Crashes caused by EBCM failure?
12-08-2006, 09:05 AM
#61
Le Mans Master
Originally Posted by FiberglassFan
This brings up another issue, that of the fact that the cars are set up to have understeer...I had to change springs, sway bars and go to wider wheels and tires in the front to make the car handle neutral in a corner. I am gratefull that my C5 does not have AH....part of the selection process when I was looking for my car. If I buy a second C5 and it happens to have AH I will do whatever it takes to totally disable it. ABS is fine, especially in the wet, as it can not increase brake application, or create a brake application on its own. I am very lery of having a bunch of low cost sensors and a computer known to have irregularitues decide to apply MY brakes all on it's own. Perhaps its time to ask some of our GM technical types how to disable the AH and leave the ABS intact. Could it be as simple as disconnecting servo activating wires at the AN brake actuators? I am not real pleased with the traction control either. I shut it off every time I start the car. I have found it to get into the way and actually prevent me from scooting out a dangerous situation more than once. I almost got hit once when the engine dropped to idle just as I REALLY needed it to push really hard.
As for your T/C being too intrusive......thats because up to 2000 (I think) the T/C was pretty harsh. In 2001 and up they changed it. I can get a decent amount of wheelspin before it (soft) cuts out. I had a 2000 and now have an 01.....big difference.
12-08-2006, 02:10 PM
#62
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There is a high probability he had the AH turned off. On a cold day, this is a way to quickly get into trouble as you are merging at a high rate of acceleration.
12-08-2006, 06:25 PM
#63
Burning Brakes
Originally Posted by AC54ME
While the following is not Corvette related, it provides, first hand, some activities that your friend should undertake if he is going to pursue legal action:
I had an accident in my Jeep Grand Cherokee Ltd on 1-17-04.
I was hit from behind while stopped at a stop light.
The force of the accident broke the back of the drivers seat - thus I ended up in the rear seat.
I have undergone 10 major surgeries, with at least two more required due to the seat back breaking.
A few months following the accident, and from comments the doctors treating me made, I decided to do some investigation on the history of seat back failures.
In the meantime I had the Jeep fixed, but for some reason I felt compelled to keep the broken seat.
During the time prior proceeding my investigation I also sold the Jeep (I was definitely afraid to ride in it after the accident). As a note, I also owned another Jeep grand Cherokee Ltd, and sold it for the same reason.
Following my investigation (WEB searches) I found the seat breaking to be a common occurrence. In addition, vehicle manufactures have never given consideration to this issue - they appear to provide a person hitting another vehicle/object plenty of protection via seat & shoulder belts, air bags, break- away steering wheels, etc., but minimal consideration to protecting one that is hit from the rear.
I eventually contacted a law firm that specializes in the matter of broken seat backs.
The first question was "do I have the vehicle"?
Next "has the vehicle been repaired"?
Next "has the vehicle been in your, or another's possession since the accident"?
It is PARAMOUNT that your friend NOT ALLOW anyone to repair the vehicle if he is going to solicit legal assistance.
It is also imperative that he not allow the vehicle to be out of his immediate control (physical) UNLESS the location where it is located provided security for the vehicle (I.e., no one could mess with it while it was there).
And most important - pictures, pictures, pictures, along with signed and notarized statements from any wittinesses that saw the accident.
Find a good, well established lawyer/law group that specializes in the specific area of vehicle safety issues, preferable one that has a track record with the Vette issue your friend feels contributed to his particular situation.
Hope this assists, and if the unit in the Vette was a contributing factor to the accident, I hope he pursues the matter via legal means.
I had an accident in my Jeep Grand Cherokee Ltd on 1-17-04.
I was hit from behind while stopped at a stop light.
The force of the accident broke the back of the drivers seat - thus I ended up in the rear seat.
I have undergone 10 major surgeries, with at least two more required due to the seat back breaking.
A few months following the accident, and from comments the doctors treating me made, I decided to do some investigation on the history of seat back failures.
In the meantime I had the Jeep fixed, but for some reason I felt compelled to keep the broken seat.
During the time prior proceeding my investigation I also sold the Jeep (I was definitely afraid to ride in it after the accident). As a note, I also owned another Jeep grand Cherokee Ltd, and sold it for the same reason.
Following my investigation (WEB searches) I found the seat breaking to be a common occurrence. In addition, vehicle manufactures have never given consideration to this issue - they appear to provide a person hitting another vehicle/object plenty of protection via seat & shoulder belts, air bags, break- away steering wheels, etc., but minimal consideration to protecting one that is hit from the rear.
I eventually contacted a law firm that specializes in the matter of broken seat backs.
The first question was "do I have the vehicle"?
Next "has the vehicle been repaired"?
Next "has the vehicle been in your, or another's possession since the accident"?
It is PARAMOUNT that your friend NOT ALLOW anyone to repair the vehicle if he is going to solicit legal assistance.
It is also imperative that he not allow the vehicle to be out of his immediate control (physical) UNLESS the location where it is located provided security for the vehicle (I.e., no one could mess with it while it was there).
And most important - pictures, pictures, pictures, along with signed and notarized statements from any wittinesses that saw the accident.
Find a good, well established lawyer/law group that specializes in the specific area of vehicle safety issues, preferable one that has a track record with the Vette issue your friend feels contributed to his particular situation.
Hope this assists, and if the unit in the Vette was a contributing factor to the accident, I hope he pursues the matter via legal means.
To what avail? What are his damages? The cost of his vehicle and some medical bills. I hate to say this but unless he was killed or paralized there are not many attorneys taking this case. Hopefully his insurance steps forward.
Regards-
John
12-08-2006, 06:51 PM
#64
Burning Brakes
Originally Posted by FASTFORM
There is a high probability he had the AH turned off. On a cold day, this is a way to quickly get into trouble as you are merging at a high rate of acceleration.
I agree. My AH saved me on a hard shift from 1st to 2nd on a "chilly" day and I live in Orlando,FL. I was accelerating in a straight line and the car wanted to turn around. No AH, cold day, hard shift at 70 mph+, can spell disaster. In my opinion that is probably what happened, unless you provide some other evidence. The odds are not with you considering the millions of times AH has worked as designed. By the way was he charged with a violation?
Regards-
John
12-09-2006, 06:33 AM
#65
Melting Slicks
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Originally Posted by gpracer1
If you hit the T/C button on a car with A/H , it turns them both off. You will ALWAYS have ABS on , unless there is a problem and the abs light is on.
As for your T/C being too intrusive......thats because up to 2000 (I think) the T/C was pretty harsh. In 2001 and up they changed it. I can get a decent amount of wheelspin before it (soft) cuts out. I had a 2000 and now have an 01.....big difference.
As for your T/C being too intrusive......thats because up to 2000 (I think) the T/C was pretty harsh. In 2001 and up they changed it. I can get a decent amount of wheelspin before it (soft) cuts out. I had a 2000 and now have an 01.....big difference.
In my 98, the TC is pretty strong when it comes on,,like pulling your foot all the way off the throttle. Most of the time I turn it off when starting the car. I once saw a product that inverts the operation of the TC button, that is to say, on startup, the gadget will automatically turn off your TC and off you go. If you want TC just push the button to turn it on. I guess Im not that lazy. ABS was and remains a HUGE safety improvement over older technology. I am not a fan of Traction Control, but if it wasn't as strong as it is on the earlier models like mine, I suppose its OK for most times and most people. As far as the active handling goes, I am glas mine does not have it...It was a selection criteria that whatever C5 I bought, it would not even have the system in it. If I ever replace my C5, or get another [ I would like a manual 6 someday for 'fun' driving ] there is some likelyhood that I might have to look seriously at a car equipped with AH and TC. If this ever comes p, I would sure want to know how to disable that system once and for all, and retain 100% effectiveness of the ABS. I know these systems share wheel speed sensors so the goal might not be as easy to implement. I will state for the record that it is my opinion that if a driver is not able to properly control a high performance car without computerized assistance, they ought not be driving it!
Car Crazy Jennifer
12-09-2006, 11:40 AM
#66
Drifting
Jen - you already said that.
All I can say is after almost 7 years I've never had a problem with AH/TC, not ever an overbearing TC kicking in unexpected. When it has kicked in it was at the right moments but not in any dangerous situation. Many have posted about how it saved their butts.
AH is one of the most significant safety advancements after seatbelts and airbags to be introduced, and is offered in many cars today. The system in the C5 is similar if not the same as what GM uses in their other cars. If there was a widespread problem in it's operation the NTSB would be forcing action.
And saying that it's an option the would prevent you from buying the car seems a bit extreme. As others have said it's easily disabled manually, and an aftermarket module was already sold before to default the system to OFF but apparently didn't sell well. I can understand people not wanting TC, but AH is still desireable (hence Competitive Mode). Many that have disabled AH ended up facing oncoming traffic as they slid off the road.
All I can say is after almost 7 years I've never had a problem with AH/TC, not ever an overbearing TC kicking in unexpected. When it has kicked in it was at the right moments but not in any dangerous situation. Many have posted about how it saved their butts.
AH is one of the most significant safety advancements after seatbelts and airbags to be introduced, and is offered in many cars today. The system in the C5 is similar if not the same as what GM uses in their other cars. If there was a widespread problem in it's operation the NTSB would be forcing action.
And saying that it's an option the would prevent you from buying the car seems a bit extreme. As others have said it's easily disabled manually, and an aftermarket module was already sold before to default the system to OFF but apparently didn't sell well. I can understand people not wanting TC, but AH is still desireable (hence Competitive Mode). Many that have disabled AH ended up facing oncoming traffic as they slid off the road.
12-09-2006, 11:55 AM
#67
Sorry, havent read the whole thread (just the first few) and I highly doubt it was anything more than your friend doing something stupid in the car he shouldnt have.
I remember a friend a few years back driving his new motorcycle and me following, then him falling off at around 100 mph (I was just going highway speed) and hurting himself and destroying his bike, continuously saying afterwords that his throttle was stuck.
I knew him too well to say BS to him, and that he was being a moron, and that was the cause.
After about a year, he finally admitted to me (after a few drinks) that it was all his fault, and he didnt negotiate the turn the right way - what I knew all along.
Sorry, I dont believe the story your friend is saying.
I remember a friend a few years back driving his new motorcycle and me following, then him falling off at around 100 mph (I was just going highway speed) and hurting himself and destroying his bike, continuously saying afterwords that his throttle was stuck.
I knew him too well to say BS to him, and that he was being a moron, and that was the cause.
After about a year, he finally admitted to me (after a few drinks) that it was all his fault, and he didnt negotiate the turn the right way - what I knew all along.
Sorry, I dont believe the story your friend is saying.
12-09-2006, 12:15 PM
#68
Le Mans Master
Originally Posted by FiberglassFan
In my 98, the TC is pretty strong when it comes on,,like pulling your foot all the way off the throttle. Most of the time I turn it off when starting the car. I once saw a product that inverts the operation of the TC button, that is to say, on startup, the gadget will automatically turn off your TC and off you go. If you want TC just push the button to turn it on. I guess Im not that lazy. ABS was and remains a HUGE safety improvement over older technology. I am not a fan of Traction Control, but if it wasn't as strong as it is on the earlier models like mine, I suppose its OK for most times and most people. As far as the active handling goes, I am glas mine does not have it...It was a selection criteria that whatever C5 I bought, it would not even have the system in it. If I ever replace my C5, or get another [ I would like a manual 6 someday for 'fun' driving ] there is some likelyhood that I might have to look seriously at a car equipped with AH and TC. If this ever comes p, I would sure want to know how to disable that system once and for all, and retain 100% effectiveness of the ABS. I know these systems share wheel speed sensors so the goal might not be as easy to implement. I will state for the record that it is my opinion that if a driver is not able to properly control a high performance car without computerized assistance, they ought not be driving it!
Car Crazy Jennifer
Car Crazy Jennifer
12-09-2006, 12:35 PM
#69
My active handling has come on for no reason on a straight dry road. It did not disrupt the stability of the car but it seems obvious that the car did not realize that it was going straight at a constant speed (~50mph). If the A/H can become confused then its clearly possible that it can try to recover from a non-existent skid and send the car spinning.
The car has been to the dealer 2x for this problem and they have no been able to figure it out. The DIC says the steering wheel sensor is at fault but the TechII reports that it is functioning well. On occasion, the A/H will shut down completely but restarting the car turns it back on and for the most part it functions normally. The car is going to go back to the dealer for a couple of days for data logging the A/H while driving it to get to the bottom of it.
To the issue of the Black Box. It is made by Vetronix. If you google Vetronix Crash Data Recorder Retrieval you should find several companies that will read the black box for you. The CDR system has two types of memory. The EEPROM is the permanent type which can only be written to once, once the airbags have deployed. The "near accedent" memory is volitile which means that it can easily be erased by someone trying to retrieve the data who doesn't know what they are doing. My point is to call one of these places first and find out how to handle the box removal and how to ship it so as not to lose anything in the RAM.
I think the information from the CDR would be of tremendous value to all of us.
Keep us posted
The car has been to the dealer 2x for this problem and they have no been able to figure it out. The DIC says the steering wheel sensor is at fault but the TechII reports that it is functioning well. On occasion, the A/H will shut down completely but restarting the car turns it back on and for the most part it functions normally. The car is going to go back to the dealer for a couple of days for data logging the A/H while driving it to get to the bottom of it.
To the issue of the Black Box. It is made by Vetronix. If you google Vetronix Crash Data Recorder Retrieval you should find several companies that will read the black box for you. The CDR system has two types of memory. The EEPROM is the permanent type which can only be written to once, once the airbags have deployed. The "near accedent" memory is volitile which means that it can easily be erased by someone trying to retrieve the data who doesn't know what they are doing. My point is to call one of these places first and find out how to handle the box removal and how to ship it so as not to lose anything in the RAM.
I think the information from the CDR would be of tremendous value to all of us.
Keep us posted
Last edited by ajderzie; 12-09-2006 at 05:27 PM.
12-09-2006, 04:02 PM
#70
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St. Jude Donor '08
Originally Posted by ajderzie
I think the information from the CDR would be of tremendous value to all of us.
Keep us posted
Keep us posted
12-10-2006, 10:41 PM
#71
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
Originally Posted by ajderzie
My active handling has come on for no reason on a straight dry road. It did not disrupt the stability of the car but it seems obvious that the car did not realize that it was going straight at a constant speed (~50mph). If the A/H can become confused then its clearly possible that it can try to recover from a non-existent skid and send the car spinning.
The thought going through my head is that if he was accelerating in 4th gear and the right rear brake locked up, not only would that wheel try to slow the right side of the car, but the left wheel would accelerate due to the differential... the combination of the right wheel slowing and the left wheel accelerating both happening at the same time would surely kick the back end of the car around quickly.
Originally Posted by ajderzie
To the issue of the Black Box. It is made by Vetronix. If you google Vetronix Crash Data Recorder Retrieval you should find several companies that will read the black box for you. The CDR system has two types of memory. The EEPROM is the permanent type which can only be written to once, once the airbags have deployed. The "near accedent" memory is volitile which means that it can easily be erased by someone trying to retrieve the data who doesn't know what they are doing. My point is to call one of these places first and find out how to handle the box removal and how to ship it so as not to lose anything in the RAM.
I think the information from the CDR would be of tremendous value to all of us.
Keep us posted
I think the information from the CDR would be of tremendous value to all of us.
Keep us posted
12-19-2006, 06:42 PM
#73
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
UPDATE:
Nothing to do with my buddie's situation, but I just discovered a thread on another forum involving random brake caliper activation on an '07 Z06!
THIS PROBLEM HAS NOT BEEN CORRECTED, WHATEVER IT IS, AND HAS THE POTENTIAL TO AFFECT ANY AND ALL CORVETTE DRIVERS.
Nothing to do with my buddie's situation, but I just discovered a thread on another forum involving random brake caliper activation on an '07 Z06!
THIS PROBLEM HAS NOT BEEN CORRECTED, WHATEVER IT IS, AND HAS THE POTENTIAL TO AFFECT ANY AND ALL CORVETTE DRIVERS.
12-20-2006, 01:08 PM
#74
Drifting
UPDATE:
Nothing to do with my buddie's situation, but I just discovered a thread on another forum involving random brake caliper activation on an '07 Z06!
THIS PROBLEM HAS NOT BEEN CORRECTED, WHATEVER IT IS, AND HAS THE POTENTIAL TO AFFECT ANY AND ALL CORVETTE DRIVERS.
Nothing to do with my buddie's situation, but I just discovered a thread on another forum involving random brake caliper activation on an '07 Z06!
THIS PROBLEM HAS NOT BEEN CORRECTED, WHATEVER IT IS, AND HAS THE POTENTIAL TO AFFECT ANY AND ALL CORVETTE DRIVERS.
I've searched the Corvette Action Center database as well as the NHTSA database for any Corvette brake system issues/investigations/recalls. There are none that I could find but if you can provide factual information that there is a widespread fault in the Corvette braking system do so. I'd be interested in your friend's final investigation report to also confirm that he was not doing anything dangerous.
12-20-2006, 07:10 PM
#75
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
http://www.z06vette.com/forums/showt...=104486&page=1
The one mentioned, involving the '07Z:
http://www.z06vette.com/forums/showthread.php?t=104357
Also mentioned in that thread was that 30% of C6Zs have been crashed??? I don't know if this is true or not...
As far as making a broad statement, what makes you feel that your car may not develop similar symptoms? My buddie's car has 60,000 miles on it, and the '07 was only a few months old...
Last edited by Blue Angel; 12-20-2006 at 07:27 PM.
12-21-2006, 02:25 PM
#76
Drifting
One related to a C5Z:
http://www.z06vette.com/forums/showt...=104486&page=1
The one mentioned, involving the '07Z:
http://www.z06vette.com/forums/showthread.php?t=104357
Also mentioned in that thread was that 30% of C6Zs have been crashed??? I don't know if this is true or not...
As far as making a broad statement, what makes you feel that your car may not develop similar symptoms? My buddie's car has 60,000 miles on it, and the '07 was only a few months old...
http://www.z06vette.com/forums/showt...=104486&page=1
The one mentioned, involving the '07Z:
http://www.z06vette.com/forums/showthread.php?t=104357
Also mentioned in that thread was that 30% of C6Zs have been crashed??? I don't know if this is true or not...
As far as making a broad statement, what makes you feel that your car may not develop similar symptoms? My buddie's car has 60,000 miles on it, and the '07 was only a few months old...
The second one identifies a possible problem with the wiring to one of the AH sensors (yaw or steering) which could trigger an erroneous braking condition on 2005/2006 models. Only one person had data confirm the system had operated erroneously, and C4C5specialist indicated those systems are completely different from earlier models.
Having said that, there is still no systemic problem identified with ALL Corvettes with AH. That's where I have problems with your broad statement: "THIS PROBLEM HAS NOT BEEN CORRECTED, WHATEVER IT IS, AND HAS THE POTENTIAL TO AFFECT ANY AND ALL CORVETTE DRIVERS."
And what makes me feel that my car may not develop similar symptoms? Nothing, any more than it may develop one of several other problems that have been reported but there's a difference. My background is in Electrical Engineering with digital electronics and S/W experience. I have been a problem solver for a long time and look at data to conclude where a problem is. I have not seen any data or information that shows a systemic design problem. Sure there may be individual sensor failures or wiring issues that may affect the operation of the system and there may even be a corner case that GM did not foresee that can cause an erroneous operation. Each case is different based on what's being presented.
However what I do know is that these cars have an enormous amount of power for the average driver, and most of them like to run with TC Off because it restricts their acceleration somewhat. Why would 30% of Z06s crash? With 400 HP an average driver can easily get into trouble and I doubt the majority would be due mechanical error. Just basing it on the data available today. I hope that if there is a design problem the NHTSA and GM identify that quickly. Any data that you're friend's car could provide would help in getting that done.
I'm not making any conclusions one way or the other - just looking for the facts.
12-21-2006, 05:52 PM
#77
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
Quoting myself from an earlier post:
This other thread shows that unintended brake lockup affects C5s also, and appears to have no preference to what year. Whether or not the problem is caused by the EBCM or the Yaw sensor, or something else entirely, is still up in the air.
Without actually counting each individual claim, I can say with some confidence that Corvettes manufactured between '01 and '07 are all potentially at risk.
Random individual brake caliper activation is WELL DOCUMENTED on this and other forums... read this post as suggested early on in this thread:
http://forums.corvetteforum.com/show...th+EBCM+issues
Read posts #38, #92, #104, #117, #198, #220 (good one!), and I'm sure there will be more to come... Locking right front wheel at 107 MPH (Post #220) states this problem pretty clearly I think.
http://forums.corvetteforum.com/show...th+EBCM+issues
Read posts #38, #92, #104, #117, #198, #220 (good one!), and I'm sure there will be more to come... Locking right front wheel at 107 MPH (Post #220) states this problem pretty clearly I think.
Without actually counting each individual claim, I can say with some confidence that Corvettes manufactured between '01 and '07 are all potentially at risk.
08-09-2013, 03:51 PM
#78
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I found this thread searching for simular situations that happened to me. I copied and pasted my story here: This happened a few days ago...
I was driving my 2004 Corvette today, going straight down a two lane highway at 60 mph and all of a sudden the left front braked momentarily locked up and jerked me into the other lane. Luckily there was not any oncoming traffic or it could have been bad.
As soon as that happened, the service active handling message came up on the dash. I pulled over and checked everything out and didnt see any thing unusual. I checked the codes and got a C1282 which points to a yaw sensor.
Even if it is a bad yaw sensor, why would it not just disable the active handling instead of allowing it to apply the left front brake? Anyone else ran into this?
I was driving my 2004 Corvette today, going straight down a two lane highway at 60 mph and all of a sudden the left front braked momentarily locked up and jerked me into the other lane. Luckily there was not any oncoming traffic or it could have been bad.
As soon as that happened, the service active handling message came up on the dash. I pulled over and checked everything out and didnt see any thing unusual. I checked the codes and got a C1282 which points to a yaw sensor.
Even if it is a bad yaw sensor, why would it not just disable the active handling instead of allowing it to apply the left front brake? Anyone else ran into this?
Last edited by wolfgang896; 08-09-2013 at 03:55 PM.
08-09-2013, 06:24 PM
#79
Instructor
Hate to see anyone have an accident, glad he is OK.
I think it's important to keep an open mind and not draw conclusions without the facts and I don't think there is enough info here to say it was either car or driver error. My older CTS had virtually the same AH/TC system as my C5 so if it was inherent to the system there would be a much wider impact than just Corvettes.
The CDR is going to be critical to this. I can remember a case where someone was actually convicted of manslaughter and sent to jail for causing an accident and killing the occupants of the other car. He claimed the brakes didn't work and and eventually this was proven true, but not after several more accident and the NTSA review.
http://www.cnn.com/2010/CRIME/08/09/...ase/index.html
I also know that I am guilty of at least one error where I posted on here about sudden acceleration and after looking I really was stepping on the gas and brake at the same time. It really surprised me.
I think it's important to keep an open mind and not draw conclusions without the facts and I don't think there is enough info here to say it was either car or driver error. My older CTS had virtually the same AH/TC system as my C5 so if it was inherent to the system there would be a much wider impact than just Corvettes.
The CDR is going to be critical to this. I can remember a case where someone was actually convicted of manslaughter and sent to jail for causing an accident and killing the occupants of the other car. He claimed the brakes didn't work and and eventually this was proven true, but not after several more accident and the NTSA review.
http://www.cnn.com/2010/CRIME/08/09/...ase/index.html
I also know that I am guilty of at least one error where I posted on here about sudden acceleration and after looking I really was stepping on the gas and brake at the same time. It really surprised me.
08-09-2013, 09:56 PM
#80
Safety Car
I am certainly glad your friend came out ok, and also glad he didn't have to live with an accident that hurt others.
I have a buddy who works for Fed ex, writing repair orders for the trucks at night. He says he plugs in a panel and can apply any brake he wants, individually, with his computer control from outside the truck. I didn't ask a lot of details, he said he can pretty much control anything , said it was weird. He is old school.
If a computer can apply the brakes in any way, you have to look at the reliability of the GM controls. Changing the subject to ABS certainly doesn't help, except to rule it out, if the facts are correct.
I hope it never happens to me. I also hope as the cars get older that they don't start hurting folks. Looking forward to a better understanding for everyone's sake.
Some people pointed towards a big unrelated issue. A pet peeve of mine.
Being able to write a check for a fast car and driving fast, is not the same as thinking quickly enough to help if something goes wrong at high speeds. Thinking fast requires practice and application. Just because you have a 200 mph car doesn't mean you have a 299 mph brain upstairs. It takes extra training for the brain to be extra sharp.
I have a buddy who works for Fed ex, writing repair orders for the trucks at night. He says he plugs in a panel and can apply any brake he wants, individually, with his computer control from outside the truck. I didn't ask a lot of details, he said he can pretty much control anything , said it was weird. He is old school.
If a computer can apply the brakes in any way, you have to look at the reliability of the GM controls. Changing the subject to ABS certainly doesn't help, except to rule it out, if the facts are correct.
I hope it never happens to me. I also hope as the cars get older that they don't start hurting folks. Looking forward to a better understanding for everyone's sake.
Some people pointed towards a big unrelated issue. A pet peeve of mine.
Being able to write a check for a fast car and driving fast, is not the same as thinking quickly enough to help if something goes wrong at high speeds. Thinking fast requires practice and application. Just because you have a 200 mph car doesn't mean you have a 299 mph brain upstairs. It takes extra training for the brain to be extra sharp.