Installing shortie headers
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 2,290
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From: G-boro NC
Installing shortie headers
How hard is it to install shorties? I know most everyone will say don't do it, BUT I don't have the funds for longtubes right now and got a very good deal on some shorties. Any tips would be very much appreciated.
Team Owner
Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 23,283
Likes: 906
From: Lake Elsinore, CA
I've done several sets of longtubes on C5's so I could probably make short work of shorties . . . 
Pretty easy I would say.
Here's a link to a longtube install.
http://ls1howto.com/index.php?articl...973202784a3ec7
A shorty install would involve less work. They're probably a bit easier to fit in I would think.
Pretty easy I would say.
Here's a link to a longtube install.http://ls1howto.com/index.php?articl...973202784a3ec7
A shorty install would involve less work. They're probably a bit easier to fit in I would think.
Safety Car
Joined: May 2003
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From: Dearborn Heights Michigan
Did my B&B Tri-Flos myself. A bit of work but not bad. Take the plugs out so you don't break one. Move coil packs out of the way, Didn't take off alt or any other big stuff. Went in from the top without jacking the engine around.
Fred K.
Fred K.
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Should be pretty easy considering you don't have to take all the stuff off like you do for long tubes. Good luck if you decide to go this route.
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I would be one of those to advise not to do it.
I don't think you'll notice any difference in your car with those shorties....
I don't think you'll notice any difference in your car with those shorties....
Pro
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 665
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From: Hendersonville NC
Originally Posted by Glennm27
I would be one of those to advise not to do it.
I don't think you'll notice any difference in your car with those shorties....
I don't think you'll notice any difference in your car with those shorties....
Why spend any money and labor for questionable gains? Each to their own, but I am waiting till I can do the LT Headers w/High Flow cats. It's not a good deal if you don't appreciate any performance gains and then end up redoing them with LTs.
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Michael S. Palmer
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From: Newberry FL
Cruise-In VIII Veteran
St. Jude Donor '07
Originally Posted by ACELR8N
Why spend any money and labor for questionable gains? Each to their own, but I am waiting till I can do the LT Headers w/High Flow cats. It's not a good deal if you don't appreciate any performance gains and then end up redoing them with LTs.After speaking with L.A.P.D. on the phone yesterday, shorties are really not worth the money you spend. If you decide to HEADS and CAM it, the SHORTIES are not going to give you the proper exhaust flow you will need and I am sure that this will be the same answer you get if you decide to SC or Turbo the car. You may want to look into LTubes. I was going to SHORTIE my C5, but after conversations with both THUNDERRACING and L.A.P.D. I am just going to spend an extra buck and get a better flow and sound.
This is only my opnion, advice and planted seed for you. I am on your side, just wanted to pass on some information that was given to me by some great folks at two great performance shops.
Micah
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Better to hold on to your money and stock with your stick manifolds untill you have enough for long tubes. Otherwise its just money wasted. If money is tight and you can't afford long tubes right now, then you can't afford to throw away your hard earned mod dollars on shorty headers. Just one man's opinion.
Last edited by '06 Quicksilver Z06; Sep 29, 2004 at 10:42 PM.
Instructor
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I installed shorty headers in my car. The process is relatively simple, but time consuming. I took two days to do it all, with the first day being removal of the stock manifolds, and the second day being the installation of the shorties.
The shorties I got came from BBK with full directions included. But, the directions didn't cover everything that needed to be done. So, there is a lot of improvising that must be done. I found out the hard way that not only is the car pretty much metric through and through, but you'll need a good set of deep well sockets to get the job done. I used Rhino ramps under the front wheels and simply crawled on my back beneath the car. It was a tight fit and I had to pull myself along using the frame, but there is no room for a creeper to lay on. I also had a set of store bought wheel chocks behind the rear wheels, just in case.
At first glance, there doesn't seem to be much room to install them, but once you disconnect and take off the coil packs on the right and left valve covers, there is PLENTY of room on both sides of the engine. On the left side you'll have to remove the alternator to make room as well, and also figure out how to move or remove the hoses from your air pump that are part of your emissions control system (SMOG). You'll also need to remove your spark plug cables (do this first). Some will tell you to remove the spark plugs as well, but I left mine in since I didn't want any dirt or debris getting into my engine cylinders. I didn't have any problems with leaving the spark plugs installed. You'll also have to crawl under the car and loosen the two mounting bolts for your stock H-pipe at the front of the car, to give the manifold/shorties room to move. Also, when you remove the stock manifold from the exhaust pipe, there are two circular donut gaskets inside of the pipe that you want to retain and use again, unless you have new ones. You'll recognize the donut gaskets when they fall out. Getting the right side out is easy, it's the left side that is time consuming. You can unbolt and pull the stock manifolds almost straight up and out of the engine compartment, but a small amount of manuevering might be required. But, the old manifolds do come out relatively easy. The worst thing that happened during the removal process was that I had to break the mounting clips for the electrical connections of the right and left O2 sensors in the stock manifolds. The electrical connections for the O2 sensors are snapped into the frame and I couldn't get the electrical connections to come out, and eventually just twisted them free, which broke the plastic mounting tabs (during installation I simply zip-tied the electrical connections to the other cable runs that are located along the frame, with no harm done). If I would have broken the O2 connectors, I would have simply gone to the local Chevy dealer and gotten new O2 sensors...no big deal.
For installation, the right side pretty much slides right in, from the top. If I recall correctly, I had to wiggle and manuever the right side a little bit, but it's the left side that is a little harder to get into place. Actually, the left side was kind of a bitch trying to get it to fit from the top side of the engine, but she finally went in. Also, the stock mount for the oil dipstick on the right side may not match up to the mount on the shorties. I had to fabricate my own mount for the oil dipstick courtesy of Walmart supplied parts. I had to bend the dipstick a little to keep it from touching the headers. Also, one of the things I noticed right off is that the BBK shorties are a little wider than the stock manifolds, so you'll have to closely examine your hoses and electrical wires to make sure they don't touch the headers. On the left side, the air pump hoses for the emission control system were touching the header tubes, so I ended up going to Home Depot and purchasing some extra large, extra long zip-ties. I used the larger zip-ties to pull the air hoses away from the header tubes by fastening the air hoses to the master cylinder for the brakes. It all worked out pretty good in the end.
Overall, it was fairly easy to do. But what made it so successful was that I took my time and didn't rush, taking two days to do it. Not to mention the self pride at doing a good job with my own hands.
In the end, I know some fellas (probably most) will say don't do the shorties...waste of time, not enuff horse power gain, etc, etc...but your car is for you and no one else. So, if you want shorties, put the shorties in, I say. I also didn't want to cut up my stock H-pipe since I do all of my own work, so that was another factor in all of this for me. (I can't weld good enuff to save my own ***...)
I must have gained something from the effort as my "seat-of-the-pants" meter registered a difference and my exhaust is slightly louder than it was before I did the install (or maybe that's just wishful thinking on my part since I can't hear a damn thing anyway with the B&B Bullets a blazing
).
Anyway, hope this helps.
The shorties I got came from BBK with full directions included. But, the directions didn't cover everything that needed to be done. So, there is a lot of improvising that must be done. I found out the hard way that not only is the car pretty much metric through and through, but you'll need a good set of deep well sockets to get the job done. I used Rhino ramps under the front wheels and simply crawled on my back beneath the car. It was a tight fit and I had to pull myself along using the frame, but there is no room for a creeper to lay on. I also had a set of store bought wheel chocks behind the rear wheels, just in case.
At first glance, there doesn't seem to be much room to install them, but once you disconnect and take off the coil packs on the right and left valve covers, there is PLENTY of room on both sides of the engine. On the left side you'll have to remove the alternator to make room as well, and also figure out how to move or remove the hoses from your air pump that are part of your emissions control system (SMOG). You'll also need to remove your spark plug cables (do this first). Some will tell you to remove the spark plugs as well, but I left mine in since I didn't want any dirt or debris getting into my engine cylinders. I didn't have any problems with leaving the spark plugs installed. You'll also have to crawl under the car and loosen the two mounting bolts for your stock H-pipe at the front of the car, to give the manifold/shorties room to move. Also, when you remove the stock manifold from the exhaust pipe, there are two circular donut gaskets inside of the pipe that you want to retain and use again, unless you have new ones. You'll recognize the donut gaskets when they fall out. Getting the right side out is easy, it's the left side that is time consuming. You can unbolt and pull the stock manifolds almost straight up and out of the engine compartment, but a small amount of manuevering might be required. But, the old manifolds do come out relatively easy. The worst thing that happened during the removal process was that I had to break the mounting clips for the electrical connections of the right and left O2 sensors in the stock manifolds. The electrical connections for the O2 sensors are snapped into the frame and I couldn't get the electrical connections to come out, and eventually just twisted them free, which broke the plastic mounting tabs (during installation I simply zip-tied the electrical connections to the other cable runs that are located along the frame, with no harm done). If I would have broken the O2 connectors, I would have simply gone to the local Chevy dealer and gotten new O2 sensors...no big deal.
For installation, the right side pretty much slides right in, from the top. If I recall correctly, I had to wiggle and manuever the right side a little bit, but it's the left side that is a little harder to get into place. Actually, the left side was kind of a bitch trying to get it to fit from the top side of the engine, but she finally went in. Also, the stock mount for the oil dipstick on the right side may not match up to the mount on the shorties. I had to fabricate my own mount for the oil dipstick courtesy of Walmart supplied parts. I had to bend the dipstick a little to keep it from touching the headers. Also, one of the things I noticed right off is that the BBK shorties are a little wider than the stock manifolds, so you'll have to closely examine your hoses and electrical wires to make sure they don't touch the headers. On the left side, the air pump hoses for the emission control system were touching the header tubes, so I ended up going to Home Depot and purchasing some extra large, extra long zip-ties. I used the larger zip-ties to pull the air hoses away from the header tubes by fastening the air hoses to the master cylinder for the brakes. It all worked out pretty good in the end.
Overall, it was fairly easy to do. But what made it so successful was that I took my time and didn't rush, taking two days to do it. Not to mention the self pride at doing a good job with my own hands.
In the end, I know some fellas (probably most) will say don't do the shorties...waste of time, not enuff horse power gain, etc, etc...but your car is for you and no one else. So, if you want shorties, put the shorties in, I say. I also didn't want to cut up my stock H-pipe since I do all of my own work, so that was another factor in all of this for me. (I can't weld good enuff to save my own ***...)
I must have gained something from the effort as my "seat-of-the-pants" meter registered a difference and my exhaust is slightly louder than it was before I did the install (or maybe that's just wishful thinking on my part since I can't hear a damn thing anyway with the B&B Bullets a blazing
).Anyway, hope this helps.
Last edited by Evil_Bob; Oct 15, 2004 at 02:54 AM.
Race Director
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 16,135
Likes: 5
From: Newberry FL
Cruise-In VIII Veteran
St. Jude Donor '07
Originally Posted by Evil_Bob
I installed shorty headers in my car. The process is relatively simple, but time consuming. I took two days to do it all, with the first day being removal of the stock manifolds, and the second day being the installation of the shorties.
The shorties I got came from BBK with full directions included. But, the directions didn't cover everything that needed to be done. So, there is a lot of improvising that must be done. I found out the hard way that not only is the car pretty much metric through and through, but you'll need a good set of deep well sockets to get the job done. I used Rhino ramps under the front wheels and simply crawled on my back beneath the car. It was a tight fit and I had to pull myself along using the frame, but there is no room for a creeper to lay on. I also had a set of store bought wheel chocks behind the rear wheels, just in case.
At first glance, there doesn't seem to be much room to install them, but once you disconnect and take off the coil packs on the right and left valve covers, there is PLENTY of room on both sides of the engine. On the left side you'll have to remove the alternator to make room as well, and also figure out how to move or remove the hoses from your air pump that are part of your emissions control system (SMOG). You'll also need to remove your spark plug cables (do this first). Some will tell you to remove the spark plugs as well, but I left mine in since I didn't want any dirt or debris getting into my engine cylinders. I didn't have any problems with leaving the spark plugs installed. You'll also have to crawl under the car and loosen the two mounting bolts for your stock H-pipe at the front of the car, to give the manifold/shorties room to move. Also, when you remove the stock manifold from the exhaust pipe, there are two circular donut gaskets inside of the pipe that you want to retain and use again, unless you have new ones. You'll recognize the donut gaskets when they fall out. Getting the right side out is easy, it's the left side that is time consuming. You can unbolt and pull the stock manifolds almost straight up and out of the engine compartment, but a small amount of manuevering might be required. But, the old manifolds do come out relatively easy. The worst thing that happened during the removal process was that I had to break the mounting clips for the electrical connections of the right and left O2 sensors in the stock manifolds. The electrical connections for the O2 sensors are snapped into the frame and I couldn't get the electrical connections to come out, and eventually just twisted them free, which broke the plastic mounting tabs (during installation I simply zip-tied the electrical connections to the other cable runs that are located along the frame, with no harm done). If I would have broken the O2 connectors, I would have simply gone to the local Chevy dealer and gotten new O2 sensors...no big deal.
For installation, the right side pretty much slides right in, from the top. If I recall correctly, I had to wiggle and manuever the right side a little bit, but it's the left side that is a little harder to get into place. Actually, the left side was kind of a bitch trying to get it to fit from the top side of the engine, but she finally went in. Also, the stock mount for the oil dipstick on the right side may not match up to the mount on the shorties. I had to fabricate my own mount for the oil dipstick courtesy of Walmart supplied parts. I had to bend the dipstick a little to keep it from touching the headers, but it worked out in the end. Also, one of the things I noticed right off is that the BBK shorties are a little wider than the stock manifolds, so you'll have to closely examine your hoses and electrical wires to make sure they don't touch the headers. On the left side, the air pump hoses for the emission control system were touching the header tubes, so I ended up going to Home Depot and purchasing some extra large, extra long zip-ties. I used the larger zip-ties to pull the air hoses away from the header tubes by fastening the air hoses to the master cylinder for the brakes. It all worked out pretty good in the end.
Overall, it was fairly easy to do. But what made it so successful was that I took my time and didn't rush, taking two days to do it. Not to mention the self pride at doing a good job with my own hands (I did all of my mods myself...no shop has ever touched my car).
In the end, I know some fellas (probably most) will say don't do the shorties...waste of time, not enuff horse power gain, etc, etc...but your car is for you and no one else. So, if you want shorties, put the shorties in, I say. I also didn't want to cut up my stock H-pipe since I do all of my own work, so that was another factor in all of this for me. (I can't weld good enuff to save my own ***...)
I must have gained something from the effort as my "seat-of-the-pants" meter registered a difference and my exhaust is slightly louder than it was before I did the install (or maybe that's just wishful thinking on my part since I can't hear a damn thing anyway with the B&B Bullets a blazing ).
Anyway, hope this helps.
The shorties I got came from BBK with full directions included. But, the directions didn't cover everything that needed to be done. So, there is a lot of improvising that must be done. I found out the hard way that not only is the car pretty much metric through and through, but you'll need a good set of deep well sockets to get the job done. I used Rhino ramps under the front wheels and simply crawled on my back beneath the car. It was a tight fit and I had to pull myself along using the frame, but there is no room for a creeper to lay on. I also had a set of store bought wheel chocks behind the rear wheels, just in case.
At first glance, there doesn't seem to be much room to install them, but once you disconnect and take off the coil packs on the right and left valve covers, there is PLENTY of room on both sides of the engine. On the left side you'll have to remove the alternator to make room as well, and also figure out how to move or remove the hoses from your air pump that are part of your emissions control system (SMOG). You'll also need to remove your spark plug cables (do this first). Some will tell you to remove the spark plugs as well, but I left mine in since I didn't want any dirt or debris getting into my engine cylinders. I didn't have any problems with leaving the spark plugs installed. You'll also have to crawl under the car and loosen the two mounting bolts for your stock H-pipe at the front of the car, to give the manifold/shorties room to move. Also, when you remove the stock manifold from the exhaust pipe, there are two circular donut gaskets inside of the pipe that you want to retain and use again, unless you have new ones. You'll recognize the donut gaskets when they fall out. Getting the right side out is easy, it's the left side that is time consuming. You can unbolt and pull the stock manifolds almost straight up and out of the engine compartment, but a small amount of manuevering might be required. But, the old manifolds do come out relatively easy. The worst thing that happened during the removal process was that I had to break the mounting clips for the electrical connections of the right and left O2 sensors in the stock manifolds. The electrical connections for the O2 sensors are snapped into the frame and I couldn't get the electrical connections to come out, and eventually just twisted them free, which broke the plastic mounting tabs (during installation I simply zip-tied the electrical connections to the other cable runs that are located along the frame, with no harm done). If I would have broken the O2 connectors, I would have simply gone to the local Chevy dealer and gotten new O2 sensors...no big deal.
For installation, the right side pretty much slides right in, from the top. If I recall correctly, I had to wiggle and manuever the right side a little bit, but it's the left side that is a little harder to get into place. Actually, the left side was kind of a bitch trying to get it to fit from the top side of the engine, but she finally went in. Also, the stock mount for the oil dipstick on the right side may not match up to the mount on the shorties. I had to fabricate my own mount for the oil dipstick courtesy of Walmart supplied parts. I had to bend the dipstick a little to keep it from touching the headers, but it worked out in the end. Also, one of the things I noticed right off is that the BBK shorties are a little wider than the stock manifolds, so you'll have to closely examine your hoses and electrical wires to make sure they don't touch the headers. On the left side, the air pump hoses for the emission control system were touching the header tubes, so I ended up going to Home Depot and purchasing some extra large, extra long zip-ties. I used the larger zip-ties to pull the air hoses away from the header tubes by fastening the air hoses to the master cylinder for the brakes. It all worked out pretty good in the end.
Overall, it was fairly easy to do. But what made it so successful was that I took my time and didn't rush, taking two days to do it. Not to mention the self pride at doing a good job with my own hands (I did all of my mods myself...no shop has ever touched my car).
In the end, I know some fellas (probably most) will say don't do the shorties...waste of time, not enuff horse power gain, etc, etc...but your car is for you and no one else. So, if you want shorties, put the shorties in, I say. I also didn't want to cut up my stock H-pipe since I do all of my own work, so that was another factor in all of this for me. (I can't weld good enuff to save my own ***...)
I must have gained something from the effort as my "seat-of-the-pants" meter registered a difference and my exhaust is slightly louder than it was before I did the install (or maybe that's just wishful thinking on my part since I can't hear a damn thing anyway with the B&B Bullets a blazing
).Anyway, hope this helps.
NCM, WSCC &amp;amp; SCC Member
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 2,900
Likes: 1
I got 14 h.p./11 torque from my ceramic coated B&B's on a H/C motor through the pre-cats and cats. Definately, noticable. Most long tubes give 20-21 h.p./20 torque, PERIOD, over the Z06 manifolds.
The midrange for most shorties(any car) is as good as the longtubes, it is up top where long tubes shine. I cannot tell difference between the long tubes and shorties on the same motor.
Now I have the bigger 1 7/8 Kooks on my 429 with high flow cats. Needed to scavenge more heat.
The midrange for most shorties(any car) is as good as the longtubes, it is up top where long tubes shine. I cannot tell difference between the long tubes and shorties on the same motor.
Now I have the bigger 1 7/8 Kooks on my 429 with high flow cats. Needed to scavenge more heat.
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 2,290
Likes: 4
From: G-boro NC
Originally Posted by #001 2001 Z06
I got 14 h.p./11 torque from my ceramic coated B&B's on a H/C motor through the pre-cats and cats. Definately, noticable. Most long tubes give 20-21 h.p./20 torque, PERIOD, over the Z06 manifolds.
The midrange for most shorties(any car) is as good as the longtubes, it is up top where long tubes shine. I cannot tell difference between the long tubes and shorties on the same motor.
Now I have the bigger 1 7/8 Kooks on my 429 with high flow cats. Needed to scavenge more heat.
The midrange for most shorties(any car) is as good as the longtubes, it is up top where long tubes shine. I cannot tell difference between the long tubes and shorties on the same motor.
Now I have the bigger 1 7/8 Kooks on my 429 with high flow cats. Needed to scavenge more heat.
If, I get 10rwhp out of the shorties I would say I have got my monies worth. Maybe one day I will get the LT's. Thanks for the info on your car.
Drifting
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 1,326
Likes: 47
From: Tullahoma, TN
Install is the same as the factory manifolds. I recommend thicker spark plug wires like the GM high performance wires or MSDs. For added heat insurance on the wires you may want to add Kool sox that go over the wire boots.
