HP difference with Headers vs. No headers???
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 1,898
Likes: 35
From: Fairview Hts. IL
HP difference with Headers vs. No headers???
Ok, I am strongly considering headers or a cam for my next modification. I know that the cam will make 30-50rwhp. . .any idea how much the headers will be worth?
I am interested in REAL dyno results from before and after header installation. :cheers: :cheers: :cheers:
I am interested in REAL dyno results from before and after header installation. :cheers: :cheers: :cheers:
Pro
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 601
Likes: 0
Re: HP difference with Headers vs. No headers??? (ICULUKN-C5)
Would go with either the BPP LT step headers with the ATI as I did because they broaden the tq curve delivering most gains in the midrange area to avoid adding to the taction problem down low or the LGM design--those bad boys are LONG :D
Racer
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 334
Likes: 0
From: Warren OH
Re: HP difference with Headers vs. No headers??? (hogurt)
hogurt:
I have also been scouring the forum the last week or so for info/advice on headers/hi-flo cats with a Magnuson. The LGM's look like the top of the line, but can the actual performance truly justify the cost? The coated TPIS headers appear to be popular also in the FI forum. I'd like to see the dyno results as well of the different manufacturers of long tubes...
I have also been scouring the forum the last week or so for info/advice on headers/hi-flo cats with a Magnuson. The LGM's look like the top of the line, but can the actual performance truly justify the cost? The coated TPIS headers appear to be popular also in the FI forum. I'd like to see the dyno results as well of the different manufacturers of long tubes...
Burning Brakes
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 1,202
Likes: 0
From: Clarksburg MD
Re: HP difference with Headers vs. No headers??? (SilverC5inOhio)
hogurt:
I have also been scouring the forum the last week or so for info/advice on headers/hi-flo cats with a Magnuson. The LGM's look like the top of the line, but can the actual performance truly justify the cost? The coated TPIS headers appear to be popular also in the FI forum. I'd like to see the dyno results as well of the different manufacturers of long tubes...
I have also been scouring the forum the last week or so for info/advice on headers/hi-flo cats with a Magnuson. The LGM's look like the top of the line, but can the actual performance truly justify the cost? The coated TPIS headers appear to be popular also in the FI forum. I'd like to see the dyno results as well of the different manufacturers of long tubes...
Glenn
:cheers:
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 1,898
Likes: 35
From: Fairview Hts. IL
Re: HP difference with Headers vs. No headers??? (SilverC5inOhio)
SilverC5, I am in the same boat. Here is what I am thinking:
1. If the stock '02 manifold yields the same results as shorty headers then that means they must flow pretty well.
2. The cost for purchasing a cam and having the cam, spring and retainers installed will cost about the same as simply purchasing the headers (FLP's cost about $1500).
3. A lopey idle is just BAD AZZ! :yesnod:
Based on these observations, I have to conclude that LT headers are certainly better than shorties or the stock manifold; however, the stock setup is pretty good. A cam swap willl yield more performance gains than headers for approximately the same price so if I were to prioritize I have to go with the cam, first! :yesnod:
Since I am at approximately 410rwhp now, I should get into the 450rwhp range with the cam (through the A4 with full exhaust).
1. If the stock '02 manifold yields the same results as shorty headers then that means they must flow pretty well.
2. The cost for purchasing a cam and having the cam, spring and retainers installed will cost about the same as simply purchasing the headers (FLP's cost about $1500).
3. A lopey idle is just BAD AZZ! :yesnod:
Based on these observations, I have to conclude that LT headers are certainly better than shorties or the stock manifold; however, the stock setup is pretty good. A cam swap willl yield more performance gains than headers for approximately the same price so if I were to prioritize I have to go with the cam, first! :yesnod:
Since I am at approximately 410rwhp now, I should get into the 450rwhp range with the cam (through the A4 with full exhaust).
Instructor
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 211
Likes: 0
From: Highlands Ranch Colorado
Re: HP difference with Headers vs. No headers??? (hogurt)
I love my LT headers. They've given me about 23 rwhp with the blower. It's a great compliment to a cat back system or a supercharger. Remember, the quicker you get the exhaust out of your engine, the more power you can get out of it. A good set of Long Tube headers is an excellent mod!!
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Drifting
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 1,260
Likes: 6
From: Thousand Oaks California
Re: HP difference with Headers vs. No headers??? (ColoradoSilver)
don't forget better scavenging will reduce boost pressures (ever so slightly) and reduce charge air temps (ever so slightly). :auto:
Race Director
Joined: Dec 1999
Posts: 13,459
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From: Westport, MA. www.tbyrnemotorsports.com - 1-877-4-TBYRNE
St. Jude Donor '06-'07
Re: HP difference with Headers vs. No headers??? (STAGED)
Long tubes are usually worth 20-25hp on a stock to mildly modifed car and more on a heavily modified, nitroused or supercharged car. I did some testing on an LS1 a few years ago. The car had basic mods and nitrous. There was about a 45hp/60-65 ft-lb torque difference between between the manifolds and long tubes while spraying it.
Tom
Tom
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 1,898
Likes: 35
From: Fairview Hts. IL
Re: HP difference with Headers vs. No headers??? (tbyrne)
You guys are making a persuasive argument for the LT's. :yesnod:
It looks like I will keep my eyes peeled for a group purchase! :seeya
It looks like I will keep my eyes peeled for a group purchase! :seeya
Pro
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 570
Likes: 1
From: Las Colinas, Texas
Re: HP difference with Headers vs. No headers??? (hogurt)
Hogurt-I installed TPIS Long tube, jet hot coated headers four years ago. They were a great addition to my car but back then they had one cronic problem. They would suffer minor weld cracks visable from above at the air tubes on both sides. The welds of the exhaust pipes were OK. This might not be a problem today but nose around to be sure. Also, long tubes make it difficult to bleed hydraulic clutch. Flush the clutch as prevenative maint. before you install headers and protect from added heat. They added 20 rwhp to my head/cam car four years ago. Good luck :smash:
[Modified by Sack Rat TT, 7:00 PM 5/29/2003]
[Modified by Sack Rat TT, 7:00 PM 5/29/2003]
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 1,898
Likes: 35
From: Fairview Hts. IL
Re: HP difference with Headers vs. No headers??? (Sack Rat TT)
I am sold. Headers are definite for next winter. In the mean time, I am going to look for a nice supercharger cam and some other toys. I am getting a great deal on the cam install.
:cheers: :cheers: :cheers:
:cheers: :cheers: :cheers:
Safety Car
Joined: Jun 2000
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From: St. Louis MO
2020 Corvette of the Year (appearance mods)
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Re: HP difference with Headers vs. No headers??? (hogurt)
I am sold. Headers are definite for next winter. In the mean time, I am going to look for a nice supercharger cam and some other toys. I am getting a great deal on the cam install.
:cheers: :cheers: :cheers:
:cheers: :cheers: :cheers:
George
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 1,898
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From: Fairview Hts. IL
Re: HP difference with Headers vs. No headers??? (Black_Magic)
George, how have you been? How is your beast doing?
At this time, I am early in the "looking" stage. I have found three cams that I am particularly interested in:
1. Thunder racing: 224/227 .563/.569 114 LSA
2. Lingenfelter: GT2-3 Cam
3. MTI B1 Custom Grind: 221/221 .581/..581 114LSA
4. TByrne: Comp Cam 214/224 .525/.532 114
Let me know if you find any other cams.
At this time, I am early in the "looking" stage. I have found three cams that I am particularly interested in:
1. Thunder racing: 224/227 .563/.569 114 LSA
2. Lingenfelter: GT2-3 Cam
3. MTI B1 Custom Grind: 221/221 .581/..581 114LSA
4. TByrne: Comp Cam 214/224 .525/.532 114
Let me know if you find any other cams.
Instructor
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 115
Likes: 0
From: Battle Creek, kalamazoo Michigan
Re: HP difference with Headers vs. No headers??? (hogurt)
Hogurt. I just installed a set of Lingenfelter long tubes this weekend and then on Monday decided to have the car turbo charged. I have an install date of June 18th for the tti twin turbo system. So my brand new headers will be coming off in 3 weeks. I can tell you that the seat of the pants feeling with headers is awesome. They also give the car a much better "tuned" sound. I have no clue how much horsepower they added but the car seems to rev up much faster.
Jim
Jim
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 1,898
Likes: 35
From: Fairview Hts. IL
Re: HP difference with Headers vs. No headers??? (0to60n4)
Hogurt. I just installed a set of Lingenfelter long tubes this weekend and then on Monday decided to have the car turbo charged. I have an install date of June 18th for the tti twin turbo system. So my brand new headers will be coming off in 3 weeks. I can tell you that the seat of the pants feeling with headers is awesome. They also give the car a much better "tuned" sound. I have no clue how much horsepower they added but the car seems to rev up much faster.
Jim
Jim
Please send me an e-mail when you are ready to sell. I am very interested.
hogurt@charter.net
Advanced
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 65
Likes: 0
From: Maysville Kentucky
Re: HP difference with Headers vs. No headers??? (hogurt)
hogurt- I'm not sure about the horsepower gain but I did pick up 3/10 in the quarter mile (13.10 to a 12.80). This gain is on a stock motor with about every bolt on I can think of. I went with the TPIS long tubes. They are a lot of fun to put on! If you decide to do it yourself all I can say is be patient :D
