TIMING RETARD DEVICE FOR NITROUS?
Thread Starter
Burning Brakes
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 832
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From: Joplin Mo
TIMING RETARD DEVICE FOR NITROUS?
I'm using a 100 shot of nitrous on a stock motor except for the tuning is customized by Bryan at pcmforless. He said that he had advanced the timing by 4 degrees in the programming and recommends pulling that back out when using nitrous. I know they have devices from ramchargers and others but surely there is a way to do the same for considerably less money! Some I've heard are using a simple resister wired into a relay that works great. What of value of resister are they using and what wire are they tapped into?
Burning Brakes
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 1,158
Likes: 6
From: Winter Springs Fla
Re: TIMING RETARD DEVICE FOR NITROUS? (MikeyD)
I run a 100 shot on the street with a predator tune and a stock motor and the car runs great .
If you have the NGK TR6's gapped to .035-.040 you shouldnt need to back out timing .
When i run a 150 shot at the track i use the predator editor to back out 10% or 2 degrees of timing and run 100 octain fuel for safety .
I check my plugs every time i race the car and they are still picture perfect .
I wouldnt bother changing the timing with only 4 degrees of advance unless you run the 150 shot jets .
[Modified by zoomz, 11:38 PM 3/11/2004]
If you have the NGK TR6's gapped to .035-.040 you shouldnt need to back out timing .
When i run a 150 shot at the track i use the predator editor to back out 10% or 2 degrees of timing and run 100 octain fuel for safety .
I check my plugs every time i race the car and they are still picture perfect .
I wouldnt bother changing the timing with only 4 degrees of advance unless you run the 150 shot jets .
[Modified by zoomz, 11:38 PM 3/11/2004]
Racer
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 304
Likes: 2
From: North Vancouver BC
Re: TIMING RETARD DEVICE FOR NITROUS? (bruce1)
Stand by... I am going to try using a relay and a resistor in the IAT circuit to trick the PCM into thinking the temp is 90* C ONLY when the nitrous is sprayed. I believe our stock C5 tables pull 6* of timing at this IAT temp.
I also bought a potentiometer, so I can swing the resistance on the IAT sensor wire to whatever I choose. I might mount this on my switch panel so I can adjust timing retard as I see fit (i.e if I run race gas).
I will then verify using EFILive
If this works, total cost will be ~ 10 bucks.
I also bought a potentiometer, so I can swing the resistance on the IAT sensor wire to whatever I choose. I might mount this on my switch panel so I can adjust timing retard as I see fit (i.e if I run race gas).
I will then verify using EFILive
If this works, total cost will be ~ 10 bucks.
Racer
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 353
Likes: 0
From: Jonesboro AR
Re: TIMING RETARD DEVICE FOR NITROUS? (bruce1)
Racer
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 304
Likes: 2
From: North Vancouver BC
Re: TIMING RETARD DEVICE FOR NITROUS? (newberd)
ok.
For $5 I am now retarding 6 degrees of timing when the nitrous hits. For 3 dollars more I can choose how much timing to retard (up to 6 degrees with stock timing tables).
I used a relay to activate when the nitrous is armed. When armed, the relay switches the IAT sensor over to a 330 ohm resistor to simulate 180*F IATs. I could have used a 10k ohm potentiometer and mounted it in cabin to adjust timing retard in real time. I verified with EFILive and my timing is down at 22-23* now instead of 28-29 on the nitrous. It stays at 28-29 N/A.
THis is nothing I made up - it's all over another LS1 board - but it works great!
I have a little wiring diagram if anyone wants it - I can email it.
[Modified by Drako, 11:48 PM 5/8/2004]
For $5 I am now retarding 6 degrees of timing when the nitrous hits. For 3 dollars more I can choose how much timing to retard (up to 6 degrees with stock timing tables).
I used a relay to activate when the nitrous is armed. When armed, the relay switches the IAT sensor over to a 330 ohm resistor to simulate 180*F IATs. I could have used a 10k ohm potentiometer and mounted it in cabin to adjust timing retard in real time. I verified with EFILive and my timing is down at 22-23* now instead of 28-29 on the nitrous. It stays at 28-29 N/A.
THis is nothing I made up - it's all over another LS1 board - but it works great!
I have a little wiring diagram if anyone wants it - I can email it.
[Modified by Drako, 11:48 PM 5/8/2004]
Melting Slicks
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 3,011
Likes: 9
From: Dublin GA
Re: TIMING RETARD DEVICE FOR NITROUS? (Drako)
ok.
For $5 I am now retarding 6 degrees of timing when the nitrous hits. For 3 dollars more I can choose how much timing to retard (up to 6 degrees with stock timing tables).
I used a relay to activate when the nitrous is armed. When armed, the relay switches the IAT sensor over to a 330 ohm resistor to simulate 180*F IATs. I could have used a 10k ohm potentiometer and mounted it in cabin to adjust timing retard in real time. I verified with EFILive and my timing is down at 22-23* now instead of 28-29 on the nitrous. It stays at 28-29 N/A.
THis is nothing I made up - it's all over another LS1 board - but it works great!
I have a little wiring diagram if anyone wants it - I can email it.
[Modified by Drako, 11:48 PM 5/8/2004]
For $5 I am now retarding 6 degrees of timing when the nitrous hits. For 3 dollars more I can choose how much timing to retard (up to 6 degrees with stock timing tables).
I used a relay to activate when the nitrous is armed. When armed, the relay switches the IAT sensor over to a 330 ohm resistor to simulate 180*F IATs. I could have used a 10k ohm potentiometer and mounted it in cabin to adjust timing retard in real time. I verified with EFILive and my timing is down at 22-23* now instead of 28-29 on the nitrous. It stays at 28-29 N/A.
THis is nothing I made up - it's all over another LS1 board - but it works great!
I have a little wiring diagram if anyone wants it - I can email it.
[Modified by Drako, 11:48 PM 5/8/2004]
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Pro
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 748
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From: NC
Re: TIMING RETARD DEVICE FOR NITROUS? (Drako)
email sent requesting the wiring diagram.
great stuff, why drive on the street with 6-8 pulled out.
i imagine this would also work for high compression motors. if you tuned your car on race gas and then dialed timing back for street use and standard gas.
great stuff, why drive on the street with 6-8 pulled out.
i imagine this would also work for high compression motors. if you tuned your car on race gas and then dialed timing back for street use and standard gas.
Racer
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 304
Likes: 2
From: North Vancouver BC
Re: TIMING RETARD DEVICE FOR NITROUS? (bogielake)
Yes. You could also use Edit or HP tuners to set timing advance for different IAT points. Then use a potentiometer instead of a resistor to dial in the timing based on the gas and power adder conditions. The Pot would be wired in at the same spot as the resistor in the diagram, but you could have it in the cabin to adjust while driving even.
Now my problem is that with this third relay in my system, the 2nd stage nitrous shot aint workin no more lol. I wonder if they are trying to pull too much current from the Breathless TPS switch (all three relay coils - 2 for nitrous and 1 for IAT tricker - are in parallel off the TPS switch).
Now my problem is that with this third relay in my system, the 2nd stage nitrous shot aint workin no more lol. I wonder if they are trying to pull too much current from the Breathless TPS switch (all three relay coils - 2 for nitrous and 1 for IAT tricker - are in parallel off the TPS switch).
Drifting
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 1,878
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From: EP Texas
St. Jude Contributor
Re: TIMING RETARD DEVICE FOR NITROUS? (Drako)
Great stuff! Send me details on diagram, and where/what to get all the needed parts. Once I do my 100-150shot, I was thinking about redoing the tune that 21MC did for the H/C install, but this way, the car is the same N/A, and can switch over to Nitrous mode without spending several hundred on a device or re-tune!!
Racer
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 290
Likes: 9
From: Dallas TX
CI V Veteran
Re: TIMING RETARD DEVICE FOR NITROUS? (TexCorvette)
i use the ramchargers box and it works great!!! you cna also use it as a window switch for the spray as well as a delay function. you cna add or remove timing on the spray as well as hard set for NA... best of all NO wiring plugs directly into your crank sensor..
I'll be happy to answer any questions if you need.. just email..
I'll be happy to answer any questions if you need.. just email..
Racer
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 304
Likes: 2
From: North Vancouver BC
Re: TIMING RETARD DEVICE FOR NITROUS? (Chicago ZO6)
I've tried to send the diagram to all - if you didnt get it email again cplawson@shaw.ca or PM me.
Any questions just holler. It's working great for me so far, and the nitrous hits even harder with less timing.
Any questions just holler. It's working great for me so far, and the nitrous hits even harder with less timing.
