Long post here.. I will try to keep it short..

Bought some LG headers set.. Had them installed by a "Trusted" Tech... Upon reassembly the "tech" called me to tell me when reinstalling the hot and ground wires to my starter he crossed them and fried them...

He ordered a replacement starter (Non ACDELO) installed in.. I went on my way.. Next day, everytime i started it.. it heard a loud electrical noise or potential grind.. I took it back to the Tech.. he said he would replace the starter as the 'Drive" may be bad. But was ok to drive..

NExt day, started it BAM huge long loud noice, pop and grinding.. It started though, took it HOME ASAP.. This morning was able to get it to start one last time.. but this time when i started it.. same long loud noice, but odd Idle.. and some white smoke coming out the pipe on start up and first 1/4 mile.

I took it to the shop, he said he woud replace it again, i asked for the new starter to be AC Delco and to be heat sheild wrapped..

He dont not seem to know why its doing this, but would replace at his cost..
Very nice guy, keept telling me he woudl make it right.. but I am very concerned about my fly wheel... Also concerned about the smoke... Header gasket.. i just do not know enough to know what all is happening..

Does any one have any thoughts? Or questions you can ask i can answer to help diagnose?

Cliff notes:
HEader install, fired starter
Replaced with Aftermarket Starter
Loud Noises, Grinding, New starter dead in 4 days
Smoke, (non oil smell) upon start up firsat 1/4
Back a the shop.
Stomach turning, sick to death thinking about my car

Thank you Forum

 

I would like to know exactly what this goofball did. There are no ground wires to the starter/solenoid.....period, so there is nothing to "swap".

I'm very concerned about the loud noise when starting, coupled with the white smoke. Sounds a little too much like coolant in a cylinder to me.

 

What the guy told me is (and I am a novice) so I apologize for the discription.. he said he un did two wires from the starter a hot and a ground from 2 bolts, and when he went to hook it back up, he couldnt see to well from the car and crossed them, and when he turned the key the starter POPPED and died.

I know that does not sound right, unless i miss heard him or he mis discribed it.. it was what i was "fed"

 

LG Header Install by "Trusted Tech"

What the H--- is a trusted tech?
Please elaborate this tech's experience with the c5 Corvette.

Why in the world would he not put in a new GM replacement starter, knowing all that curtails, getting the starter in & out with long tubes installed?

I installed my LG Pro, long tube headers many years ago & I did not need to drop the starter in doing so.

You never mentioned if you had the LG shorties or long tubes installed.
You also failed to mention if the headers were brand new?.
If they were in fact brand new it is common for them to smoke for a while, until the heat dissipate the oil within the tubes.

It's a good idea as you mention to put the insulated heat shield on the starter.

Here is a bit of info in regards to the starter that you or your "trusted Tech", may have not heard of.

At any rate, I'm posting up some info in regards to the LS starter.


http://ls1tech.com/forums/generation...r-bolts-2.html

http://ls1tech.com/forums/general-ma...ock-broke.html

 

They were LG Street Long Tubes with XPIPE connected to GHL Bullets. They were brand new.

The tech, was a guy who installed my GHL's, did alot of maintence for me, owens a local Pure stock car.. and races.. just some one who I trusted to do my work. He seemed legit, I was just trying to get the point across i didnt just drop it off at some random shop. If that made a difference..

 

Yep, either you misunderstood, or he is full of crap. Again, there are no ground wires on the starter. He may have installed a ground from G106 (ground location above the starter) to the solenoid. In any case, he obviouisly does not know what he is doing.

You completely glossed over my concerns for the coolant leak. If this is the case, there is a potential to break the block.......again, just a concern, based on your description of the noise it made when starting, and the white smoke from the tailpipe.

Good luck sir.

 

How would a break in the block be a result from the events thus far? What would be the tie in link between when I had done to the car, and the possibility of a break in the block?

 

Based on your statement above.....this is not normal ! The noise suggests the starter was met with some opposition, when attempting to rotate the engine. Then you have white smoke to boot. Perhaps a coincidence, but I would not chance it. If you have coolant leaking in the cylinder, the coolant cannot compress. If there is enough opposition, the engine block can crack were the starter bolts on. Does this make sense?

 

Like mentioned above .. it's two (possibly three, can't remember at this particular second) cables .. one comes from the alternator, the other comes from the point off the block by the battery, and they use the starter as a joining point (this is why if your starter is going bad your voltage on the dash will start to going up and down) - if you join the two, it's hot against hot. There are two grounding cables on the back of the motor, one that is a strap like cable on the drivers side and another that is a cable that goes to the frame on the passenger side. It'd be pretty difficult to touch either of them.

As for white smoke out of your tail pipe, that's pretty standard of a blown head gasket. I'd be curious if he over tightened something during the install ..

my advise: check your codes on the dash, write down what's coming up and then report back.

 

http://forums.corvetteforum.com/c5-t...formation.html

 

oh wow, now I am royallty scared here. Now after those loud noises it did start.. if that helps.. but no this make perfect sense..I understand what you are saying..

One thing to add.. if it did not smoke after about a 1/4 mile to 1/2 mile. It was only initially, and the car was cool before start up. When i drove it to the shop, about (10miles away) i didnt turn it off, i got out and inspected it.. seemd to idle fine. no smoke. I left it running so he could pull it right in, didnt want to chance another start up

 

I know your trying to help, but you have a few things confused. There are 4 total wires on the starter:

Large terminal - Rust, Grey, Red
Small "S" terminal - Purple

NOTHING comes from the block to the starter.

Also, there is only one ground point on the rear of the engine(G107) for the ignition coils. The other locations are:

1) G105 - Lower left side of the block
2) G106 - Right side, above the starter

 

so there ya go - 4 wires, in my defense its been a while since I've been up under there and swapped the starter.

and pardon me, I meant POWER DISTRIBUTION BLOCK in front of the battery.

 

I will be going there after work to get a report. I did get him to contact the local GM dealership and get a ACDelco Starter to put in. I did not want him atempting another aftermarket crap starter..

Wouldnt a blown head gasket be consitant with constant white smoke? or intermintant?

 

Not trying to nitpick, but that's not correct either. They battery cable splits in two directions.

1) One to the underhood fuse box
2) One to the starter

So the connection from the starter to the battery is direct, not through the "power distribution block".

 

typically it's a more constant white smoke for a head gasket .. i saw your post about not having the white smoke after warming it up so I'd doubt that to be the case.

I'd say it could just be condensation in the pipes and un-related, used to experience the same when I had straight pipes - was just cold and went away after warm up. Really it's just a guessing game until you have some codes from the computer.

 

No codes at all thus far, was actually hoping it would throw some.. but none as of yet.

 

not trying to nitpick in the slightest

you're probably right - i just seemed to remember it hitting the power point first.

ANYWAY - the point I've been trying to make .. it's hard to cross the power from negative to positive at the starter. The only thing that comes to mind is possibly grounding the cable against the starter itself since after it's installed (assuming the battery is hooked up, which it shouldn't be), it's then grounded.

 

no "probably" about it....

Actually, it's a very common mistake, during a header install(especially with a novice). As I stated, when it happens, it's typically the small wire from G106, that get's installed on the large terminal of the solenoid.

 

If you pull all the wiring in the area of the starter out to help put the header in there, one is for sure a ground. The main ground from the battery to the block.