Richard@Adams

Anybody use Mix-I-Go from Bell Performance to counter act the effects of ethanol? What's your opinion?

ipuig

To counter act what effects?

Hauln1203

I do not use ethanol blended fuels in my vette. In wisconsin you can buy straight premium 93 oct. If you have to use ethanol blended fuels the biggest problem is that it acts as a wick for moisture and H2O and ethanol are not compatable ( phase separation ) so use a little isopropyl alcohol to limit moisture and if you are storing your vehicle put in some Stabil that is formulated for ethanol blended fuels.

ipuig

No offense but you have no idea what you are talking about, Ethanol is miscible with water. The reported increased corrosivity caused by ethanol blened fuels is not an issue with the materials used modern fuel delivery systems.
In my opinion, increased fuel system corrosion in older vehicles with carbon steel fuel lines and tanks has been used by fuel additive vendors to perpetuate this myth for modern vehicles in order to continue to sell their products.
Ethanol increases combustion efficiency and reduces emissions, that is a fact. In the late 70s, the DOE & EPA issued grants to several engineering schools to study the effects of ethanol and methanol blended fuels. I worked as an lab assistant for one of the reasearch engineers that ran one of the studies. The data generated by these experiments showed a significant net benefit in several performance factors when running blended fuels over pure indolene (testing grade gasoline).
You can choose to believe what you like, but the facts over the benefits of ethanol blended fuels is indisputible.

thetaxman

with 10% ethanol I get 10% worse gas mileage

C5FORFUN2

Sure wish we had non-ethenol fuels. I don't know where the efficiency thing comes from, but it definitely isn't when fuel mileage drops. I would use the Stabil as suggested especially in older vehicles but haven't heard of the other brand. Water in the fuel is not good for any vehicle.

leadfoot4

I've tried the Lucas brand of fuel additive, to supposedly counteract the ethanol's corrosive effects....

Hauln1203

My comments on ethanol blended fuels are based on over 25 years in the petroleum industry. I am currently working for the largest fuel storage and loading facility in Wi. The state and federal gov. currently offer significant tax incentives for customers that use eth. blended fuels. In this state you can still get straight product ranging from 87 to 93 oct. so we have a unique situation the best of both worlds. As far as water and ethanol blended fuels being miscible maybe a very very small amount of water, however if you dont believe me I urge you to contact your local state run petroleum inspection facility and ask one of their inspectors about the problems created by water in ethanol blended fuels. Water is obviously bad in any fuel but phaze separation in ethanol blended fuels creates a whole different set of problems.
The only positive point I can make about ethanol is its oct. by blending it with conventional 87 oct. it raises the oct to 89. I realize we are living at a time when lessening our dependence on foreign oil is a priority and ethanol is helping, but as long as there is a choice in WI. I will choose to run conventional in my vette.

Richard@Adams

Did you notice anything?

Richard@Adams

I'm wondering if the test results would change running them today, some 30 years later using modern testing equipment. What do you think?

feeder82

test results and real world results dont always match. Ask a station owner what happens when water enters their tanks with a Ethanol blend in the tank. The water miscibles with the fuel and has to pumped off to get the water out, with no ethanol the water settles to the bottom of the tank and can be removed without contaminating the entire load of fuel. The entire Ethanol industry would disappear without the heavy lobbying of the corn producers. Ethanol is fine if you are using your vehicle on a regular basis, if you store it look out

leadfoot4

Not really, in the cars anyway, but the lawn mower and snow blower seem to run better. Especially the lawn mower, as I get better "mileage" from the mower when I throw some of the Lucas additive into the gas can.

ipuig

I would hardly consider an individual working at a tank farm an expert on this subject.
As for the rest of you, consider a taking a basic physics and chemistry class before commenting on things that are beyond your level of knowledge.

feeder82

Bad Karma

I have.
How do you factor in that lower energy content of Ethanol into your equation? I think it's somewhere around 2/3 the BTU rating.

On personal experience, I have noticed just the 90/10 mix we have here and switched to straight gasoline when available on vacations I can notice an increase in gas mileage from straight gasoline. E85 to straight gasoline will have a much more noticeable impact on miles per gallon.

On to performance, engine factors being the same you should also see less power output from your engine. Now you can balance out a little of this by raising compression which E85 will happier with due to it's higher octane rating, but you will need to be running a dedicated E85 engine. On a turbo or supercharged engines E85 will also allow for a higher boost pressures before you hit detonation; but with the lower energy content do you have to use more fuel? or just higher boost pressures to get the same power down to the wheels.


The only benefit of Ethanol is cleaner emissions, I just don't see any other.


I'm much mote interested in the technology of using genetic engineering and modified bacteria to create gasoline from sugars. And from the looks of some research I read, switchgrass might be a better alternative than corn; it would not effect our food source in corn, it takes less work and energy to grow, having less of an impact on the environment on the front side of production.

Z06supercharged

With E85 I need approx 35% more fuel so my mpg dropped as well but I could care less about gas mileage.
Running E85 compared to E10 I can make a minimum 70 rwhp or more depending how much more timing I throw at it and with the combustion temps much cooler and its 105 octane no fear of any detonation ever.

I love E85 and will never go back to running **** crap pump E10 91 octane.

With E85 you can also run less boost to make same hp because more timing is available or dont change boost at all and get substantially more hp.

For boosted apps E85 is a win win situation cept for gas mileage.

Bad Karma

Thanks. I wasn't sure on the tuning side of things. I was sure mileage would drop, but didn't want to speak out of turn since I haven't tuned a turbo on E85, just E10 gas.

Z06supercharged

Actually I am tuned for E90 because every time I test it when I fill up that's where the % of ethanol is and since it can vary from the 74 min to 92 max you need to test it regular to see where it is because it is such a wide variance.
The E10 here tests always around 7-8% and never have I seen 9-10%

So since E85 sells for $3.59 here vs $3.81 for premium 91, to break even on the worse mileage E85 would have to sell for like $2.60/gallon.

Hauln1203

Once again one upmanship prevails on the forum.. I gave an honest opinion on ethanol blended fuels based on 25 years in the petroleum industry, and by the way only the last 4 at a terminal storage facility, and never claimed to be a expert. There appears to be only one expert here and all the rest of us had better continue are education. So in response to the original thread, one other suggestion maybe you can google ethanol blended fuels and I am sure you will find all kinds of info. both pros and cons concerning ethanol blends and different additives.GOOD LUCK..

Z06supercharged

As you noted many pros and cons. E85 isnt for everyone and really in my opinion only good for boosted apps. A NA car no matter what manufacturer shouldnt use it cause its inefficient and worse mpg. Environmentalists, Al Gore lovers, farmers and tree huggers want to suport it use I'm sure. Cold weather below 56 degrees sucks for first cranking start of the day and needs to be tuned to help it start better. And yes E85 will absorb more water vs E10 so you gotta stay on top of it.
My Vette is the only car out of our 8 that I use it in.