Track times do tell the tale.

Stock I was running 13.0 at 109 or so.

After heads/cam I run 12.1 at 117mph.
Stock I dynoed 320 RWHP. I now dyno between 370 & 376RWHP.

Thats a measurable gain of 8 MPH and nearly a full second better et.

 

Scott,
You didnt improve your times by .9 seconds and 8 mph making an additional 50 HP. I know that you accomplished it but give yourself some credit. Improved hook,shifting, weather and driving. :yesnod:

Scott your result would more closely parrallel an additional 100 HP gain.

I challenge anyone else on the forum to show me those kinds of improvements on a 50 HP gain.

Looking forward to hooking up in a few weeks!
Matthew

 

I see your point.

I guess my point is that you can dyno to set a benchmark but the track
is where all the guessing stops.

Besides, who am I to second guess the nice things you've said about my driving. ;)

 

I agree that a Dyno is best used as a tuners tool for bench marking improvements!

I am probably the odd man out on this forum.

Dyno numbers mean nothing to me! All that counts is what I can lay down. Its either useful horsepower or its useless horsepower. You dont know where you are until you try to hook it up. Street...track whatever.

I dont understand the Dyno bragging rights game...just not my mentality...but I will defend anyones right to play the game.

Its all good!

No :bs intended just how I see it!
Matthew

 

Matt. I fully see your point. But at the same time I think the dyno is the best "yardstick" that a tuner has to measure improvement and tweak the components to work together. As you know, there really aren't very many drivers astute enought to feel 10 or 15 rwhp numbers, or to be able to turn consistent before and after times at the track. Also, the tuners would have to charge a fortune to take the time to perform before and after 1/4 mile runs.

I think anyone is smart to not let the dyno determine their happiness with package, but the dyno is very important to getting where you are going with aftermarket tuning.

 

It looks like we are in total agreement. :yesnod:

 

Thats the straight poopie a dyno run can tell you what the upgrade delivers to the drivetrain after that its up to you to make it lay the smack down. :lol:

 

The truth begins to show it's ugly ...... dyno #'s ? LOL ....

Recently, a lot of tuners, cross country - have been inflating #'s to make more sales ... it's sad, but true. This is why I think we need some kind of reference setup, to go by - for dyno's (a calibration method of sorts) ... right ??

 

Didnt somebody on here dyno some crazy number with an LG cam on LG's dyno, then go to MTI's dyno and make 10-15rwhp less with the exact same setup? I think they did.... :seeya

 

I will have to agree with jschindler and Adman on this. Dynos are a great tuning and measuring tool. I kind of look at it like this. Football players are usually measured by their speed and strength. Usually, but not in all cases a good player has both of these. The opposite is not always true though. Just because an athlete is strong and fast doesn't mean he is a good player. So, big dyno numbers are a good indicator, but not the end all. If the car doesn't perform, than the dyno numbers don't mean jack. Don't you just love my analogy. :D

 

Hehe... :) Deion Sanders= Overpriced.... Probably the quickest/fastest to play in the NFL, but always someting broken..... Thus he is useless....

 

Dynos are a great tuning and measuring tool.

I'm going to dyno my vette after every major mod on the same dyno ran by the same operator. If the mod doesn't produce it's not going on my car.

 

Fudgey the Whale is definately out there nuff said.

 

No matter who it is or what dyno your vehicle is on, it boils done to two words... Trust & Experience. Any set of numbers could be manipulated so what's the point if the operator is doing you a disservice by building your ego...


Nick

 

Kewlbrz: You read my mind. :cheers:

 

I think your talking about JW, right?? I thought he dynoed the same at LG's and then the same at Speedworks?? :confused: Then I think he had an O2 problem and was down 8-10 at MTI. Not sure, maybe he'll chime in (if this is who you were referring to).

 

That is right. JW Schmidt3 dynoed 436rwhp here at LG Motorsports, then 435rwhp +/- at Speedworks, then he went to MTI, and dynoed 425rwhp, with a bad O2.

There are ways to get bogus numbers, and I think there are some shops that do this, but LGM is not one of them.

Keep in mind that there are 2 important numbers that matter, and that is "Intake air temp" and "weather station /ambient temp" Where the shop places these temp probes will affect the final numbers. My dyno usually reads 10 hp DOWN compared to some shops here in Dallas, but almost exactly the same as one other shop

Winter numbers up north will be much greater if the car is placed on the dyno with the nose of the car pointing out the door, sucking in Cold air from outside. In addition to that, the heat from the car and the exhaust are inside the shop, are affecting the weather station numbers (they will think it is hotter than it really is).
The weather station numbers control the SAE correction factor, and even when it is 30 degrees outside, the weather station will read hotter due to the placement of the car, and the resulting heat from the car.

The result is a higher number that the engine really has.

In Texas it is always warm, and in the summer the heat outside is higher no matter what direction you place the car.

So consider these facts and post which way your car was on the dyno, and if the engine pulls air from inside or outside.

Lou Gigliotti http://www.LGmotorsports.com


[Modified by LG Motorsports, 9:14 PM 2/22/2002]

 

On the other side, of the question, "What good are dyno numbers"?

On our race car, we dyno the car when we put a fresh engine in before we leave for a race. Then after the race we dyno again to see if everything is still ok. If the numbers are down, to any degree, we can assume that something is not right. If everything is up to par, we run the engine another race. Our race engines are only good for 400 miles, which is about 2 race weekends.
If I miss a shift or have some other mistake, then the dyno tells us if we hurt anything.
Just another use of the dyno, and It keeps the engine builder on his toes.

The sanctioning body will sometimes bring a dynojet to the race track, and order the top 5 cars to get dynoed to see what is going on with the engine technology to asses the validity of the rules, and to make adjustments in them.


Later

Lou Gigliotti http://www.lgmotorsports.com

 

[Modified by Y2KWS6TA, 3:04 PM 2/22/2002]

 

well i have seen some messed up dyno numbers. I have dynoed after some mods to my car and lost 16 RWHP and i still ran alot better at the track. I am begining to think that dyno's tell you nothing. OH BTW you guys with the 6 speeds dyno the car in 6th and see what you get. it will be alot higher. dynojet is crap the faster you spinn the dyno the more power you get. This may be due to the inertia of the wheels and everything on the car. The real story is the track. Torque is calculated from the HP measurement. I know it sounds weird because the dyno actualy measures torque. The dyno has an inertial ring that you acelerate and it has a speed sensor on it. the computer then takes the derivative of the speed and knows the accileration thus you get the torque and it already has the speed so it calculates hp at the rears. From the engine RPM it then calculates the corrected input shaft torque. not the torque at the rears. The dyno needs to be calibrated from time to time. However dynojet says it never needs to be calibrated or serviced. I think it is a load of crap. also you guys that spent all that money buying a dyno you could have built your own for alot less. it is a very simple machine that costs more than a C5.