how many have the front bolts removed and how is the ride? does it effect anything else?

i have a bump steer kit on order and want to get my front lower before i get it all aligned and the bump steer kit installed.

 

I don't have mine removed but I have the bushings cut. Mine has a somewhat stiff ride but it's nothing that I can't handle.

 

No need to remove them, just cut about 2/3 of the bushing so to leave alittle rubber contact on the spring.

 

What bump steer kit are you getting? I'll be slamming mine in another week or two too.






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Best to leave some rubber on the end of the bolt.

When I lowered mine I screwed the bolt all the way in and cut the bottom section of rubber off (about 1/4").

Some people remove the screws and then you have metal on metal contact. I don't think it will ever wear anything completely thru, but a little rubber is a good thing.

Keep in mind that this will limit how low you can go. If you want to go as low as possible, you'll need to remove the bolt.

 

I have mine removed, just insert a piece of polyurethane between the spring and lower control arm, works great no noise and the ride isnt comprimised at all, this is the only way to do it if you want your front to be the lowest, otherwise if you want lower, Coil overs is the next step.

If your going to remove the bolt to cut the rubber, Heck your beter off just leaving the bolt out, Im sure cutting the rubber works, but if its for the reasons of just keeping the rubber for cushion, the procedure mentioned above will suite you fine

Cammed and Slammed,,,, the only way to go

 

Pics, anybody?

 

What the heck are they pawning off as a Bump Steer kit?????? Bump Steer is a technical suspension engineering term that has to do with the change of toe-in/out as the wheel goes up and down. It is a function of the integration of the geometry of the A-arms and the tie rods. The only way to change a specific bump steer curve is to relocate the steering rack up or down, and/or change the length of the rack and the tie rods. Non-A-arm suspensions also exhibit bump steer problems, like the C3 rear, which will toe in the oustide tire on a curve as the wheel goes into bump....making for a squirily back end on a road racing course. In the SCCA and also most Vintage racing groups, suspension mounting points cannot be changed to fix problems like these. This was even covered in detail on TV last fall when the guys from Sports Car Revolution and Dream Car Garage did a show on building a C3 vintage racer. They actually showed a setup like I used 30+ years ago to measure and chart bump steer back when I was doing that stuff to help pay my way through college. 2 dial indicators are placed on a rack just off the wheel, a plate is clamped to the wheel, and the suspension is jacked up and down. [ springs and dampers removed ] changes in the dial indicator readings are noted and reveal if the wheel is turning in or out as it is going up and down.

On this forum and others I have heard people describe the effect of hitting a bump or undulation while driving around a curve and having the car change its course slightly, as bump-steer. Sorry, this is NOT BUMP STEER!!!! It is just an adhesion change. I have also seen people describe hitting something on the road like a bumpy spot and feeling the steering wheel want to pull one way or another as bump steer, agan sorry this is just steering wheel feedback, NOT bump steer.

I have been on several websites offering 'bump steer kits' and found a total lack of comprehension as to what bump steer is.

If you are lowering your car by adjusting bolts, or removing them on the front, the spring rate still remains the same, so as long as you dont bottom out the shock absorbers, whic can and does happen, the 'ride' which is a function of spring rate and shock stiffness will not change. As the C5 has a tiny amount of bump steer [ not corrected by anythng I saw on any website] there will be TINY change in static toe-in as the ride height is adjusted. It can be measured, as I have done mysef, but it is a trivial amount. The alignment guys will always tell you you need an alignment. I still have some of the race car alignemnt equipment I have used over the years and have checked my toe and camber before and after lowering to the limit of the stock bolts front and back, and found I needed to correct nothing. You will also get a tiny bit more negative camber, the top of the wheel closer to the middle of the car than the bottom.....The amont od change is usually about a quarter of a degree or so, smaller than the tolerance of adjustment specified by GM for the Vette. On most tires, this very slight increase of negative camber is actually a good thing for cornering. Stiff wall run-flat tires can tolerate only a small amount of static camber, the do like to be pretty much near zero, straight up and down because of the absence of sidewall flex. They also ride like H*ll, stiff and bouncy. and have poor adhesion compared to a conventional tire, but that run-flat characteristic is important to some people for very good reason, and may well be a compromise worth making.

I learned how to do all this 40 some years ago, and even had personal correspondence with the late Len Terry and Eric Broadley [ Lola founder and chief designer] , THE top race car engineers who ushered in the mid engine revolution, and a bit later the wide tire revolution. Smart guys, they were! In the late 70s or early 80s , Steve Smith Motorsports published 'Advanced Race Car Suspension Design and Development' which was the only really good book ever published on how to actually engineer and design a good suspension system. In recent times, software and CAD has made the job much easier, but I have not had the pleasure of working with any of those programs, as I am no longer working in that field. My last professional wheeled vehicle project was as VP of Engineering for a small DARPA funded research company working on a fast ground vehicle weapons platform designed for the European theatre. That was back in the 80s, just as CAD was in its functional infancy. We still did everthing on paper and calculators back then, and built and tested real stuff. Now everthing is simulated.....but you still have to test the real thing and make adjustments. Ask ANY race car developer....The computers only get them in the ballpark, but to be successful on the racetrack they STILL have to be clever and tune the heck out of everthing until it works as good as can be be done in the time and $$ available. Geeze I have rambled on!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Hope this is somewhat helpfull.

 

this is what i ordered from LAPD.

http://www.thelapd.com/Merchant2/mer...e_Code=thelapd

my car darts to the left and right if i hit a good bump and it didnt do that until i lowered it. a guy i work with that is a serious autocrosser told me that that is probably what i needed because the suspension was out from where the factory set it because of lowering it.


with the 19/20 inch wheels, the rear already looks slammed and the front looks like a 4x4, so i just want to get a little rake on the car. especially since i will have my new conti's on which are about a half inch less sidewall than what i have now.

 

I looked at the Baer parts in your link, it appears to be legit. From what I am seeing described, with very lowered suspensions, the tie rods that control the toe-in are running out of travel, OR are having so much angular displacement as to go into a very non-linear region of toe-in which would be the result of faulty geometry in the original design. From what I can see, the Baer kit IS indeed designed to reduce the problems associated with excessing movement into the bound region. I have not run into this problem yet, as my car is not lowered as much by resetting the static suspension position as it is with lower profile tires on stock diameter wheels I am as far down as it wil go on 'stock bolts' and in combo with the low profile tires I am scraping all over the place. I am mounting ZO6 springs real soon, which should reduce suspension travel even more. On the drawing board is a set of sway bars much stiffer than the ZO6 bars currently mounted, which wil also tend to reduce bound on the outer wheels in cornering. The stiffness of these bars will fall in between the T1 bars and Hotchkiss. It is lowered just about as far as it can go and still deal with driveways and speed bumps. I have had to cut some of the air deflectors off and they still scrape all over the place too. The steel frames that extend under the front fascia are really beat up. This summer we are going to weld on some extra reinforcement and mount double roller wheels. I had the single wheel per side kit, and bent the heck out of everything with those so took them off. When you have larger diameter wheels as are fashionable these days, [ and allow mounting of the new generation of super-tires] that alone will raise your ground clearance. Given the profile of tires, needing at least some sidewall, you end up having to put the static suspension settings farther into bound to acheive a reasonable overall lowered look. Good luck on your project, and thanks for the introduction to the Baer kit. I'll keep it in mind if I ever go to 18s front -19s back, as I will need to totally reset my suspension if I do, and have exactly the same trouble.

 

I have my front bolts removed and lowered on longer bolts in the rear and the ride is fine (actually it's better). I have the adjustable electronic suspension from factory and I yanked it and installed bilstein sports (again, better ride and feedback). I bought a door mat as thin as I could find (made of some rubberish plastic material and cut it to fit nicely between the A-Arm's and leaf, no problems whatsoever and I take corners VERY hard since I upgraded my sway bars.

I did this about 3,000 miles ago and I recently replaced my brake pads and checked carefully for any problems regarding the front bolt removals and everything looked perfect to me.

Yank the bolts, put "something" between the A-arm and leaf to reduce friction and wear and enjoy a slightly lower front end (ever so slightly lower than cutting bushing off totally, which I did before removing the bolts completley).

This "link" is the "NEXT" step for me...change leafs for an even lower stance without having to go to coilovers.

http://forums.corvetteforum.com/show....php?t=1352496

 

i only cut 1/3 of the front bushing because i didn't want to go TOO low. it made all the difference i was looking for.

longer bolts in the rear now have more adjustibility than i'll ever need.

 

I have not removed mine and I think that backing them out have given the car a great look!

 

I removed the front bolts completely and have since noticed noises from the front end. I then rechecked everthing about 3 weeks later to make sure nothing had came loose.....nothing had but it was still making some noises. I didnt put anything between the spring and the control arm so its probally just the spring and control arm rubbing. It only makes noises sometimes when I turn sharply. Not to steal the thread but does anyone know what that could be? Good luck with the lowering you will love it, just make sure to watch out for steep inclines