Mike Mercury

Yes to the C7 request

But... Dave McLellan did all the initial C5 design, chassis, and LS1 work; and then handed it all to Hill. I have a dealer C5 intro tape that was sent to the dealers in December 1996 - in preperation for their soon-to-be received C5's. You can see McLellan in most of the engineering parts of the video. The hydroformed frame, the rear transaxle, the LS1 powerplant... all McLelllans handiwork. Even the FRC was McLellans idea.

But for some reason, over the years Hill has been given the C5 halo - even though he was handed a near completed C5 car design on his first day as Corvette head engineer.

Using the already-designed FRC to house the Z06 engine & setup was Hills doing though. So he did add to the C5... but he wasn't the father of the C5 (more like an adopted parent).


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diyguy

I hope in the spirit of the Corvette, changes can be made for the better.


What is an unknown, is how far will a racing background engineer take it in compormise of looks??

Just hope he doesn't decide to move in and re-arrange all the furniture.

0Jeff @ TPE

That could be a good thing though. Cause at the rate the C5/C6 was going it would have air suspension and a built in latte maker by 2008.

They need to get back to what the corvette was all about, and get away from the car that appeals to Cadillac driving, Navigation using car buyer. If you want that then buy a vehicle that caters to that.

Dont get me wrong. Theres a place for everything, but it makes me sick to see guys driving around in their Corvette that hasnt been over 55 in 2 years and has every chrome doodad Ecklers makes on the car.

Since darn near the inception of the Corvette its been about "Sports Car" NOT "Luxury Car" over that last couple of years the mentality has changed.
All it does, is cause us guys who drive the car for what it is, have to remove MORE of the inferior parts and ADD the parts that allow it to perform to its potential.

That being said, Dam! I wish the C5 had Navigation...

indy300

Can someone please give me REASONS why they think Hill hurt Corvette?

Mike Mercury

source: Autoweek

ben dover

Damn Mike, it's a dead ringer.

indy300

Thanks for ruining the z06 for me

BLUC5

[QUOTE=AMERICAN_HP]

Dont get me wrong. Theres a place for everything, but it makes me sick to see guys driving around in their Corvette that hasnt been over 55 in 2 years and has every chrome doodad Ecklers makes on the car.
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Since I am near 55 and have chrome on my C5 in many places I guess you are referring to me. As well as many others on this forum equally proud of their cars. I really appreciate my vette and its design. I have invested significant dollars over the past two years to make it something that keeps non-Vette car owners drooling and this means both esthetic looks and increased power. This is a part of the mystic of the car and their proud owners and looking at many of the posts on here many others feel the same way. Normally us Vette guys stick together...

Mike Mercury

that's not the Z06. This was from an Autoweek well over a year ago... before the Z06 was ever seen. That little notch (where the Z06 cold air intake is) was photochopped by AW to simulate ET's nose.

They just got lucky that it turned out to be there on the Z06 as well.

j3studio

Careful here...the Corvette has always been considered a bit luxurious for a 'true' sports car - you just have to read some of those old reviews...

Frizzle86

Sounds cool, i wonder if he will make a turbo vette ...

I have not driven a C6 yet, tho I have driven several C5s.

I would hope they make the suspension stiffer, then your average C5 or C6 has... with more 'sports car then luxary' as others have mentioned.

Then again its mostly older adults who can afford these things, annoyances to them such as 'road noise' and hard suspensions seem to bother them.

Perhaps GM has found a 'happy' medium with the C5 and C6 Genarations. The only thing i wish they fixed was the ultra notchy and extremely long throw of the 6 spd shifter. My 88 dodge shadow had a smoother stick then most of the stock mn6 vettes i've driven.

ModRed405

McLellan retired at the end of 1992. I'm not sure why he would figure prominently in the video you mentioned. Of course, much work had gone into the 5th gen by the time McLellan retired, as the original target of the C5 was 1993, but Dave Hill made the C5 a masterpeice. There were many attributes of the car determined by the time McLellan left, but I doubt the specs of the LS1, for example, and the other specifics you mentioned, were his work.

It's also the first time I've seen McLellan given credit for the FRC. That doesn't jive with anything I have ever read, including "ACAR".

Mike Mercury

it's easy to just make statements like that; but what did Hill exactly do for the C5 introduced in 1997 ?

I gave specific examples of what McLellan had done for the (then upcoming C5); what do you have specifically that Hill did for the C5 in it's final 1997 design ?

That's what I mean exactly. Hill gets the C5 crown - but no one knows what he really added/changed to what was already handed to him on his first day.

it's simple; just accept the facts... that McLellan gave the C5 all it's engineering and performance goodies. Once you see this is the fact, then it won't be so difficult to understand why "he would figure prominently in the video".

For some reason, C5 history has been re-written IMO to give Hill way-too-much credit. The only Corvette series Hill can claim an "all Hill design" is the C6 - and to many people that's not much (the styling aspects ) of a feather to put in ones cap.

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ModRed405

Why single out the styling, Mike? Did Hill snub you and **** you off at Carlisles or something? The 505HP C6 Z06 for $67K is a huge feather in a big-*** cap.

I'm not gonna argue with you on the other things. I have no first-hand experience, just information from books I have read (ACAR and McLellan's book). You must obvioulsy have some deep GM/Chevrolet connections giving you insider information because the things you say go against the printed word and conventional wisdom.

j3studio

Shouldn't criticisms of C6 styling be directed at the designers? I know all Corvette chief engineers have some influence on styling (often not as much as they would like), but I doubt he was the one drawing it up...

0Jeff @ TPE

[QUOTE=BLUC5]I didnt talk about "Guys" that were over 55. I was talking about the car NEVER being over 55MPH. I know quite a few 55y/o's that would whoop me on any givin sunday.


I fail to see the previous years as luxurious. The only one that even remotely looks like it would be considered that waywould be the early C1's.

j3studio

To me, it's all about the context for what other sports cars had in those years. Some examples;

Corvettes had air conditioning as optional in 1963, prevalent by 1971, and standard in 1980.

Corvettes had leather seats as optional in 1963, prevalent by 1984, and standard in 1994.

I'm not even going to start about fancy, high buck stereos (C4), custom interior trim and power everything (C3), teakwood steering wheels (C2), or power tops (C1). All of these are the trappings of a luxury-oriented vehicle and have nothing to do with performance.

Mike Mercury

and the excuses flow...

But my main point was that Hill was not the father of the C5; he adopted it - near its' adulthood.

And what about the big dissapoinment over the 50th anniversary car.. and the outgoing C5 year (collectors edition). Nothing but stripes and paint.

I was asked earlier if Hill pizzed me off at sometime. I have a return question for you... did Hill buy-you-off at somepoint????

Falsely giving him the props for the C5 design, and forgetting all the dissapointment that was rampant here with the 50th and 04 collectors version, and the negative outcry about the front end styling of the C6 ... sometimes it seems like a cult.

jrut

Dave Hill hurt the Corvette? Is that why the new Z06 is faster than a viper while costing $20,000 less? I think he's done fine.

Tom Wallace sounds like a great choice, beats the hell out of having an accountant put in charge.

Maybe the more important concern is that GM dosen't go bankrupt...

j3studio

Well, I'm obviously not your guy, since we love our 50th and it's magnetic ride. It can't have been that much of a disaster - it sold the best of any anniversary edition since 1978.

I also don't think a difference of opinion means you have to accuse folks of having been bought off...