C54 maybe if you layed off the exclamation marks in every other line of your posts, maybe folks wouldn't take exception to your comments

 

What's up Shinobi. I was wondering when you were going to comment. :) So did you ever take your car back for the dyno tuning? If so, can you give before and after results and what you did, because I'm still debating on the custom programming or not. I'm just curious if custom programming is even worth it running with our 91 octane.

Take it easy on Tim too, he just stated his experience with Ralph. I don't know when he actually went to see Ralph, but it might have been awhile ago and we both know Ralph has more experience now (BTW, I was at HRH before you, for my cam install before doing the whole motor :cool: ). But seeing how the O2 sensors read the same on the F-Body and the Vette, it might have been just the scan tool he used. In fact, the PCMs for the two cars are so similar, the same version of the LS1 Edit works for both cars. So if someone knows their way around the F-Body, they should know their way around the Vette, tuning wise. In terms of wrenching, the Vette takes more time than a F-Body.

Tim, I wouldn't blame it just on the parts. And I wouldn't just look at the dyno number. Our cars aren't dyno queens. What are your track times? And take a scan tool and check out what I told you before. If everything is running fine there, then you can start blaming the parts.

99 C5 M6

 

So you had to drill a hole? That's odd, since I have the same cam profile and I didn't have to do anything. Sure, it took some time for the idle to learn, it did the drop to 400 rpm thing too, but my car hasn't died yet. In any case, glad that solved your problem.

99 C5 M6

 

the good news is that it worked for me, but tuning will be the ultimate solution, as the TB hole is a band aid approach at best. If need be, I can always change out the blade and replace with new for tuning, or just maybe tuning will compensate for all flaws and it won't matter. How do you like your setup? I baby mine at first and just drove home (about 130 miles). I did take advantage of power to pass at 80+ to sub 100, nice blasts. When I got home, sticking to plan, I pulled the intake manifold off and shipped back to Cartek today for minor porting work. Cartek is sending me 30 lb injectors as well so things should be coming together nicely for me soon. I can't say enough about Ralph. Damn straight guy, unusual in California. Hope you all consider attending (or showing) at the Coast's largest automotive event on Sunday, April 28th at the Pacific Coast Dream Machines held at the Half Moon Bay airport. The event draws phenomenal crowds (upwards of 10,000). Great event, just show, no prizes, and all vehicles are welcome.





[Modified by 2ndVette, 2:16 PM 3/11/2002]

 

A few things here. First howz it going dude? I am glad your car is done. I will shed my opinion on tuning in a minute.

I try to stay cool with everybody, but posting things here on this forum is the right of the individual and everybody is entitled to their opinion. But when my friends lively hood and business is at risk because of people making statements that I do not feel are entirely accurate "stuff like anybody can wrench not everybody can tune" about somebody that can do both and it has the potential to cause my friend harm...I am going to step up and anybody that knows me, knows thats the type of friend I am. An LS1 is an LS1 whether its in a F-Body or C5, tuninig wise AFR is AFR. The wrenching is what the difference is between the F Body and the C5. They tuning is near identical, much closer to each other than the wrenching between the two. In the case of the C5 TB is controlled by the computer vs the FBody.

I talked to Ralph to get his version and his version is different then Tim's. Ralph is working so he doesn't have time to chime in and post a reply, but he did read the post and told me he was dissappointed with it. Stuff like, "I was looking for a mechanic for my club and he doesn't have enough experience"..to me those are fighting words and the ignorance disgust me and thats why I state I will tell it to somebody's face if it comes up. I don't plan on showing up to the track Saturday and ruining anybody's time but talking trash is talking trash, and I don't want to hear a bunch of Bull that within our tight well watched Corvette Community could harm his business. The guy did not ripp off anybody 20K or 2 dollars for that matter.

We are talking about the difference of a H&C or Stroker install vs a faulty 02 sensor diagnostic or something like that to descibe a business owners credibility. Well that is :bs Speakong of 02 sensors and their unpredicability, I was getting a check engine light at first when I red lined my car 6700 RPM for 02 sensors, it would reset itself and now it does not even do it anymore, my car runs rich so it was triggering an 02 sensor code, now I can't even reproduce it for Ralph or myself. So there is an 02 sensor story.

About the programming for your car, you should put it on the dyno and using a MAFT you can have the AFR checked at WOT. The timing advance is also measured and any detonation issues can be addressed.

My car ran flawless without dyno tuning and the first run made 395 RWHP and 410 RWHP. We are going to to some more "tuning" to see if the AFR is optimum. I am also running 335/30 tires which are heavier and different diameter then the stock ones so I might switch back to the stock size, have the information reloaded into the PCM (tire size) and re-dyno to see where it is compared to the other dyno #'s that appear from other Tuners around the forum. I still don't know if I even want to do this because the car is running fine and I am trying to get used of how to keep the tires from spinning.

When I talked to Ralph today he told me you kept your stock programming and are awaiting the custom programming....I would say you need to re-program that baby..the programming is the trick to attain the right AFR and timing to achieve max hp's at WOT, so go for it dude. I am glad we have an experienced Mechanic charging reasonable prices to fix our killer cars. And Ralph has great customer service, I have never been to a shop where the dude has just let me use all his tools to wrench on my car.

I had to drill a small hole in my TB like the F Body's because my cam is huge, I will have to check my cam card. I don't know. I think the hole in TB has been contraversial, but it made my car Idle better immediately after I drilled it and reinstalled it. The car just idled, before it would hunt and then find it. But it was irritating, it made it sound like I was tapping the throttle as the servo was constantly adjusting the TB blades to fine the desired idle mixture.

I am not going to be in some rampage against Tim when I see him Saturday but I mean what I say and I would appreciate that the bulls h i t comments be kept off this forum. It isn't like he screwed up your car and didn't fix it, I don't feel that should be reason to state or be used to disqualify or nullify Ralph's ability.

Let me correct one thing mine was the first H&C C5 that Ralph did, but I do remember looking at yours on the rack. I am just glad that it is back on the street where it belongs. :D :cheers:


[Modified by Shinobi's97, 5:04 PM 3/11/2002]

 

straight up. Can't wait till we can all run at future events/times at Sacto. I am still stoked sub $1000 head/cam install with a 6 mos/6000 mile warranty. Ralph's my man from now on.

 

Very true. I just reread some of the older posts and I can see where you're coming from now. I totally missed that vibe, but still, we can all get along. :cheers: Without being confrontational (Shinobi has this covered :D ), I'll just say Ralph knows what he's doing and does a good job. I like the fact that he really takes his time. An example of that is that he pulled my battery out of my car, used a real battery charger (takes a few hours to charge though), and then put it back in instead of just jump starting my car which could harm some sensitive electronics. The comment that he knows F-Bodies but not C5s is totally bogus for the reasons that I stated in my previous post and Shinobi just restated. Ralph has a great reputation among F-Bodies and he does work mostly on F-Bodies, but I'm sure the same could be said for ARE, MTI, and MMS. Probably only DRM and LPE see more Vettes than F-Bodies. And only Mallett works on Vettes only. Only thing is DRM, LPE, and Mallet charge an arm and a leg.

Shinobi, right now I use my autotap to dial in my MAFT. I don't have any detonation issues, my timing is averaging around 28 degrees of advance. I don't know if I can advance it anymore though, with the 91 octane. Also, this cold weather is definately helping to fight detonation, so during the summer, I may not be so lucky.

So you dynoed at 395RHWP and then again at 410 RWHP? What was the difference between the two runs? That's definately a nice gain. :yesnod: You really don't need to reload the PCM for the new tire size unless you are worried about the speedometer being off. I have the HPP3 and it gives you that option though. I'm waiting on some injectors and then I'll be at Ralphs for some dynoing.

99 C5 M6

 

Are those the 30# SVO injectors? They're actually 36#s at LS1 fuel pressure. If you get those, you definately need the custom programming or the MAFT at the very least.

99 C5 M6

 

yes and thanks. I won't install the injectors until LS1-edit is close to release. I could possibly damage the cats if I install now. Manifold porting first. Then install have some grins, wait for LS1-edit, install injectors and grin :D

 

I was lucky in some respects to have a 97 year model because they came with 30lb injectors. As for HP #'s we want to get the RWTQ up closer to 390 thats why I was wondering too abou the wheel size. Ralph wants to check LS1 edit out and evaluate it. Something too about his dyno, is that it is not low at all, Dyno Jet has been out to his shop twice within the last year, and last 6 months and they checked the calibration and said it was right on. He also uses the windows software that comes with the Dyno Jet not the DOS based software a lot of people use. I was told that the DOS based software makes certain assumptions vs. the Windows version which has more selection. Your timing advance looks right on. I thought I was at 26 degrees but maybe we can bump it up to 28. Maybe I can squeeze out a few more ponies if I get the AFR dialed in a little more. Like I said it almost doesn't matter because I am learning to drive the car at the track (road course) and it has plenty of power, those damn Honda S2000's are something out there. You know I looked at everybody's H&C setup. MattG did the order for and handled it cool, called me let me know what was up, Dave & Julio were totally cool at CARTEK, Jayson told me some good stuff at MTI, and so did MMS. But the bottom line is that Ralph is an Authorized ARE distributor, I didn't have to pay a core charge because of that, and he installed my stuff for a killer price, he warranty's his labor for 6 months/6K miles and the ARE H&C is warrantied for 2 year/24k miles like the other tuners too and the car has alot of power...it makes everybody smile that goes for a ride in it...that alone is priceless.

Now I am wondering about to S/C or Stroke. ATI makes a setup for H&C car, I am wondering if my botton can handle it...something tells me no. I think that maybe I am being rediculous because the car runs so good.

 

Shinobi, I have been pulling 29 degrees timing on my heads/cam package which is identical to yours so you may be good for a couple more degrees. I don't get any Knock Retard but I do ALWAYS run 94 octane in the car.

The SC or Stroker decision is a tough one, but to me it seems that your main interest is roadracing. For roadracing, I think nothing beats the low end torque and reliability of a stroker motor. I always fear too much heat being generated with forced induction on a roadcourse. On my new 436ci, I went with the 4.125" crank to make sure I have oodles of low end power to pull me out of corners on a track.

 

You probably get 94 octane at the pump. :smash:

Shinobi, you could try for alittle more timing, but watch out for knocking when the weather gets alittle warmer. As long as you're alert, it's not a big deal.

99 C5 M6