This might be of interest to some. I took this quote from a thread on a Camaro website. It pertains to the new '03 Cobra:

This breaks my heart to say it, but I drove the new Cobra today at lunch and it is incredibly quick--Z06 quick.
I don't know whether to laugh or to cry. Since whatever I write here on the Cobra will be met with incredible scrutiny and derision, I'll just bow my head.

We've got ETs and Dynojet numbers. They're too good to believe so I'll spare you the grief.

Word directly from John Colleti is that SVT will never allow a PR fiasco like the 1999 Cobra to ever happen again. To that effect, the factory rating of 390 hp is very conservative.

Put it this way, you will soon find out what Cobra taillights look like.

WE NEED REINFORCEMENTS IMMEDIATELY!!!!

Here is the website link:
http://www.camaroz28.com/messagebd/index.html

This thread is in the 5th Gen Discussion area.

Randy

 

:bs

I will believe it when I see it. The numbers I have heard are 0-60 in 5 with a top speed of 155??? It may be quick, but it's still a mustang :U

 

:U :U :U Its 350lbs heavier, and, its a F&%#......No more need to be said...Always a wannabee :yesnod: GO WINGS....


[Modified by dbvettez06, 12:31 PM 3/28/2002]

 

The Cobra is a Supercharged Rental Car derived kiddy car, that is heavier than the ZO6 by 2 humans (like having two fat chicks in the back seat everywhere you go.) The Mustang is by far superior in approach to that taken by GM with the Camaro, and the fact that it sells like it does, and will remain after the Camaro/Firebird are gone is a real black-eye for the product planners at GM. This recent iteration is going to sell like crazy, kids are gonna dig that super-charger thang!

However, it's not a Corvette. (One of the only product lines GM has done right over the years, with a few exceptions.)

What the Cobra is going to do is vacuum up a few disgruntled Camaro folks, a couple of BMW M3 customers who are sick of that whole scene (price, snobs at the dealerships), a bunch of Mitsubishi Eclipse/Honda "R" folks looking for that American Muscle car experience as a change, and most improtantly, move a lot of Mustang loyalists to drop by the dealer for an upgrade from thier GT's. Ford has done a great job adding packages to that car to give it real legs in a very broad market. From V6 to SVT Cobra, $14,000 to $55,000, all on one platform. :cool:

In any case, the Mustang certainly isn't something that I would have even considered while shopping for a ZO6! Gimme a break already! :rolleyes:
:cheers:

 

"WHAT HE SAID!!!

:p: :chevy :seeya

 

z's will not have to worry but I will and some c5's that are still stock. Man I wonder how it's going to fell to get smacked down by a stock mustang. :lol:

 

Well the only Cobra that I consider a Cobra is Shelby's from the 60's and the reproduction ones now offered by Shelby American. The Ford Cobra Mustang is a hopped up Mustang. For the money I am happy with my replica Cobra, it spanks the Mustang Cobra, is cheaper, better looking and 1,500 lbs lighter. I would buy a Corvette before I purchased a Mustang Cobra and I would buy a Cobra replica before I bought a Corvette. However if Chevy ever brings back the 427, I might have to reconsider. I have to admit the new design of the Corvette is sexy and for the money the Z06 is a good deal. Just my humble opinion.

-------------
65 Shelby Cobra (replica of course)

 

I disagree with that. The Mustang outsells the F-body, but after years of enjoying my '96 Camaro (RIP for my 2001 ZO6), riding in a Mustang reminds me of a cheap rental. They handled poorly and never matched the performance numbers of the F-body. I look forward to the 5th Gen F-Body to be a retro look...maybe with a supercharger?

Let's all wish that GM would put out some special-edition Corvettes to squelch this POS.

 

My nieghbor has a Cobra convertible and they are sweet. Sounds and looks great. It is still 15hp short and a little overwieght though.

 

Boy, I can't believe the replies I read... "It's still a Mustang". And our boy AgentF1 here thinks the VIPER guys are elitist! :)

I think this is great... GM better wake up (and so better Dodge) to the new (tough) kid on the block. I think the new Cobra will be spanking the C5's in a line and will give alot of Z06's a run for their money. I bet with a pulley change the Z's might have a hard time keeping up.. maybe even Vipers too.

You guys can talk about handling, cheapness, it being a Ford, and weight all you want... but the bottom line is that if one of these Cobras pulls up next to you and blows your doors off, all the handling in the world ain't gonna make you feel any better about it :D

 

The prototype mule car was Dynoed here in So Cal--the HP numbers are real!! But how many will be built??? The same engine is slated for the 2nd year Mercury Marader.And the big question--HOW MUCH FOR THE FORD GT-40??????

 

I agree, MrViperGTS, with everything you said.

I own a '98 Cobra currently, which will continue to serve as my daily transportation even after my upcoming '03 Z06 purchase. The new Cobra is exciting, but I am ready to move up. I respect what Ford is trying to do, however, and others will be forced to soon enough... :)

I hope this pushes the General to up the ante a little for '03.

Randy

 

MrViperGTS,
You have hit the nail on the head.All you will have to do is change a
pulley and reprogram the computer and shazzzzzam!I feel sorry for
some of you Z06 guys when you get beat by a car that cost 10K less.
Yes the Z06 will handle better,but most people still prefer stop light or
drag racing.
01GT

 

this whole issue is so freak'in hilarious; kind of akin to boxing and the great white hope(s)

:crazy: :yesnod: :lol: :jester

 

Question: With the price difference could you make a stock Mustang V-8 faster and better performing than the Mustang Cobra? Are the people just buying a name that Ford bought off of Shelby years ago to use for marketing purpose? Something got lost in the exchange of the name between Ford and Shelby. Ford forgot the key to the formula, V-8 in small light car. If Ford is going to put out a "special edition" car or "Cobra", you would at least think they would attempt to lighten the load. Treat it and design it like a real sports car. Just my 2 cents. Ford has an opportunity to jump all over Chevy right now. What better time than to design a car right and apply the right formulas and go for the throat. Now would be the time to bring back a car that some what resembles the name by which it came from in the 60's. Cobra had Chevy shaking in their boots then, what about now? Will Ford go for the throat or will they just beef up the engine a little on a 3,000 lbs + pig?

Of course in turn Chevy will have to step up and create something better. The Viper is still superior and while the Z06 is nice, it still lags behind the Viper, not by much but 2nd place is second place no matter how far behind you are. Dodge has raised the bar and Chevy and Ford need to raise it further. There is no excuse or reason why Chevy can’t go back to the big block 427 and there is no reason why Ford cannot make a real sports car and not be lazy and just throw a few mods on a Mustang and slap a name they bought called Cobra. Until they do the Viper will be the King of the Road. The body line is extreme, basic formula of big block little car applied, no cup holders, just you and the engine and the wheels that push you. The KISS method, keep it simple stupid.

-------------------
65 Shelby Cobra (replica of course)

 

:cheers:

 

:cool: Hey guys....... reminds you of the late 60's... muscule car horsepower race between brands :cool:

:D The General will have to respond with something other than the Corvette to MATCH Ford's hand...then Ford raises HP.... then GM...now Chrysler jumps in... and we all WIN :D

 

:confused:
You are kidding right? I mean, if the only test of the cars we drive is the ability to accelerate, then we're all driving crap! For pure 0-60 bench racing lore, boys, don't forget the Caterham Super 7 (0-60 in under 3.5s), with a lowly 4 banger Vauxhal motor under its aluminum bonnet, and a sticker price less than the Mustang. Great stuff, but, I'm still not interested in one as a road car (major ugly ride). I'd love one as a track car though!

I just don't get comparing the two cars like the choice would be between them on any level. For me it's like comparing a double wide mobile home on a cow lot(Mustange) to a single story ranch house on an acre of wooded land (Corvette). Just cause the mobile home has the same square footage, number of bedrooms, sits on a big hunk-o' land and has wall paper in the toilets, does not mean it's a viable comparison! Even if the Mobile home has an extra bedroom, and a velvet picture of Elvis over the sofa... still not what I would call a side-by-side comparison.

I have passed a few Ferrari's in driver schools in my sported up BMW M coupe on race tires. Not one of them ever said "Golly, I wish I had bought a BMW, instead of this stupid Ferrari!" :lol: Life just isn't wired that way. No, they just looked at me like, "Well, yes, you passed me, good for you, but when I get home I will have a Ferrari in my garage, and you will have that... BMW" <with nose and lip curled approriately upward.>

I think the Mustang fans, especially those that are not Corvette lovers, are going to be quite happy with the new Cobra. It's going to be a really great FOMOCO product, which is what they want.

I think the Corvette universe is quite safe none-the-less. If one of them Cobra's gets by me on the track, I will smile, be impressed, look over his car, talk nice, and move on. Life is filled with faster, cheaper, better, quicker, easier, prettier... it's getting to a blend that makes you happy that counts. The Mustang does nothing for me in this regard, the Corvette does. Marketing 101.

:cheers:

 

In reference to my earlier statement:

"The Mustang is by far superior in approach to that taken by GM with the Camaro "

I was referring to the ultimate rule of marketing - survival is the ultimate test of any product or brand. Nothing else matters. If the war were trully about performance, the F bodies would be on top. It isn't, and never was, regardless of all the banter otherwise. GM found out too late that this was not the case.

The Mustang is a superior brand strategy, because it nailed its market demographic and has fed them exactly what they wanted and needed from day one, and kept that audience in their sights for 38 years.

GM was so busy positioning the Camaro as a poor-man's Corvette, that it got lost and built a car that apealled to fewer and fewer people. They also absolutely failed to maintain the loyal fans, who just got sick of the car and wandered off to other brands and other models.

It is really dangerous to believe the war is all about these silly 0-60 numbers and other such rot. The Computer industry plays that stupid game right into non-profit status.

The Mustang was developed to provide a segment of the market a sporty car that was practical, affordable, with personality, and offered with enough options and accessories and special models, to attract potential buyers from a wide range of economic and enthusiast positions. When its market said they were worried about fuel economy, Ford made the Mustang what it was, but in a more economical format (Mustang II). GM just made the Camaro fatter and heavier, and dumped garbage engines in them (307 anyone?). Laugh all you want about the Mustang II (the Gelding)... it set record sales numbers for the brand, and THAT was exactly the goal, as it has always been with FOMOCO on the product.

GM never got the Camaro placed well, and screwed it up several times.

In the 1980's when fuel concerns took a back seat, the Mustang was transformed. The 5.0 cars are legendary at the drags. Further, by getting them into the rental market, and the police departments, they spread the word fast. The 1990's cars sacrificed the performance advantage, for a truely modern overhead cam engine and a newer, fresher, freidlier body design. Contrary to the predictions of all those F-body fans, the Mustang not only survived, it kicked the pants off the F-body in ultimate sales. Who cares about 0-60 times, when sales are going down faster than a Fosters Lager?

The SVT cars, Saleen's, and Cobra's, all answer the call of the Z/28 and SS nicely. Nobody on the showroom floors, writing checks seemed to care who was winning the 0-60 wars. In a few years, the Mustang will be setting new sales records, and the supposed "superior" performer will be GONE! How can this not be considered a serious victory for Ford? They deserve kudos for a marketing job well done. They won where it counts, superior strategy and execution.

Auto manufacturers are product producers and money making entities. They are judged on how well they make profit and grow market share. They are not philenthropic organizations judged on how well their products perform on some test track. Thus, he who survives to profit, is the winner. Mustang = Ford wins, Camaro/Firebird = GM looses. Ford simply played the Pony Car game out better than anyome else. This includes the demise of all the other GM, Chrysler, and AMC, products that once filled the ranks of Mustang wanna be's. Seen any new Cuda's, Chargers, AMX's, or Chevelle SS's around?

I personally despise Ford, and will never own another one of that corporation's POS vehicles, or darken the halls of their dealer network. But, I'd have to be an idiot not to recognize such an obviously well played out marketing effort, as the Mustang has been for so long. :cheers: Here's to the Ford's Mustang, you can keep each and every one of them! :smash:

I'm betting on the better horse here, the Corvette. GM's brand success story :cheers:

 

Good point regarding the mobile home and ranch house. I don't know if I can agree that Elvis picture just might do it for me! I might have to go with the mobile home and work on building a bigger porch for all my dogs to sit under it

Nothing like a good Ole brand shoot out! We all love our cars but some us need to know who is top dog? God if we didn't want to know then there would be no such thing as racing or purpose for it.

As for the camaro, 69 was the year after that it was all down hill. Is it me or did the last camaros look like Roaches going down the road?

----------------
65 Shelby Cobra (replica of course)


[Modified by The Joker, 12:04 AM 3/29/2002]