[Z06] What Handling mods to do?
Thread Starter
Instructor
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 155
Likes: 0
From: South of France
What Handling mods to do?
Hi all,
I'm looking to upgrade the handling of my 02 C5 Z06.
The suspension is too much comfort orientated for my liking, i just don't feel the car like i do with other cars.
What i want is flat cornering and a much more precise steering.
Especially the wobbly front end is bothering me, i want the nose to steer in the moment i turn the steering wheel, not 2 seconds later
On the motorway i'm all over the place even tough i don't seem to have worn suspension bits.
Can you please recommend me some mods?
I was thinking:
- phadt coilovers?
- 18/19" wheels?
- polybushed wishbones or bearing mounted wishbones?
Thanks, Xav
I'm looking to upgrade the handling of my 02 C5 Z06.
The suspension is too much comfort orientated for my liking, i just don't feel the car like i do with other cars.
What i want is flat cornering and a much more precise steering.
Especially the wobbly front end is bothering me, i want the nose to steer in the moment i turn the steering wheel, not 2 seconds later
On the motorway i'm all over the place even tough i don't seem to have worn suspension bits.
Can you please recommend me some mods?
I was thinking:
- phadt coilovers?
- 18/19" wheels?
- polybushed wishbones or bearing mounted wishbones?
Thanks, Xav
Melting Slicks
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 3,003
Likes: 89
From: Indy IN
Properly setup this car is a canyon carver of the first order even without mods.
First, since it is an 02 I'm assuming that you have a goodly number of miles on the car, it isn't likely to have the OE tires on it. Get a set of serious tires mounted up. Soft sidewalls are one of the biggest culprits in robbing you of steering response, and if you have a set of mushy tires on the car all of the suspension mods in the world aren't going to do much good.
Second, again based on the age, the stock shocks are likely shot. They don't last all that long and after 40,000 miles are mush. Get a set of Bilstein sports or the stock 04 Z06 shocks, or a set of C6 Z06 shocks. These are all much better than the shocks that were new on an 02Z and will transform the handling.
Third, get a new set of upper control arms (that's the only way to get new bushings) and have them installed when you do the shocks. The old bushings again, based on age are probably shot and that is where a good bit of the rubbery response is coming from. Same as with the tires, if your bushings are shot, all of the expensive parts thrown at the car won't make it any better.
Lastly, lower the car PROPERLY (do not slam the car to the ground, lower it about an inch) and get it cornerweighted and aligned. Put in an aggressive street alignment with about 1.5 to degrees of negative camber in the front, about 1 degree of negative camber in the back and about 1/8 of an inch of toe in all around.
AFTER you do all of that if you aren't satisfied with the car, then think about mods, but do the maintenance stuff first and you will very likely be amazed how these cars can handle. But throwing money at the problem before you fix what is most likey wrong with the car up front is just an exercise in frustration.
First, since it is an 02 I'm assuming that you have a goodly number of miles on the car, it isn't likely to have the OE tires on it. Get a set of serious tires mounted up. Soft sidewalls are one of the biggest culprits in robbing you of steering response, and if you have a set of mushy tires on the car all of the suspension mods in the world aren't going to do much good.
Second, again based on the age, the stock shocks are likely shot. They don't last all that long and after 40,000 miles are mush. Get a set of Bilstein sports or the stock 04 Z06 shocks, or a set of C6 Z06 shocks. These are all much better than the shocks that were new on an 02Z and will transform the handling.
Third, get a new set of upper control arms (that's the only way to get new bushings) and have them installed when you do the shocks. The old bushings again, based on age are probably shot and that is where a good bit of the rubbery response is coming from. Same as with the tires, if your bushings are shot, all of the expensive parts thrown at the car won't make it any better.
Lastly, lower the car PROPERLY (do not slam the car to the ground, lower it about an inch) and get it cornerweighted and aligned. Put in an aggressive street alignment with about 1.5 to degrees of negative camber in the front, about 1 degree of negative camber in the back and about 1/8 of an inch of toe in all around.
AFTER you do all of that if you aren't satisfied with the car, then think about mods, but do the maintenance stuff first and you will very likely be amazed how these cars can handle. But throwing money at the problem before you fix what is most likey wrong with the car up front is just an exercise in frustration.
Advanced
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 97
Likes: 0
From: Tamarac FL
Properly setup this car is a canyon carver of the first order even without mods.
First, since it is an 02 I'm assuming that you have a goodly number of miles on the car, it isn't likely to have the OE tires on it. Get a set of serious tires mounted up. Soft sidewalls are one of the biggest culprits in robbing you of steering response, and if you have a set of mushy tires on the car all of the suspension mods in the world aren't going to do much good.
Second, again based on the age, the stock shocks are likely shot. They don't last all that long and after 40,000 miles are mush. Get a set of Bilstein sports or the stock 04 Z06 shocks, or a set of C6 Z06 shocks. These are all much better than the shocks that were new on an 02Z and will transform the handling.
Third, get a new set of upper control arms (that's the only way to get new bushings) and have them installed when you do the shocks. The old bushings again, based on age are probably shot and that is where a good bit of the rubbery response is coming from. Same as with the tires, if your bushings are shot, all of the expensive parts thrown at the car won't make it any better.
Lastly, lower the car PROPERLY (do not slam the car to the ground, lower it about an inch) and get it cornerweighted and aligned. Put in an aggressive street alignment with about 1.5 to degrees of negative camber in the front, about 1 degree of negative camber in the back and about 1/8 of an inch of toe in all around.
AFTER you do all of that if you aren't satisfied with the car, then think about mods, but do the maintenance stuff first and you will very likely be amazed how these cars can handle. But throwing money at the problem before you fix what is most likey wrong with the car up front is just an exercise in frustration.
First, since it is an 02 I'm assuming that you have a goodly number of miles on the car, it isn't likely to have the OE tires on it. Get a set of serious tires mounted up. Soft sidewalls are one of the biggest culprits in robbing you of steering response, and if you have a set of mushy tires on the car all of the suspension mods in the world aren't going to do much good.
Second, again based on the age, the stock shocks are likely shot. They don't last all that long and after 40,000 miles are mush. Get a set of Bilstein sports or the stock 04 Z06 shocks, or a set of C6 Z06 shocks. These are all much better than the shocks that were new on an 02Z and will transform the handling.
Third, get a new set of upper control arms (that's the only way to get new bushings) and have them installed when you do the shocks. The old bushings again, based on age are probably shot and that is where a good bit of the rubbery response is coming from. Same as with the tires, if your bushings are shot, all of the expensive parts thrown at the car won't make it any better.
Lastly, lower the car PROPERLY (do not slam the car to the ground, lower it about an inch) and get it cornerweighted and aligned. Put in an aggressive street alignment with about 1.5 to degrees of negative camber in the front, about 1 degree of negative camber in the back and about 1/8 of an inch of toe in all around.
AFTER you do all of that if you aren't satisfied with the car, then think about mods, but do the maintenance stuff first and you will very likely be amazed how these cars can handle. But throwing money at the problem before you fix what is most likey wrong with the car up front is just an exercise in frustration.
Burning Brakes
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 1,184
Likes: 3
From: KADS- If it has wings or an engine, I can break it. Dallas TX
Wow, I think the Zo6 has excellent turn in. But, sticky tires and T1 bars are a good 1st step. But if your all over the road, maybe a good alignment is probably the 1st order of business.
step 2: coilovers and corner weight
step 2: coilovers and corner weight
Race Director
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 17,103
Likes: 39
From: stop the fun suckers
this car does over 1g cornering.. its tought to improve on that without slicks.. if you have wobbly steering, or slow turn in, something on your car is our of repair. take it to a shop and have them fix/replace worn bushings/shocks.. mouont up a set of Michelin PS2 tires and have the alignment set (by s speed shop that does road race alignments) and you should be good.. (short of running hoosiers).
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Michael S. Palmer
Team Owner
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 30,897
Likes: 45
From: Picking on the weakest kid in the yard.
Properly setup this car is a canyon carver of the first order even without mods.
First, since it is an 02 I'm assuming that you have a goodly number of miles on the car, it isn't likely to have the OE tires on it. Get a set of serious tires mounted up. Soft sidewalls are one of the biggest culprits in robbing you of steering response, and if you have a set of mushy tires on the car all of the suspension mods in the world aren't going to do much good.
Second, again based on the age, the stock shocks are likely shot. They don't last all that long and after 40,000 miles are mush. Get a set of Bilstein sports or the stock 04 Z06 shocks, or a set of C6 Z06 shocks. These are all much better than the shocks that were new on an 02Z and will transform the handling.
Third, get a new set of upper control arms (that's the only way to get new bushings) and have them installed when you do the shocks. The old bushings again, based on age are probably shot and that is where a good bit of the rubbery response is coming from. Same as with the tires, if your bushings are shot, all of the expensive parts thrown at the car won't make it any better.
Lastly, lower the car PROPERLY (do not slam the car to the ground, lower it about an inch) and get it cornerweighted and aligned. Put in an aggressive street alignment with about 1.5 to degrees of negative camber in the front, about 1 degree of negative camber in the back and about 1/8 of an inch of toe in all around.
AFTER you do all of that if you aren't satisfied with the car, then think about mods, but do the maintenance stuff first and you will very likely be amazed how these cars can handle. But throwing money at the problem before you fix what is most likey wrong with the car up front is just an exercise in frustration.
First, since it is an 02 I'm assuming that you have a goodly number of miles on the car, it isn't likely to have the OE tires on it. Get a set of serious tires mounted up. Soft sidewalls are one of the biggest culprits in robbing you of steering response, and if you have a set of mushy tires on the car all of the suspension mods in the world aren't going to do much good.
Second, again based on the age, the stock shocks are likely shot. They don't last all that long and after 40,000 miles are mush. Get a set of Bilstein sports or the stock 04 Z06 shocks, or a set of C6 Z06 shocks. These are all much better than the shocks that were new on an 02Z and will transform the handling.
Third, get a new set of upper control arms (that's the only way to get new bushings) and have them installed when you do the shocks. The old bushings again, based on age are probably shot and that is where a good bit of the rubbery response is coming from. Same as with the tires, if your bushings are shot, all of the expensive parts thrown at the car won't make it any better.
Lastly, lower the car PROPERLY (do not slam the car to the ground, lower it about an inch) and get it cornerweighted and aligned. Put in an aggressive street alignment with about 1.5 to degrees of negative camber in the front, about 1 degree of negative camber in the back and about 1/8 of an inch of toe in all around.
AFTER you do all of that if you aren't satisfied with the car, then think about mods, but do the maintenance stuff first and you will very likely be amazed how these cars can handle. But throwing money at the problem before you fix what is most likey wrong with the car up front is just an exercise in frustration.
If your car has a "wobbly" front end, slow response, and too much body roll, then something is wrong. Modding is not the answer.
Melting Slicks
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 2,394
Likes: 0
From: Bay Area CA
Like others have said, guessing at minimum the stock shocks are history.
Two schools of thought on handling generally IMO, stiff bars/soft springs, or stiff springs/smaller bars. Both options need the appropriate shock to control them. Third option is the coilovers. Both LG and Pfadt have fans and successes, but I have no personal experience.
I would start with the shocks, inspect the bushings and go from there. If you don't care about ride quality, you could go stiffer springs, appropriate bars, poly bushings (or spherical if you are really hardcore) adjustable shocks, alignment and corner weight. Will definitely make a large difference when done together vs factory handling; but the factory car is pretty damn solid. I don't know what you are used to, but you may just be used to over sprung, over barred cars near the bumpstops.
Enjoy the ride and do some research, might be worth wandering over to the Road Race and Autocross section and checking to see what the pros and wheel to wheel guys do.
Fej
Two schools of thought on handling generally IMO, stiff bars/soft springs, or stiff springs/smaller bars. Both options need the appropriate shock to control them. Third option is the coilovers. Both LG and Pfadt have fans and successes, but I have no personal experience.
I would start with the shocks, inspect the bushings and go from there. If you don't care about ride quality, you could go stiffer springs, appropriate bars, poly bushings (or spherical if you are really hardcore) adjustable shocks, alignment and corner weight. Will definitely make a large difference when done together vs factory handling; but the factory car is pretty damn solid. I don't know what you are used to, but you may just be used to over sprung, over barred cars near the bumpstops.
Enjoy the ride and do some research, might be worth wandering over to the Road Race and Autocross section and checking to see what the pros and wheel to wheel guys do.
Fej
Race Director
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 18,049
Likes: 53
From: long Island NY
This will get a bit opionated.
My 04Z, I installed Pfadt coils, Pfadt fatty race bars, and trans mount. I did Pfadts street/race alignment and a corner weight with me in it. The car is now a super car it handles very flat and the coils are set on 8 and sways neutral. I also have a 18/19 set up with PS2's. A major improvement now just need to change my seats,can't stay in them around off ramps.
The other option to save money and get killer results. Lower the car about 1/2", change shocks to a Pfadt inverted shock or similiar, and a set of pfatty bars. Align the car to Pfadts street/race settings and this will be a major improvement more then you can use on street.
If the front end seems loose no matter what option you go with you need to check and or replace bushings. As these things get old you can be losing a inch of camber in all turns.
My 04Z, I installed Pfadt coils, Pfadt fatty race bars, and trans mount. I did Pfadts street/race alignment and a corner weight with me in it. The car is now a super car it handles very flat and the coils are set on 8 and sways neutral. I also have a 18/19 set up with PS2's. A major improvement now just need to change my seats,can't stay in them around off ramps.
The other option to save money and get killer results. Lower the car about 1/2", change shocks to a Pfadt inverted shock or similiar, and a set of pfatty bars. Align the car to Pfadts street/race settings and this will be a major improvement more then you can use on street.
If the front end seems loose no matter what option you go with you need to check and or replace bushings. As these things get old you can be losing a inch of camber in all turns.
Drifting
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 1,506
Likes: 5
From: Milpitas CA
Hi all,
....
What i want is flat cornering and a much more precise steering.
Especially the wobbly front end is bothering me, i want the nose to steer in the moment i turn the steering wheel, not 2 seconds later
On the motorway i'm all over the place even tough i don't seem to have worn suspension bits.
Can you please recommend me some mods?
I was thinking:
- phadt coilovers?
- 18/19" wheels?
- polybushed wishbones or bearing mounted wishbones?
Thanks, Xav
....
What i want is flat cornering and a much more precise steering.
Especially the wobbly front end is bothering me, i want the nose to steer in the moment i turn the steering wheel, not 2 seconds later
On the motorway i'm all over the place even tough i don't seem to have worn suspension bits.
Can you please recommend me some mods?
I was thinking:
- phadt coilovers?
- 18/19" wheels?
- polybushed wishbones or bearing mounted wishbones?
Thanks, Xav
You really need a target amount you are willing to spend. Consider that an '02 Z06 is only worth about $20-25,000. Are you willing to spend $10,000 on suspension to get the improved handling you're looking for? Also 18/19 wheels are not going to make the car handle any better. Spend your wheel money on grippy tires for much better effect.
If you choose to proceed here are a few options:
1. Koni FSD/Bilstein/C6 Z06 shocks and some Hotchkiss/T1 bars. Probably less than $2000.
2. Complete Pfadt package including coil over shocks, sways, bushings, and camber kit. Total is less than $4000 USD.
3. Same mods of sways, bushings, and camber kit, but upgrade to the fancier and more expensive shocks LG's, DRM Penske's, or other premium race shocks. The fancier shocks are going to be about $3500+ just for the shocks.
Good luck whatever you choose.
Dog
Thread Starter
Instructor
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 155
Likes: 0
From: South of France
Thanks for all of your advice.
The car has 45Kmiles on the clock, suspension is is 100% stock, it's never been raced or been in an accident.
I have a set of spanking new Michelin pilot sport PS2 tires on (i'm not the kind of guy that buys the cheapest tires, i want the best ones)
The car is a little lower than normal and the alignment has been done recently witht the standard Z06 settings.
I don't see any worn parts like track rod ends, bearings, the shocks pass the vehicle inspection obviously but haven't been tested any further.
I am willing to spend a little money on the suspension, 5-6K sound about right. I don't want to have a die hard track setup, just a stiff ride that will cope with the usual bump in the road.
I might go with the phadt package, it seems to be good value for money and install new front arms. Are the LG 2's supposed to be better than phadt?
Does anyone have suspension arms mounted with bearings instead of rubbers/PU bushes? I have this on my other car and it's great.
2 pics of my car to show you i'm serious in maintenance and keeping the car clean.
p.s. the catbacks on the photo were temporarily, just to pass the noise tests here in France
The car has 45Kmiles on the clock, suspension is is 100% stock, it's never been raced or been in an accident.
I have a set of spanking new Michelin pilot sport PS2 tires on (i'm not the kind of guy that buys the cheapest tires, i want the best ones)
The car is a little lower than normal and the alignment has been done recently witht the standard Z06 settings.
I don't see any worn parts like track rod ends, bearings, the shocks pass the vehicle inspection obviously but haven't been tested any further.
I am willing to spend a little money on the suspension, 5-6K sound about right. I don't want to have a die hard track setup, just a stiff ride that will cope with the usual bump in the road.
I might go with the phadt package, it seems to be good value for money and install new front arms. Are the LG 2's supposed to be better than phadt?
Does anyone have suspension arms mounted with bearings instead of rubbers/PU bushes? I have this on my other car and it's great.
2 pics of my car to show you i'm serious in maintenance and keeping the car clean.
p.s. the catbacks on the photo were temporarily, just to pass the noise tests here in France
Race Director
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 17,103
Likes: 39
From: stop the fun suckers
If everything is in stock, good working order, I would consider new SEATS next. Ones with proper support.. you wont be sliding around inside the car so much and should feel it turn in and respond faster.
Tech Contributor
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 20,030
Likes: 289
From: Wylie TX --> Less is More, except under the hood !
........ ....GOOD seats the best handling mod I have done hands down...
You will not believe how you will be able to drive your car when properly supported.
Add the LG GT2 coil overs I put on, and WOW ! Just crazy how this car drives now.
Toque
Thread Starter
Instructor
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 155
Likes: 0
From: South of France
Thread Starter
Instructor
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 155
Likes: 0
From: South of France
Just having a look for some sportier seats and i stumbled on these, recaro's pole position:
The pics shows them installed in a C6.... does that mean they fit C5?
They look awesome!
The pics shows them installed in a C6.... does that mean they fit C5?
They look awesome!
Tech Contributor
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 20,030
Likes: 289
From: Wylie TX --> Less is More, except under the hood !
I know what you mean... Modding can be a curse. I'm not sure what else I will do. I got Coil overs, and Corbeau A4 seats this year. There is nothing I "need" for my car of course. No plans for anything this year (wife is gonna shoot me)....
Toque