Hello, I've been lurking for a few months trying to gather info as i prepare to buy my first corvette. I must say I've already learned a tremendous amount of knowledge.

As I've been looking for cars I've tended to weed out the ones with the selective damping suspension, one because I don't really need it, and two because I'm afraid of it going out and having to pay a large amount to replace the dampers. I was wondering if these suspicions were true or not and what kind of problems people have had.

Thanks for the feedback!

 

I bought one with Z51 because of the same fears.

 

'01, 44k miles, nor problems with any of my F45 shocks, and LOVE the adjustability.

 

I purposely chose a car that had the f45 because I liked the option. That is, until I drove with it for a month. With it, the vette handled like a 60s muscle car. I was convinced to get rid of it when I got passed one night on a windy mountainous road by a honda element. That stuff is crap. I have since replaced the shocks, springs, and sway bars. I kept all of the f45 of course should someone ever want to return the car to stock (as it is a nice option on paper). My advice would be to stay away from it, or plan on replacing it.

 

You must admit that what you've done is really not a fair comparison. You also replaced springs and swaybars - with the swaybars providing probably the biggest noticable improvement in cornering.

I, too, replaced my swaybars with late Z51's (just a hair smaller than Z06 in the front; same as Z06 in the rear), and the handling is GREATLY improved. In fact, with this change alone, the change in F45 settings is now significantly more noticable.

 

I replaced my swaybars with Z06 in the front and back and then lowered and the ride is just fine now

 

Basically the major draw back is the price to replace the F45 shocks, at anywhere from $375-450 each, this is why I deleted the F45 and went with the Bilsteins/ZO6 sways/aluminum endlinks

If I would of known about the option before I purchased it, I definetly would of not went with the option, its basically up to your own preference, some like it, some dont, some cant really tell the difference between the adjustments, and if Modifications to your suspension is in the future I would think It would be much easier if the option wasnt on the vehicle, therefore not having to worry about deleting the F45 in the BCM.

Just my thought.

 

Now, THAT's a good perspective, PIZZANO, and one the original poster would do well to consider!

 

You're right, its not a fair comparison, but I didn't mean for it to be. The reason I originally changed out my suspension was due to the shocks, not the sways or springs. I changed sways and springs just because I was going to be "under there." I was "o.k." with the performance of those components (though not as impressed as one would imagine a vette would induce). I like the option in theory as much as the next sucker to purchase the F45 but the fact remains that the F45 shocks are garbage. The rebound from bumps is rediculous, regardless of the setting. I removed mine at 15k and have no reason to believe they were faulty, they just simply did not perform like the suspension componenets of a vette should.

 

Got rid of the F-45, Bilstiens and Hotchkiss sways- no comparison!

 

Thanks for the clarification. It's just too bad you decided to dump the F45 shocks first. Personally, I think you shorted yourself a bit. If you had changed just the swaybars first, you would've discovered they really are a pretty darned good shock.

But, you're not alone. Just take a look on this board. Many folks obviously first blamed the shocks, and changed them out. But, again, like you, they also changed swaybars, and some, again like you, also changed springs. So, of course they saw a world of difference...but by what standard? True, stiffer springs, shocks and swaybars make for a GREAT handling car, but ride suffers to a degree. Some people may deny it, but those people are on crack. Firmer components = firmer ride, which can, and does, translate into harshness at times, period. Of course, some folks will readily accept harshness in trade for handling because of a number of reasons, including the style of driving, WHERE they drive, and even how often they drive their cars.

I, on the other hand, wanted better handling, but did not want to compromise the ride too much because I drive 100% on the street, and most of my driving involves "normal" town and fast freeway, with a bit of backroad twisties here and there. So I just changed swaybars and kept the F45s. And, I'm darned glad I didn't change spring and shocks, because I feel that I am blessed with both worlds now. Great handling, but still have the ability to adjust compression and rebound rates for those roads that just plain suck, as well as smooth backroad twisties!

 

I have the F-45. I changed the sway bars to Z06. The car handles much better. One of the best bangs for the buck.

If I was tracking the car, Id consider changing the shocks. If I was tracking the car, I would have bought a differant car to start with. I like the F-45. I feel the differance between tour and performance, but not really from tour to sport, or sport to performance. I did not want a hard ride and like that cruising I can have a little softer ride. Playing I can dial in a litttle harder ride.

That swaybars made a world of differance !!!

 

I'm a little confused here, I thought the main attraction of the technology in the F45 suspension was not that you could adjust the dampening range on the fly with a **** (thats more of a cheap added feature IMO), but that a computer is able to adjust the dampening of the shocks individually many times a second (~ every inch at 70mph IIRC) using various sensors on the vehicle to automatically adapt to the road conditions. In theory, this would let the suspension float over bumps keeping the chassis more composed provided it can react fast enough. It could even reduce body dive and roll by stiffening up the rear or inside dampers respectively and softening the other side.

Delphi was able to bring the first truely successful active suspension system to market with the Vette, and I thought thats pretty impressive! I had read about other attempts, but they were massively expensive and quite heavy. There was a good track review of the F45 vs the Z51 suspension a while back, and IIRC the result was that the Z51 was quicker as the mag shocks had issues with heat (possibly a limitation in the fluid used). The softer springs and smaller swaybars surely made a difference too. Ultimately though, they felt the F45 was not only more comfortable, but the chassis felt more composed as well and they thought they'd prefer it for street duty where the roads aren't always perfect. Granted the new Z06 still isn't using the tech, but the tech itself obviously isn't flawed as you can find it on Ferrari Enzos, and in fact the same Magneride system used on Corvettes will be equiped on the 2007 Fiorano!

Hey, if its good enough for Ferrari...

http://delphi.com/manufacturers/auto...ide/magneride/

Edit:
BTW... I wish I still had the link, but I had seen a video a while back on a test course where they ran a F45 and standard suspension back to back. The driver in the standard suspension hit the bump and smacked his head hard against the headliner!!! The driver in the F45 supposedly at the same speed was just light in his seat and far less dramatic. Watching how stable the chassis remained the second time (the first on fixed dampening was launched in the air) on the external view was pretty amazing! Anyone have that?

 

What's there to be confused about? Your post pretty much tells the story... The F45 real-time dampening (RTD) technology is great, and having 3 different settings to enable it to work on a variety of road surface types is just plain wonderful. The later F55 is supposed to be even better, although F55 has only two different settings. Even the early FX3 was better than regular shocks, in my opinion. I would never own a Vette without RTD.

 

I live in Central Alberta, and the roads here are absolute crap. I have the f45 suspension, and you can definately tell the difference in all 3 settings. Thought when I bought the car that I would have it on Performance 24/7, but putting it on Touring gives the car a pretty smooth ride, and its great to have since I go over about 80 bumps and pass by 15 huge manholes just on the way to work.

 

Actually I changed mine because while initially lowering It, one of them arm dohickeys broke, the one that is cupped on both ends and attaches to the actuator and the upper control arm, and of course GM wont sell you just the $3 4" arm, no they make you purchase the whole actuator at a price of $250-300, so I did the math and a new set of New Bilsteins cost only that amount ,And Jeff(AmericanHP) offered to do the F45 Delete for Zilch at His Dealership, so It was a no brainer.

PeterPan actually had me hooked as far as lowring the vehicle on the stock F45's, when others were saying not too, but the inevidable happened, and now Im Slammed, and loving the Bilstein/ZO6swaybars/Aluminum endlinks set up.

I say if your going to change just one of them components, I would rather consider changing all three aspects for a package type upgrade.for the price , you cant go wrong.

 

Whats the life of the F45 suspension? I think its time for me to change them.
In sport im all over the road.

Is there any aftermarkets?

 

After markets would include either the 04 ZO6 shocks, or the Bilstein Sports(if lowred) Bilstein HD's (If not lowered), either waqy the F45 would have to be deleted from the BCM codes, otherwise your DIC will always read "traction system dissabled,unable for vehicle to travel over 80mph",.

This is changed by using the GM Tech II programmer that GM dealers have, they usually will charge you a billable Hour for the dervice, I would recomend if you do this, be there for the whole process so they dont screw it up, If you want a step by step procedure that they should use while using the Tech II, The information is listed in the link below.

http://forums.corvetteforum.com/show...um_id=1&arch=1

 

IIRC, the F55 dampers (03-04 and C6s Magneride are the same, correct?) are a direct drop in replacement for C5s with the F45 suspension. Same computer and everything, although the switch will only have two settings. The second sport setting on the F55 is supposed to be in a stiffer range than the F45s on the third setting, and it was supposed to have a longer jounce bumper (like a bumpstop but longer and softer and effectively another active variable spring at least on other modern cars). My Vette has too few miles to worry about it right now (w/o damage I'm thinking they should last at least 50-60K miles) so I haven't read the exact details recently but it was supposed to be a pretty simple affair so I'd check that option out as well.

When mine wear out, that is likely the route I'm going.

Edit: Here ya go, I found the part # for the upgrade kit
12499507 - C5 Corvette MagneRide Shock Upgrade kit
Upgrade your 1997-2002 Corvette F45 (only)Chassis Continuously Variable Real Time Damping (CCVRTD) suspension system with this MagneRide (F55) suspension system.

 

No problem here either--I love 'em