed on a hot day but felt good today!Thanks for your insight I really appreciate it
Adam
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 2,764
Likes: 375
From: Central Florida