Crash &^!#%~%~~
Administrator
Joined: Mar 2001
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From: In a parallel universe. Currently own 2014 Stingray Coupe.
C7 of the Year - Modified Finalist 2021
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St. Jude Donor '03 thru '26
NCM Sinkhole Donor
CI 5, 8 & 11 Veteran
Sorry to see your car looking like that. Good luck with the repairs and if they do total it, hope they give you a good settlement.
Melting Slicks
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 2,296
Likes: 0
From: Pearland TX
St. Jude Donor '03-'06-'07-'08-'09
Glad you are OK.......pics make me sick as I got hit by a drunk driver in Oct, so I know about your worst nightmare coming true. Your damage looks a little worse than mine. Luckily I had no frame damage...just front bumper, hood and right headlight. My airbags didn't deploy and there was no engine or right tire damage. It was costly but the amount wasn't even close to what it would have been if totalled.
Last edited by C5-NOIR-TX; Feb 13, 2006 at 01:49 PM.
Team Owner
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 20,933
Likes: 905
From: salem OR
I went through this in my 98SS, In 2003 that lead to My 02 z-06
My car was hit in the exact same way and had the same look.
I had mine towed to my
driveway. Where it sat, they came and looked, Then they said we are
taking the car to the bodyshop to determine the damage. And mak repairs I said this car will NOT be repaired.But I told them they were welcome to do anything they needed in my drive to determine damage and cost of repairs.Remember to stick your points with out flaming them because they will be harder to deal with if they hate you.I understand "but" is a good answer for them.The car was going nowhere till it was settled .
Reasons
The car was bought new and had no paint work or prevois accidents.
and they were not going to put it back to same condition by repairing the car. Of a nice perfect orginal condition. And any repairs would have to be perfect, And I am tough to satisfiy in this regard.
Lost value because of been repaired. and the rental car charges were ticking.
They said NOway
I waited and did nothing. After 3-4 weeks the calls came again,
they got the same answer. another 2 weeks. It was OK
we will come get the car and give you so much,
then it was back and forth on a price.
then They have to offer it back at scrap value. I kept the car for 500.00 and promtly sold it for 3900.00 wrecked. ended doing well
3-4 weeks later . I had also hit my head.
ended with up 20g. Shopped for 6 months and bought My 02z
with 7k off of ebay.
My car was hit in the exact same way and had the same look.
I had mine towed to my
driveway. Where it sat, they came and looked, Then they said we are
taking the car to the bodyshop to determine the damage. And mak repairs I said this car will NOT be repaired.But I told them they were welcome to do anything they needed in my drive to determine damage and cost of repairs.Remember to stick your points with out flaming them because they will be harder to deal with if they hate you.I understand "but" is a good answer for them.The car was going nowhere till it was settled .
Reasons
The car was bought new and had no paint work or prevois accidents.
and they were not going to put it back to same condition by repairing the car. Of a nice perfect orginal condition. And any repairs would have to be perfect, And I am tough to satisfiy in this regard.
Lost value because of been repaired. and the rental car charges were ticking.
They said NOway
I waited and did nothing. After 3-4 weeks the calls came again,
they got the same answer. another 2 weeks. It was OK
we will come get the car and give you so much,
then it was back and forth on a price.
then They have to offer it back at scrap value. I kept the car for 500.00 and promtly sold it for 3900.00 wrecked. ended doing well
3-4 weeks later . I had also hit my head.
ended with up 20g. Shopped for 6 months and bought My 02z
with 7k off of ebay.
Last edited by 3 Z06ZR1; Feb 13, 2006 at 04:06 PM.
Team Owner
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 58,551
Likes: 95
From: The warm part of Anger Island
St. Jude Donor '09
On the bright side of things... nobody was seriously hurt and you now have a reason to do some major mods.
Either that or you could put a band aid sticker over it and enter it at shows as a work in progress like some of the ricers do. Just kidding.
Start looking for mods to buy.
Either that or you could put a band aid sticker over it and enter it at shows as a work in progress like some of the ricers do. Just kidding.
Start looking for mods to buy.
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 1,890
Likes: 1
From: Indiana
St. Jude Contributor
Well here's what I know after a day of chaos........
Dudes insurance guy says "It isn't totaled"....even though he hasn't seen any pics, or the car
My guy says," we'll take a look and see".......when I tell him who's the guys insurance company....he grimaces. I get in touch with MY insurance company and they are going to handle it and deal with the other one. Preliminary estimate (without getting under the hood and checking close is in the $15K neighborhood....not enough for a total.
I am gravely concerned about "unseen damage"......things like ALUMINUM "A" frames, spindles, broken belts on my nearly new Michelin ZP's, etc. As a sports car.....I worry about something being amiss later on down the road. The OTHER insurance adjuster wants me to pull it out and send it to their "in network" repair shop.
NFW....my guy races 3 cars in Hooters Pro Cup so he is a meticulous guy that does things correctly and won't cut corners.
I am definitely going to pursue "diminished value" if they repair it. Picture this: Two identical cars right down to mileage, options, mods, etc.....both asking the same price....which would you buy?!?!?! the repaired one or the "original"...... AND how much would the repaired one need to be discounted to be attractive?
I'm not trying to "make out" on this....I just want to be "made Whole"....after all, none of this is my fault
Dudes insurance guy says "It isn't totaled"....even though he hasn't seen any pics, or the car
My guy says," we'll take a look and see".......when I tell him who's the guys insurance company....he grimaces. I get in touch with MY insurance company and they are going to handle it and deal with the other one. Preliminary estimate (without getting under the hood and checking close is in the $15K neighborhood....not enough for a total.
I am gravely concerned about "unseen damage"......things like ALUMINUM "A" frames, spindles, broken belts on my nearly new Michelin ZP's, etc. As a sports car.....I worry about something being amiss later on down the road. The OTHER insurance adjuster wants me to pull it out and send it to their "in network" repair shop.
NFW....my guy races 3 cars in Hooters Pro Cup so he is a meticulous guy that does things correctly and won't cut corners.
I am definitely going to pursue "diminished value" if they repair it. Picture this: Two identical cars right down to mileage, options, mods, etc.....both asking the same price....which would you buy?!?!?! the repaired one or the "original"......
AND how much would the repaired one need to be discounted to be attractive?I'm not trying to "make out" on this....I just want to be "made Whole"....after all, none of this is my fault
Pro
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 538
Likes: 9
From: Geneva, IL Bring back the Chief!
St. Jude Donor '06-'07-'08-'09-'10,'13-'14,'19-'20-'21-'22
Originally Posted by chia
Without getting under the hood, you probably have enough damage to total it. Now, a lot of people are going to come on here and give you misguided information about how to deal with the insurance company: get a lawyer, sue the bastards, don't take anything less than some inflated "blue book" value, blah, blah, blah, but I've been doing this for 17 years so this is what generally happens with the insurance company:
Insurance companies will total a vehicle if the cost of repairs exceed 70-80% of the value of the car. If it's close, they will probably favor totaling it because of the additional cost of a rental vehicle. How they determine the value of the vehicle varies from company to company. What we use is NADA retail value and two dealer quotes. We will call a dealer and ask them how much they think they would sell your vehicle if they had one exactly like it (because it would be difficult to find a vehicle exactly like yours). The insurance company does not locate a replacement vehicle. We are not in the used car business. We owe you what the market says your car is worth. Now, we take the average between NADA and two dealer quotes, then add sales tax and title fees. If you have mods, give them the original receipts and they typically will give you some consideration for those. You will not get the original cost of your mods because they have been used. If you recently did maintenance related work like new tires or a battery, forget about it. Maintanance related work does not increase the value of your car.
The thing that most people do not realize is that you will typically get a better deal from the insurance company than if you tried to sell the unwrecked vehicle yourself. Some companies will give you straight NADA, which is almost always higher than what you could sell it for. For example, a 2003 coupe with 10,000 miles has an average NADA retail value of over $35,000. There is no way you could get 35k for your car if you tried to sell it yourself. 2003 Z06's with half the mileage are going for less than that.
Once you get an offer from your company, it's generally not going to be a low ball offer with the anticipation that you will argue it. If the market tells me your car is worth 30k, then the value is what it is. But, you need to ask the adjuster how he determined the value of the car because he may have missed something.
The last and most important piece of advise I can give you is to be pleasant and respectful of the claim rep. If you get belligerent, the adjuster will most likely take a very hard line on you. If you plead your case in a diplomatic manner, they are more likely to exercise some discretion to "increase" the value of the car. If I have a pleasant customer, I will find a way to make him happy. For example, I may average in an "auto trader" quote to increase the value of the car, even though the quoted price on auto trader probably is no where near what the vehicle ultimately would sell for. Some companies do not allow their adjusters to use any discretion, but some do.
Now, if the car is repairable, this is a whole other issue. The major issue with a repair job is new vs. used parts. Insurance companies do not owe your for original brand new parts. If "like kind and quality parts" are available, they will put them on. You are not entitled to new parts for a used vehicle. This has been litigated to death with the same result so it's a waste of time arguing it. Now some states allow for diminished value of a repaired vehicle so you'll need to check around for that. In your case, the vehicle looks close to a total so if the repair cost is borderline, you can make the argument that the cost of a rental during a repair may exceed the threshold, not to mention that the vehicle as is will bring some pretty good salvage value for the insurance company if they total it. Good luck and let us know how it goes.
Insurance companies will total a vehicle if the cost of repairs exceed 70-80% of the value of the car. If it's close, they will probably favor totaling it because of the additional cost of a rental vehicle. How they determine the value of the vehicle varies from company to company. What we use is NADA retail value and two dealer quotes. We will call a dealer and ask them how much they think they would sell your vehicle if they had one exactly like it (because it would be difficult to find a vehicle exactly like yours). The insurance company does not locate a replacement vehicle. We are not in the used car business. We owe you what the market says your car is worth. Now, we take the average between NADA and two dealer quotes, then add sales tax and title fees. If you have mods, give them the original receipts and they typically will give you some consideration for those. You will not get the original cost of your mods because they have been used. If you recently did maintenance related work like new tires or a battery, forget about it. Maintanance related work does not increase the value of your car.
The thing that most people do not realize is that you will typically get a better deal from the insurance company than if you tried to sell the unwrecked vehicle yourself. Some companies will give you straight NADA, which is almost always higher than what you could sell it for. For example, a 2003 coupe with 10,000 miles has an average NADA retail value of over $35,000. There is no way you could get 35k for your car if you tried to sell it yourself. 2003 Z06's with half the mileage are going for less than that.
Once you get an offer from your company, it's generally not going to be a low ball offer with the anticipation that you will argue it. If the market tells me your car is worth 30k, then the value is what it is. But, you need to ask the adjuster how he determined the value of the car because he may have missed something.
The last and most important piece of advise I can give you is to be pleasant and respectful of the claim rep. If you get belligerent, the adjuster will most likely take a very hard line on you. If you plead your case in a diplomatic manner, they are more likely to exercise some discretion to "increase" the value of the car. If I have a pleasant customer, I will find a way to make him happy. For example, I may average in an "auto trader" quote to increase the value of the car, even though the quoted price on auto trader probably is no where near what the vehicle ultimately would sell for. Some companies do not allow their adjusters to use any discretion, but some do.
Now, if the car is repairable, this is a whole other issue. The major issue with a repair job is new vs. used parts. Insurance companies do not owe your for original brand new parts. If "like kind and quality parts" are available, they will put them on. You are not entitled to new parts for a used vehicle. This has been litigated to death with the same result so it's a waste of time arguing it. Now some states allow for diminished value of a repaired vehicle so you'll need to check around for that. In your case, the vehicle looks close to a total so if the repair cost is borderline, you can make the argument that the cost of a rental during a repair may exceed the threshold, not to mention that the vehicle as is will bring some pretty good salvage value for the insurance company if they total it. Good luck and let us know how it goes.
Good "to the point" post. I would only add:
My cousin fixes vettes in his body shop in Chi-town burbs. He got customer with a $20k+ hit ('04 Z) which was about brand new at the time. My cousin and car owner presented to adjuster that the $20k+ fix, PLUS the diminished value settlement, was going to be higher than a total. The adjuster accepted the arguement and totalled the car.
That said, you may be able to use this lever, as the diminshed value settlement could be over $10k.
I worked this successfully myself when my wife got t-boned in her s-2000.
Good luck.
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Melting Slicks
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 2,385
Likes: 160
From: Orlando FL
Originally Posted by BWP 5P
Well here's what I know after a day of chaos........
Dudes insurance guy says "It isn't totaled"....even though he hasn't seen any pics, or the car
My guy says," we'll take a look and see".......when I tell him who's the guys insurance company....he grimaces. I get in touch with MY insurance company and they are going to handle it and deal with the other one. Preliminary estimate (without getting under the hood and checking close is in the $15K neighborhood....not enough for a total.
I am gravely concerned about "unseen damage"......things like ALUMINUM "A" frames, spindles, broken belts on my nearly new Michelin ZP's, etc. As a sports car.....I worry about something being amiss later on down the road. The OTHER insurance adjuster wants me to pull it out and send it to their "in network" repair shop.
NFW....my guy races 3 cars in Hooters Pro Cup so he is a meticulous guy that does things correctly and won't cut corners.
I am definitely going to pursue "diminished value" if they repair it. Picture this: Two identical cars right down to mileage, options, mods, etc.....both asking the same price....which would you buy?!?!?! the repaired one or the "original"...... AND how much would the repaired one need to be discounted to be attractive?
I'm not trying to "make out" on this....I just want to be "made Whole"....after all, none of this is my fault
Dudes insurance guy says "It isn't totaled"....even though he hasn't seen any pics, or the car
My guy says," we'll take a look and see".......when I tell him who's the guys insurance company....he grimaces. I get in touch with MY insurance company and they are going to handle it and deal with the other one. Preliminary estimate (without getting under the hood and checking close is in the $15K neighborhood....not enough for a total.
I am gravely concerned about "unseen damage"......things like ALUMINUM "A" frames, spindles, broken belts on my nearly new Michelin ZP's, etc. As a sports car.....I worry about something being amiss later on down the road. The OTHER insurance adjuster wants me to pull it out and send it to their "in network" repair shop.
NFW....my guy races 3 cars in Hooters Pro Cup so he is a meticulous guy that does things correctly and won't cut corners.
I am definitely going to pursue "diminished value" if they repair it. Picture this: Two identical cars right down to mileage, options, mods, etc.....both asking the same price....which would you buy?!?!?! the repaired one or the "original"......
AND how much would the repaired one need to be discounted to be attractive?I'm not trying to "make out" on this....I just want to be "made Whole"....after all, none of this is my fault
Racer
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 268
Likes: 0
From: Oh
Originally Posted by BWP 5P
Well here's what I know after a day of chaos........
Dudes insurance guy says "It isn't totaled"....even though he hasn't seen any pics, or the car
My guy says," we'll take a look and see".......when I tell him who's the guys insurance company....he grimaces. I get in touch with MY insurance company and they are going to handle it and deal with the other one. Preliminary estimate (without getting under the hood and checking close is in the $15K neighborhood....not enough for a total.
I am gravely concerned about "unseen damage"......things like ALUMINUM "A" frames, spindles, broken belts on my nearly new Michelin ZP's, etc. As a sports car.....I worry about something being amiss later on down the road. The OTHER insurance adjuster wants me to pull it out and send it to their "in network" repair shop.
NFW....my guy races 3 cars in Hooters Pro Cup so he is a meticulous guy that does things correctly and won't cut corners.
I am definitely going to pursue "diminished value" if they repair it. Picture this: Two identical cars right down to mileage, options, mods, etc.....both asking the same price....which would you buy?!?!?! the repaired one or the "original"...... AND how much would the repaired one need to be discounted to be attractive?
I'm not trying to "make out" on this....I just want to be "made Whole"....after all, none of this is my fault
Dudes insurance guy says "It isn't totaled"....even though he hasn't seen any pics, or the car
My guy says," we'll take a look and see".......when I tell him who's the guys insurance company....he grimaces. I get in touch with MY insurance company and they are going to handle it and deal with the other one. Preliminary estimate (without getting under the hood and checking close is in the $15K neighborhood....not enough for a total.
I am gravely concerned about "unseen damage"......things like ALUMINUM "A" frames, spindles, broken belts on my nearly new Michelin ZP's, etc. As a sports car.....I worry about something being amiss later on down the road. The OTHER insurance adjuster wants me to pull it out and send it to their "in network" repair shop.
NFW....my guy races 3 cars in Hooters Pro Cup so he is a meticulous guy that does things correctly and won't cut corners.
I am definitely going to pursue "diminished value" if they repair it. Picture this: Two identical cars right down to mileage, options, mods, etc.....both asking the same price....which would you buy?!?!?! the repaired one or the "original"......
AND how much would the repaired one need to be discounted to be attractive?I'm not trying to "make out" on this....I just want to be "made Whole"....after all, none of this is my fault
If they still insist on repairing, at the very least, have your shop tear down the vehicle and write a supplement for any hidden damage BEFORE you authorize repairs(the insurance company cannot authorize repairs, only you as the vehicle owner can). The insurance company will owe you for the cost of repairs whether you fix the vehicle or not. They pay you the repair cost then you can sell the salvage with a clean title. You'll get higher bids with a clean title than you would with a salvage title. Hopefully this will get you to a number that's close to the market value of the vehicle. Good Luck
Le Mans Master
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 7,027
Likes: 6
From: Shiloh Ohio
Originally Posted by chia
Here's something you can do. Have the vehicle towed to your shop choice and request a tear down to determine if there is any additional damage, which I'm sure there is. Once it's torn down, the adjuster can re-inspect and supplement his estimate. Also make sure that the estimate accounts for blend time to the adjacent panels. The labor rate for body and paint should be competitive. Here in Ohio we allow $42/hour, should be the same in Indiana. The mechanical labor rate will be higher, $56/hour or more. Let's say they find an additional $3,000 in repairs. Now you're up to $18,000. If you have rental car coverage on your policy, that's another at least $1,000 they have to pay to Enterprise or whomever if they repair this car, which I'm guessing would take at least a month. Add in diminished value, which I hope your state recognizes, and you're up over $22,000 or more. Lastly, have some local yards bid on the salvage. I bet you can get at least $7500 for it. Before you know it you're at $30,000, which is close to the market value of this car. They pay you and take the salvage with a clean title.
If they still insist on repairing, at the very least, have your shop tear down the vehicle and write a supplement for any hidden damage BEFORE you authorize repairs(the insurance company cannot authorize repairs, only you as the vehicle owner can). The insurance company will owe you for the cost of repairs whether you fix the vehicle or not. They pay you the repair cost then you can sell the salvage with a clean title. You'll get higher bids with a clean title than you would with a salvage title. Hopefully this will get you to a number that's close to the market value of the vehicle. Good Luck
If they still insist on repairing, at the very least, have your shop tear down the vehicle and write a supplement for any hidden damage BEFORE you authorize repairs(the insurance company cannot authorize repairs, only you as the vehicle owner can). The insurance company will owe you for the cost of repairs whether you fix the vehicle or not. They pay you the repair cost then you can sell the salvage with a clean title. You'll get higher bids with a clean title than you would with a salvage title. Hopefully this will get you to a number that's close to the market value of the vehicle. Good Luck
So you are giving him some good advice.
Drifting
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 1,753
Likes: 29
From: McKinney TX
Originally Posted by BWP 5P
Dude runs a stop sign in town....I have NO chance of missing...I swerved and hit him a glancing blow (94 Sonoma)...but look what happened 
I know for sure the frame is bent up front. I have no clue if it can be straightened. Looks like I won't be driving this one on vacation to Houston in three weeks!
IF they total it....does HIS insurance buy me a new one?
I know for sure the frame is bent up front. I have no clue if it can be straightened. Looks like I won't be driving this one on vacation to Houston in three weeks!
IF they total it....does HIS insurance buy me a new one?
Safety Car
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 4,394
Likes: 6
From: Melbourne FL
I was in a frontal crash with similar damage as yours. My repair bill was on the 15K range. Totalled or not will depend on how much frame rail damage you have and that can only be dertermined once you start taking pieces off the car and get the frame rail exposed.
Best of luck on the repair process. Mine took 6 weeks.
Best of luck on the repair process. Mine took 6 weeks.
Last edited by Z06ufgrad2002; Feb 13, 2006 at 07:55 PM.
Safety Car
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 4,353
Likes: 22
From: Bella Vista Ca
Sorry to hear about your luck...
This thread really makes me think, I have put a good $15,000+ in mods to my car. How would I handle an accident and the value of my car. Maybe I should call my insurance company about the added value?
This thread really makes me think, I have put a good $15,000+ in mods to my car. How would I handle an accident and the value of my car. Maybe I should call my insurance company about the added value?
Instructor
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 171
Likes: 0
From: Caledonia, MI, USA
I just repaired one that had the complete frontend taken off in an accedent. I turned out great and is going to be a great driver. i would be interested in your car if you get a settlement and decide to sell, or if you insurance company is buying it due to a total. Let me know.
Thread Starter
Drifting
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 1,890
Likes: 1
From: Indiana
St. Jude Contributor
Originally Posted by Mike04
Sorry to hear about your luck...
This thread really makes me think, I have put a good $15,000+ in mods to my car. How would I handle an accident and the value of my car. Maybe I should call my insurance company about the added value?
This thread really makes me think, I have put a good $15,000+ in mods to my car. How would I handle an accident and the value of my car. Maybe I should call my insurance company about the added value?
Trust me....in 40 years of driving I've never caused an accident and have avoided LOTS. As a Biker...I am always aware of the other guy....but like Monte Hall's crash....sometimes they can be unavoidable.As for how you'd handle it....you'd be sick to your stomach....just like all of us
And I've only got about $3500 xtra in mine....quite tame compared to many of you. I'd definitely look into the extra coverage if it's available. Bruce
Instructor
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 188
Likes: 0
From: Atascadero California
Originally Posted by BWP 5P
Well here's what I know after a day of chaos........
Dudes insurance guy says "It isn't totaled"....even though he hasn't seen any pics, or the car
My guy says," we'll take a look and see".......when I tell him who's the guys insurance company....he grimaces. I get in touch with MY insurance company and they are going to handle it and deal with the other one. Preliminary estimate (without getting under the hood and checking close is in the $15K neighborhood....not enough for a total.
I am gravely concerned about "unseen damage"......things like ALUMINUM "A" frames, spindles, broken belts on my nearly new Michelin ZP's, etc. As a sports car.....I worry about something being amiss later on down the road. The OTHER insurance adjuster wants me to pull it out and send it to their "in network" repair shop.
NFW....my guy races 3 cars in Hooters Pro Cup so he is a meticulous guy that does things correctly and won't cut corners.
I am definitely going to pursue "diminished value" if they repair it. Picture this: Two identical cars right down to mileage, options, mods, etc.....both asking the same price....which would you buy?!?!?! the repaired one or the "original"...... AND how much would the repaired one need to be discounted to be attractive?
I'm not trying to "make out" on this....I just want to be "made Whole"....after all, none of this is my fault
Dudes insurance guy says "It isn't totaled"....even though he hasn't seen any pics, or the car
My guy says," we'll take a look and see".......when I tell him who's the guys insurance company....he grimaces. I get in touch with MY insurance company and they are going to handle it and deal with the other one. Preliminary estimate (without getting under the hood and checking close is in the $15K neighborhood....not enough for a total.
I am gravely concerned about "unseen damage"......things like ALUMINUM "A" frames, spindles, broken belts on my nearly new Michelin ZP's, etc. As a sports car.....I worry about something being amiss later on down the road. The OTHER insurance adjuster wants me to pull it out and send it to their "in network" repair shop.
NFW....my guy races 3 cars in Hooters Pro Cup so he is a meticulous guy that does things correctly and won't cut corners.
I am definitely going to pursue "diminished value" if they repair it. Picture this: Two identical cars right down to mileage, options, mods, etc.....both asking the same price....which would you buy?!?!?! the repaired one or the "original"......
AND how much would the repaired one need to be discounted to be attractive?I'm not trying to "make out" on this....I just want to be "made Whole"....after all, none of this is my fault
Sit back and let the shop and adjuster from your company do their thing... When its all over, they will either offer to total or fix, If they offer to fix, don't worry, your at a good shop, so all should be OK, besides, if you have any reservations, you can always sell or trade after the repairs, and its much easier to get money out of a whole Vette than half of one...
Cars that were hit much harder than yours get returned to like new condition every day, It just depends on having your car in a good shop.