Methanol Debate
Thread Starter
Running Guns & Moonshine
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 12,593
Likes: 7,257
From: CT
Methanol Debate
I'll be breaking in the 402 combo later this spring.
I think of it as a moderate build, not an extreme one. Cathedral heads, mid-range cam a bit small for the displacement, oem LS2 block, etc. Haltech elite ecu, V3-Ti, 10.55:1, prc 225, jam cam, forged internals, expecting roughly 14psi on a 3.6 pulley. The splurge points were the ecu, ccw crank, and crower shaft rockers. C5-LS2-MN6 made 760 / 630 on a loosely comparable build.
I ran one of Julio's alkycontrol kits with a small shot on my 99 when it was making 10psi and about 500rw on an untouched LS1.
But what is the benefit at this power level if I have larger injectors and steady fuel system with dual pumps? Just running dual nozzles to run more timing? What's the risk here with the spray not being equal to each cylinder and running #7 (typically) hotter even if its forged?
I think of it as a moderate build, not an extreme one. Cathedral heads, mid-range cam a bit small for the displacement, oem LS2 block, etc. Haltech elite ecu, V3-Ti, 10.55:1, prc 225, jam cam, forged internals, expecting roughly 14psi on a 3.6 pulley. The splurge points were the ecu, ccw crank, and crower shaft rockers. C5-LS2-MN6 made 760 / 630 on a loosely comparable build.
I ran one of Julio's alkycontrol kits with a small shot on my 99 when it was making 10psi and about 500rw on an untouched LS1.
But what is the benefit at this power level if I have larger injectors and steady fuel system with dual pumps? Just running dual nozzles to run more timing? What's the risk here with the spray not being equal to each cylinder and running #7 (typically) hotter even if its forged?
Race Director
Joined: Dec 1999
Posts: 10,230
Likes: 885
From: Alexandria, Virginia, USA VA
julio makes a great kit. I'd sure consider direct port alchy or if the budget allows go straight to e85
alchy is the boost juice but at higher flows the factory intake doesn't do very well keeping the cyl distribution equal as you mention
those intakes are designed for "dry flow" and with all the bends and turns the alchy tends to wet the intake wall and puddle up causing cyl to cyl variance
on a big f1 blower car he had the Haltech 8 channel EGTs and we noticed big cyl temp variance on the egts that shows alchy was carrying back and puddling in the rear of the intake making the normally lean #7 go way rich
he went direct port alchy and picked up both hp (40) on the same alcy flow and the egts were MUCH more even and the engine ran smoother
alchy is the boost juice but at higher flows the factory intake doesn't do very well keeping the cyl distribution equal as you mention
those intakes are designed for "dry flow" and with all the bends and turns the alchy tends to wet the intake wall and puddle up causing cyl to cyl variance
on a big f1 blower car he had the Haltech 8 channel EGTs and we noticed big cyl temp variance on the egts that shows alchy was carrying back and puddling in the rear of the intake making the normally lean #7 go way rich
he went direct port alchy and picked up both hp (40) on the same alcy flow and the egts were MUCH more even and the engine ran smoother
Thread Starter
Running Guns & Moonshine
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 12,593
Likes: 7,257
From: CT
I'm set up for E85 on my return style setup when done. Like the methanol, I'll have to import it from VP fuels since local pumps are over an hour away in either direction. This is a street car by far so the frequency of ethanol use would be low. If I still ran the methanol kit, I would see about setting the haltech run it instead of a map sensor and rheostat dial.
The intake is Fast 92 which I'm keeping for this season since I was just let go two months befkre the wedding. Don't call your boss on Sunday seeking support and say you've got chest pain from the stress. They came in first thing Monday and sent me packing. Keeping the bills reasonable for now.
The intake is Fast 92 which I'm keeping for this season since I was just let go two months befkre the wedding. Don't call your boss on Sunday seeking support and say you've got chest pain from the stress. They came in first thing Monday and sent me packing. Keeping the bills reasonable for now.
Race Director
Joined: Dec 1999
Posts: 10,230
Likes: 885
From: Alexandria, Virginia, USA VA
I'm set up for E85 on my return style setup when done. Like the methanol, I'll have to import it from VP fuels since local pumps are over an hour away in either direction. This is a street car by far so the frequency of ethanol use would be low. If I still ran the methanol kit, I would see about setting the haltech run it instead of a map sensor and rheostat dial.
The intake is Fast 92 which I'm keeping for this season since I was just let go two months befkre the wedding. Don't call your boss on Sunday seeking support and say you've got chest pain from the stress. They came in first thing Monday and sent me packing. Keeping the bills reasonable for now.
The intake is Fast 92 which I'm keeping for this season since I was just let go two months befkre the wedding. Don't call your boss on Sunday seeking support and say you've got chest pain from the stress. They came in first thing Monday and sent me packing. Keeping the bills reasonable for now.
I got an amp driver box so the haltech can control the alchy kit and add the boost juice when no e85 is available.
I hope to find a really competent haltech installer to make this a reality I have the 8 channel egt kit too
Burning Brakes
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 1,178
Likes: 224
From: Austin Texas
I was also going to do a Holley Terminator X computer in my C5, but there was no way to program the car to pass yearly state vehicle emissions testing without all the parameters of the factory ecu. I talked to one shop that "attempted" the piggy back ecu trick to run two ecu's in order to pass OB2 testing, but they said it was a VERY difficult and a costly task that would even challenge NASA! Even after all the R&D there were still a few issues making the two communicate and they will never do it again. To make a long story short...you would need to install double(2X) various engine sensors to run separate computers since some sensor signals can not be spliced into. A real pain. I chose to pass on the holley terminator X due to car resale value of the next potential owner not being able to buy it and get it to pass a state inspection. I've sold a lot of modified cars....and that's the first concern of future buyers. I thought CT was an emission state too?
If you live in a non emission state or its a strait up track car.... I guess it would be a viable option.
If you live in a non emission state or its a strait up track car.... I guess it would be a viable option.
Last edited by C6-LS2-MN6; Apr 4, 2022 at 07:59 PM.
Race Director
Joined: Dec 1999
Posts: 10,230
Likes: 885
From: Alexandria, Virginia, USA VA
the haltech folks claim the obd2 plug in test remains intact as well as the stock gauges.
That was my main requirement. I thought the Holley high end systems can do that as well.
The 04 vette ecm can run flex fuel too. Not nearly as well as an aftermarket system. But well enough that you could get home off big boost if you run out of e85
I'm interested in looking into that as I can use the haltech on some other goofy project like my kit car where I want to run the LS engine in something half the weight of the vette
That was my main requirement. I thought the Holley high end systems can do that as well.
The 04 vette ecm can run flex fuel too. Not nearly as well as an aftermarket system. But well enough that you could get home off big boost if you run out of e85
I'm interested in looking into that as I can use the haltech on some other goofy project like my kit car where I want to run the LS engine in something half the weight of the vette
Thread Starter
Running Guns & Moonshine
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 12,593
Likes: 7,257
From: CT
Correct. By reading and by reference from Bret the Haltech is supoosed to have the capability to piggyback. I'll do my best to make it easily reversible too though wiring is not my forte.
I had read into various threads on flex fuel capacity for the C5, which ecus were compatible for swap into our older cars and which could be unlocked/reprogrammed. My interest was in doing that for my daily 99 except that the promised advent of E85 pumps locally all disappeared. I did still invest in a bluetooth obd2 adapter which can can program ecus and makenuse of ooen source software to do so. I considered it a small investment in future swaps 20 years from now and it cost less than a single license.
Long way to go before testing the methanol. Still debatable. That 8 channel egt sounds trick. Ive heard it becomes a case of the more you know, the more you don't want to know.
I had read into various threads on flex fuel capacity for the C5, which ecus were compatible for swap into our older cars and which could be unlocked/reprogrammed. My interest was in doing that for my daily 99 except that the promised advent of E85 pumps locally all disappeared. I did still invest in a bluetooth obd2 adapter which can can program ecus and makenuse of ooen source software to do so. I considered it a small investment in future swaps 20 years from now and it cost less than a single license.
Long way to go before testing the methanol. Still debatable. That 8 channel egt sounds trick. Ive heard it becomes a case of the more you know, the more you don't want to know.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 6,008
Likes: 723
Correct. By reading and by reference from Bret the Haltech is supoosed to have the capability to piggyback. I'll do my best to make it easily reversible too though wiring is not my forte.
I had read into various threads on flex fuel capacity for the C5, which ecus were compatible for swap into our older cars and which could be unlocked/reprogrammed. My interest was in doing that for my daily 99 except that the promised advent of E85 pumps locally all disappeared. I did still invest in a bluetooth obd2 adapter which can can program ecus and makenuse of ooen source software to do so. I considered it a small investment in future swaps 20 years from now and it cost less than a single license.
Long way to go before testing the methanol. Still debatable. That 8 channel egt sounds trick. Ive heard it becomes a case of the more you know, the more you don't want to know.
I had read into various threads on flex fuel capacity for the C5, which ecus were compatible for swap into our older cars and which could be unlocked/reprogrammed. My interest was in doing that for my daily 99 except that the promised advent of E85 pumps locally all disappeared. I did still invest in a bluetooth obd2 adapter which can can program ecus and makenuse of ooen source software to do so. I considered it a small investment in future swaps 20 years from now and it cost less than a single license.
Long way to go before testing the methanol. Still debatable. That 8 channel egt sounds trick. Ive heard it becomes a case of the more you know, the more you don't want to know.
Corvette Stories
The Best of Corvette for Corvette Enthusiasts
10 Reasons the C6 Z06 is Still A Performance Benchmark After 20 Years
Joe Kucinski
How Much Horsepower Every Corvette Engine "LOST" in 1972
Joe Kucinski
Top 10 DOs and DON'Ts for Protecting Your Convertible Top!
Michael S. Palmer
Top 10 Most Explosive Corvettes Ever Made: Power-to-Weight Ratio Ranked!
Joe Kucinski
150 hp to 1,250 hp: Every Corvette Generation Compared by the Specs That Matter
Joe Kucinski
8 Coolest Corvette Pace Cars (and Replicas) of All Time
Verdad Gallardo
Top 10 Corvette Engines RANKED by Peak Torque (70+ Years of Muscle!)
Joe Kucinski
Corvette ZR1X Will Be Pacing the Indy 500, And Could Probably Race, Too!
Verdad Gallardo
Top 10 Corvettes Coming to Mecum Indy 2026!
Brett Foote
Burning Brakes
Joined: May 2016
Posts: 1,024
Likes: 387
From: Port Charlotte Florida
I'm set up for E85 on my return style setup when done. Like the methanol, I'll have to import it from VP fuels since local pumps are over an hour away in either direction. This is a street car by far so the frequency of ethanol use would be low. If I still ran the methanol kit, I would see about setting the haltech run it instead of a map sensor and rheostat dial.
The intake is Fast 92 which I'm keeping for this season since I was just let go two months befkre the wedding. Don't call your boss on Sunday seeking support and say you've got chest pain from the stress. They came in first thing Monday and sent me packing. Keeping the bills reasonable for now.
The intake is Fast 92 which I'm keeping for this season since I was just let go two months befkre the wedding. Don't call your boss on Sunday seeking support and say you've got chest pain from the stress. They came in first thing Monday and sent me packing. Keeping the bills reasonable for now.
Thread Starter
Running Guns & Moonshine
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 12,593
Likes: 7,257
From: CT
I run nursing homes. There are no staff to be had and endless emergencies. Those staff who remain are either thr good ones who are beyond burned out or the ones no one would hire in normal world.
Last edited by Tusc; Apr 16, 2022 at 02:02 PM.