HELP!!! Key won't turn, car won't start
Thread Starter
Intermediate
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 36
Likes: 0
From: Jacksonville FL
HELP!!! Key won't turn, car won't start
Have an automatic 2004. I'm traveling out of town for work, wife was driving the car. Drove it back into our neighborhood but stopped at neighbors house a few blocks away. Went to get back in car and drive it home and security light was flashing, key wouldn't turn, etc. Luckily I left my keys at home, she tried my key and supposedly the key turned, she figured problem solved, took the key out to keep visiting and now that key doesn't work either.
I had the neighbor try a few things - steering wheel can be moved, security light is flashing steadily, but the key won't turn at all. Car can not be shifted into neutral (can't remember if you can do this without turning the key or starting the car anyway). The few things I've been able to search on talk about not starting the car, not specifically the key not turning. Since the key can't be turned to the on position, can't get codes, try security reset, etc. Also weird neither key works. Wish I was there to validate some of these things first hand...
Could the ignition or something just have gone bad just like that with no warning? Any easy possibilities or things to try? Car is a few blocks away, fear I will have to tow to the stealership and be prepared to be violated...
Thanks!
Scott
I had the neighbor try a few things - steering wheel can be moved, security light is flashing steadily, but the key won't turn at all. Car can not be shifted into neutral (can't remember if you can do this without turning the key or starting the car anyway). The few things I've been able to search on talk about not starting the car, not specifically the key not turning. Since the key can't be turned to the on position, can't get codes, try security reset, etc. Also weird neither key works. Wish I was there to validate some of these things first hand...
Could the ignition or something just have gone bad just like that with no warning? Any easy possibilities or things to try? Car is a few blocks away, fear I will have to tow to the stealership and be prepared to be violated...
Thanks!
Scott
Burning Brakes
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 860
Likes: 3
Hi Scott - the only thing I could think of it that something is wrong with the switch - I guess you could try to see if something got jammed in it. Look at your wife's key to see if that little pellet is still in it, but I am thinking you may be headed for a hosing...
Racer
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 263
Likes: 22
From: Batavia IL
I know this can't be it. But sometimes if the wheel is cocked full left or right as it might be turning into a driveway, if you insert the key it won't turn unless you move the wheel a little away from lock position. I know it sounds stupid, but this has happened to my wife on a different car.
Advanced
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 74
Likes: 0
From: Roanoke Virginia
I had this happen on a Buick Park Ave. The problem is the ignition switch wears and the contacts in the ignition switch that touch the little pellet on the key don't make good contact.
The pellet in the key is just a resistor and you can check its value with a digital OHM meter.
The contacts for the pellet in the switch go to 2 wires that go to the security module. You can cut the 2 wires that go to the security module and solider in a resistor with the same value as the key pellet and not worry about connection in switch and buy cheap keys too!
But since you can't turn the switch at all I would take a close look at the ignition switch for damage/wear/jammed up.
Hope this helps
Tim
The pellet in the key is just a resistor and you can check its value with a digital OHM meter.
The contacts for the pellet in the switch go to 2 wires that go to the security module. You can cut the 2 wires that go to the security module and solider in a resistor with the same value as the key pellet and not worry about connection in switch and buy cheap keys too!
But since you can't turn the switch at all I would take a close look at the ignition switch for damage/wear/jammed up.
Hope this helps
Tim
Le Mans Master
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 6,774
Likes: 363
From: Midland TX
I guess the question is... "Does the resistance pellet cause the lock cylinder to "mechanically" unlock when the key is inserted or does the pellet complete some kind of "electrical only" circuit allowing the cylinder's position to be recognized?"
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Race Director
Joined: Jul 2007
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From: Reno is so close to Hell you can see Sparks , State Of Confusion
St. Jude Donor '12-'13-'14
Did you check and see if she has the shifter in a half spot? That will effect the key for sure.
I think the key should still move even if the VATS was bad, It just won't start.
I think the key should still move even if the VATS was bad, It just won't start.
Tech Contributor
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 10,962
Likes: 29
From: Van Buren Arkansas
Wounded Warrior Escort '11
If the key won't turn, then the ignition switch has failed totally. You'll need to buy a new one and put her in. No sense in trying to make it work again as if its this bad, whatever's wrong with it, will happen again.
Drifting
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 1,592
Likes: 3
From: St Louis MO
I know this can't be it. But sometimes if the wheel is cocked full left or right as it might be turning into a driveway, if you insert the key it won't turn unless you move the wheel a little away from lock position. I know it sounds stupid, but this has happened to my wife on a different car.
If the wheels are turned, you might have torque-lock on the ignition switch. Go back and try the basics again. Make sure the shifter is fully in PARK. Look at the front wheels; if they are turned slightly, turn and hold the steering wheel in the same direction as the wheels are turned and try the key again. A defective or missing chip doesn't stop the key from turning, it just won't start. Good luck.
Le Mans Master
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 6,774
Likes: 363
From: Midland TX
If the wheels are turned, you might have torque-lock on the ignition switch. Go back and try the basics again. Make sure the shifter is fully in PARK. Look at the front wheels; if they are turned slightly, turn and hold the steering wheel in the same direction as the wheels are turned and try the key again. A defective or missing chip doesn't stop the key from turning, it just won't start. Good luck.
Thread Starter
Intermediate
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 36
Likes: 0
From: Jacksonville FL
Thanks for the responses.
As I mentioned, I'm out of town, but supposedly there was a crew of people in the neighborhood trying things, and I believe that people made sure the steering wheel is not locked (it moves freely), they tried jiggling the key, jiggling the shifter, etc.
I was just going to have it go to the dealer, but the towing guy said since we can't put the car in neutral, there is a risk of transmission damage by draggin the car on the flatbed. So now I'm screwed, the windows are partially down and its supposed to rain tomorrow.
I've searched and searched, and can't find a lot on the key not budging at all. If I could turn the key I could roll up the windows etc. I did see a great write up on taking apart and cleaning the ignition switch, maybe that would help? But again, those seem to be problems with not starting, not with not turning.
Could a locksmith help, or would that be a waste of money?
Scott
As I mentioned, I'm out of town, but supposedly there was a crew of people in the neighborhood trying things, and I believe that people made sure the steering wheel is not locked (it moves freely), they tried jiggling the key, jiggling the shifter, etc.
I was just going to have it go to the dealer, but the towing guy said since we can't put the car in neutral, there is a risk of transmission damage by draggin the car on the flatbed. So now I'm screwed, the windows are partially down and its supposed to rain tomorrow.
I've searched and searched, and can't find a lot on the key not budging at all. If I could turn the key I could roll up the windows etc. I did see a great write up on taking apart and cleaning the ignition switch, maybe that would help? But again, those seem to be problems with not starting, not with not turning.
Could a locksmith help, or would that be a waste of money?
Scott
Safety Car
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 3,939
Likes: 14
From: Baltimore Md.
If it needs to be towed, I've seen a tow truck locally that just goes under the car and scoops it up, no dragging or moving involved. So maybe you could find one of those type tow trucks. Sorry about your problem. Keep us informed.
Thread Starter
Intermediate
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 36
Likes: 0
From: Jacksonville FL
Finally just bit the bullet and found a qualified tow company with rollers so as not to damage the car, they got it to the dealer, dealer was very cool and understanding, called my wife right away to say the car arrived safely which was nice, then called again once they got a chance to look at it.
Needed to replace both the ignition switch and cylinder, something must have snapped internally somehow. Mechanic says he sees it in other cars as well, and when it goes it goes. $650 with parts and labor, sucks, but would not have been something I could have done myself easily. But that is the great thing about this forum, even with my extremely limited technical skills there are some great writeups and instructions and ideas here that are certainly worth exploring before just having someone blindly work on the car, and for that I'm very appreciative!
Thanks for the quick responses,
Scott
Needed to replace both the ignition switch and cylinder, something must have snapped internally somehow. Mechanic says he sees it in other cars as well, and when it goes it goes. $650 with parts and labor, sucks, but would not have been something I could have done myself easily. But that is the great thing about this forum, even with my extremely limited technical skills there are some great writeups and instructions and ideas here that are certainly worth exploring before just having someone blindly work on the car, and for that I'm very appreciative!
Thanks for the quick responses,
Scott
