Hey dont get mad at me if you dont want to face facts...A heads/cam package will be more reliable than a supercharger...thats really a fact...on top of things with a supercharger, tuning is EXTREMELY important....even 2 degrees of too advanced ignition can spell disaster..

Also, NA cars have better powerbands...A 450whp NA car will always outperform a 450whp FI car anyday, whether at the drag strip or around a road course....id rather make power NA

 

Fact #1 Most bang for the buck.

Fact #2 With the Maggie you get a warranty (you get that with H/C?)

Fact #3 You don't tear your motor apart.

 

I know theres positives to FI, but there are negatives....Just trying to list them all so people can take a look and choose for themselves...

 

Then you should back up all the negative stuff with FACTS.

I don't know, nor have I found anyone who has maggied an LS1 or an LS6 either in a Vette or a CTS-V who has been sorry they did it.


That says a lot for the maggie.


That is one of the reasons I have one.

 

I went with the vortech kit and couldnt be happier. I added a fuel pump and a 25 shot of n.o.s . I have lg long tubes with borla x1 exhaust and a bbk throttle body. 573rwhp so far. Waiting to do bottom end and run more boost. I spoke with john linginfelter before his accident and he said with already high static compression he would go with n.o.s. kit or if im not i a tremendious hurry wait for the vortech kit to come out . He mentioned vortechs extensive fuel managment research. Runs smoother than stock and pulls hard. Be ready to change your clutch though when you finally hook up in 3rd it pulls so hard the clutch slips . Did mine 3 weeks later.

 

It seems most of the comments here are aimed at drag racing. Is anyone here experienced with a maggie and road racing. I was going to try and switch from my GTS to an 06 Z next year but an opportunity now exists to get an 04 Z with 15k miles from a friend for $31k. It has never been wrecked, he wants to unload it to free up some cash. I am thinking the 04 Z with a T1 kit, tranny cooler, diff cooler, aluminum radiator, Wilwood Brakes and a maggie might be pretty good track car. I figure I could get at least 500 hp/500 tq.

 

Howdy!

Great looking GTS - pretty much my favorite color combo for the Gen II's (I was _very_ close to buying one a couple of years ago, same color/stripe option).

$31K is a killer deal for an '04 - that car with a T1 suspension, extra coolers and upgraded brakes will be very competitive on track. Z's are very light (mine was 3088 with 1/4 tank, plus roll assembly), have good transient handling response, with bigger brakes you'd be able to brake *very* deep and not see much fade for a pretty long session (look into some additional cooling ducts as well, like the DRM product, even with aftermarket brakes).

I ran an event at Sebring last year, late spring but still extremely hot down in central FL. There was a nice guy with black Coupe running a mag setup (I'm 99% sure his name was Doug). Chatted with him a few times about tracking issues with the supercharger - he said he usually tops off with some 110+ octane or a little Torco for some added insurance, keeps an eye on his EGT's, and tended to run 10-12 minutes at a time, since he said the heat would creep up - nothing catastrophic, but he wanted to keep it safe. He was also running an aftermarket radiator, don't know about additional oil cooling.

Here's an interesting bit of info though - previous, he was running a moderately stout H/C setup: some LS6 heads ported by GTP, a "medium" cam (I want to say it was like an MTI X1 or so) - he said he had nearly 100 HP less, but he didn't worry at all about running the HC setup hard(er) on track for as long as he wanted. Nothing to monitor but the normal oil/coolant temp.

I can say from running my Supra (turbo) on track -v- my NA Z06, that the looming worry factor of FI does diminish it a touch - though passing a 996 TT on the back straight in the Supra like he was parked, helps a little

Just my $0.02 of anecdotal nonsense

 

I'm done with this sort of thing, but if I had to do it, I'd say heads and cam.

 

Most bang for your buck, I priced it out and with the polished intercooled maggie and a motorcity hood I wouldve shelled out $9k depending on the cost of paint. End result? 470 rwhp with a good tune,+ 70 lbs to the nose of the car.

Heads and cam? $2k, stg 2 cyl heads, $450 cam, $2k LG LT's with random cats/xpipe, $500 LS1 edit/HP tuners, $250 30 lb inj. ($5500.)

End result? 420-450 rwhp depending on tune and cam profile, subtract 20 lbs from the nose of the car with the LT's., for a weight difference of 100 lbs going the maggie route.

What attracted me to the Z in the first place was its near 50/50 weight distribution and svelte 3100 lb curb weight, I wanted more horsepower as does the next guy, but didnt want to detract from that.

Both routes will need other modifications, ie clutch, hardened output shaft, strut brace etc. So the whole $$ picture isnt painted entirely, all in all I will have paid another $3k easy in parts/labor for strengthening the drivetrain.

As far as reliability and warranty, the majority of major shops back their valvetrain work.

And as for diving into a motor, is the following really less labor intensive/complicated? removing your ac compressor to bolt on a s/c bracket, removing the intake manifold, removing the crank pulley to have it keyed, swapping fuel injectors, accomodating coolant reserviors, painting the hood.

Oh yeah if you go vortech, plumbing the oil feed line into the oil pan, (which will leak, I had a vortech LS1).

Also make sure your pulleys are lined up just right, I know of few SC owners who dont have to replace their serpentine belt frequently, some have more issues than others.

Right now my car is in the shop, H/C, dte strut brace, pro luk gold with lightweight alum. flywheel, hardened output shaft, tranny/heat shield.

I comtemplated SC, and with almost 11:1 compression it is a timebomb.
If I wouldve gone SC I wouldnt have gonne with the magnuson, I woulde gone ATI. Its self contained, no hood swap is necessary. Less heat soak. And as far as power goes, the old addage of roots blowers making more power under the curve is a load of crap.

Ive seen dyno graphs of centrifugal blowers next to positive displacent blowers, the ati and maggie to be specific on an LS6. And the maggie didnt make any more power down low, it just made less power up top.

Yeah dyno's # dont tell the whole story, but then theres always the quarter mile, and ATI/Vortech cars will walk intercooled maggie cars....

H/C for now, if I feel I need more than 500 bhp I would add a stroker crank with 9.5:1 compression pistons and an ATI-D1SC, that should complement the H/C set up nicely and put me around 700 rwhp on pump gas.

 

Good luck with your mods.

 

I went the H/C route (so far) and all I need to finish is AFR heads and LSX intake. I expect to make +450rwhp when it's done.

 

I haven't heard too many "testimonials" of warrenty work on blown vette (?) with broken motor. Warranty seems to cover the part not the results.

 

Great Looking GTS! I have a vid of an 02 Z with a Maggie, running at Willow Springs (I think... my memory from my bike days is hazzy...) with the gravity cavity, the down hill switch back... Anyways, he was very strong and the torq was realy pulling hard off the apex and pulling cars hard down the back straight, unitll the sound meter went 99 dBa (belt whine). IMO a few years ago FI where not as safe, but with better tuners, alky, cam, headers ect you can keep the boost a bit lower, tune it safer and still do it all. Great post!
Dave

 

This thread would be better suited for the F/I section of the forum .

There are alot of guys in there who are very knowledgeable when it comes to this topic. Its because of them I went with the TTi Stage X ( on a stock bottom!) and meth injection on my car. It all depends on what you really want your car to do . I wanted stealth and power , the Z06 405 HP was not enough for me. I also wanted the ability to " turn up" my kit if I found I still wanted more power beyond what the stock bottom could handle. At least then I could just forge and not have to worry about the expense of adding a different kit . Maggies are only rated to a certain power level , if you wanted more , you would need to look in another direction . There are alot of great kits for the corvette, from maggies to twin turbos , I think its great there are so many good choices. You just need to decide which is right for you . Do some research in the F/I section and then enjoy your decision !



Dan

 

hi guys,newbee on board. thanks for welcoming me into your circles. in regards to supercharger vs h/c.....i see alot of concern w/ HEAT issues. maybe its just me, but everything ive ever hopped-up from bikes to boats and now cars.HORSEPOWER IS HEAT, for the most part it is unavoidable, but controlable via fans, intercoolers, oils,water additives etc, ive had both, h/c and sc. currently running an intercooled maggie, i run it hard, on 100 degree days....no problem. ive run h/c build-ups hard in same conditions.....lots of pinging.....fuel load-up......stutters, sc speed is instant and its a pretty simple bolt-on..h/c thats a different story

 

It would be interesting to know how much HP is lost due to heat on an intercooled Maggie. For example if it dynos say 450 rwhp on a 65 F day and 180 deg engine temps. How much power does it make when it is 100 F day, 220 temps? I have seen as much as 50 rwhp lost due to heat on the dyno. That was on a Kenne Bell on a Porsche though. So if you start at 450 and lose 50, then you are at 400 rwhp. I am almost making that with bolt ons on my Z06.

 

Famous last words..

 

When I had my car dyno tuned I was fortunate to have good conditions, it was done at 65 degrees at done at sealevel.

 

Well, just to let you know that I decided to pull the trigger.

Maggie and Motor City hood.

Order was placed today.

Interesting discussion

 

If you go the Mag you won't be dissapointed, great street set up, fast and totally reliable, and changing the hood is fun anyway.