T1 vs. Z06...
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 298
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From: More Boost, Egor
T1 vs. Z06...
Hi,
I'm looking at buying some new sway-bars for my vette, and the two options I have are Z06 or T1 bars.
Having experience neither, and with no opportunity to do so, I need objective opinions on both systems.
I've heard reports that the T1 bars are noisy (in what way are they noisy?), and that they give a VERY uncomfortable ride (can anyone be more specific?).
I've not heard anything about the Z06 set-up, but I'm worried in case this will still be too soft for me.
Here in the UK, stiff cars are generally the norm - my last car was a New Beetle RSi (number 38 of 250 ever built), and this was essentially a 4-wheel drive beetle-cup car and was very stiff, suspension wise.
My efforts are to make my Corvette handle as well as other sports cars in the UK - things like TVR and Lotuses, so it's important that I get all of my purchases right, as it's not the case that I can just return the parts easily to the supplier.
This car MUST handle like it's on rails, but I'd still like it to retain *some* of it's road manners - I don't want it squeaking and creaking all the time - so can someone please give me some objective advice? Has anyone had both of these systems fitted to their daily ride?
Help!! :confused:
I'm looking at buying some new sway-bars for my vette, and the two options I have are Z06 or T1 bars.
Having experience neither, and with no opportunity to do so, I need objective opinions on both systems.
I've heard reports that the T1 bars are noisy (in what way are they noisy?), and that they give a VERY uncomfortable ride (can anyone be more specific?).
I've not heard anything about the Z06 set-up, but I'm worried in case this will still be too soft for me.
Here in the UK, stiff cars are generally the norm - my last car was a New Beetle RSi (number 38 of 250 ever built), and this was essentially a 4-wheel drive beetle-cup car and was very stiff, suspension wise.
My efforts are to make my Corvette handle as well as other sports cars in the UK - things like TVR and Lotuses, so it's important that I get all of my purchases right, as it's not the case that I can just return the parts easily to the supplier.
This car MUST handle like it's on rails, but I'd still like it to retain *some* of it's road manners - I don't want it squeaking and creaking all the time - so can someone please give me some objective advice? Has anyone had both of these systems fitted to their daily ride?
Help!! :confused:
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: T1 vs. Z06... (C5EVIL)
The noise on the T1's comes from the race style endlinks, which wear and start to clunk and rattle. The bars can still be used with the late Z06 endlinks (which I think are the strongest) with stock levels of noise. They will make the car feel like it is on rails, with a modest increase in ride harshness on 1-wheel bumps(can't be helped, as the roll stiffness increases almost 100%).
Squeking and creaking are not a problem as the bushings used are oem style, with the fabric liner to help minimize noise and binding. Combined with good shocks - you should love it :cheers:
Squeking and creaking are not a problem as the bushings used are oem style, with the fabric liner to help minimize noise and binding. Combined with good shocks - you should love it :cheers:
Heel & Toe
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 18
Likes: 0
From: Santa Rosa Ca
Re: T1 vs. Z06... (C5EVIL)
Why aren't you considering Hotchkis bars? I know they are about the same size as the T1 bars. Does anyone know the spring rates of the T1, Hotchkis, and Z06 bars? I'd be interested in knowing which bars are the 'beefiest'
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 298
Likes: 0
From: More Boost, Egor
Re: T1 vs. Z06... (ASP Z)
The noise on the T1's comes from the race style endlinks, which wear and start to clunk and rattle. The bars can still be used with the late Z06 endlinks (which I think are the strongest) with stock levels of noise. They will make the car feel like it is on rails, with a modest increase in ride harshness on 1-wheel bumps(can't be helped, as the roll stiffness increases almost 100%).
Squeking and creaking are not a problem as the bushings used are oem style, with the fabric liner to help minimize noise and binding. Combined with good shocks - you should love it :cheers:
Squeking and creaking are not a problem as the bushings used are oem style, with the fabric liner to help minimize noise and binding. Combined with good shocks - you should love it :cheers:
So I need to buy T1 bars and Z06 end-links?
Have you had any problems with ground clearance with the T-1 bars? If so, can you post any pix so I can tell if I'd have problems? We have a lot of "Traffic Control Humps" here (speed bumps) which may well cause a problem if clearance is an issue.
I'm pleased to hear that you think the ride harshness isn't as dramatic as it's made out to be - in your opinion, would it be acceptable as a daily driver?
Thanks for your help so far! :D
:cheers:
Safety Car
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 4,295
Likes: 2
From: Indianapolis Indiana
Cruise-In III Veteran
Cruise-In IV Veteran
Re: T1 vs. Z06... (DS)
I would like to know the rates as well. I was considering either the T1 or the Hotchkis and was wondering which was the beefiest.
Pro
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 746
Likes: 1
From: salem or
Re: T1 vs. Z06... (BQuicksilver)
I'd put in a vote for the Zo6 bars. The T1 bars are too stiff for slower driving.
The Zo6 bars increase the responsiveness to adequate levels for 35-65 MPH cornering. You still get some cowl shake and a definate degregation in ride, (I ended up replacing the poly bushings with stock Zo6 rubber... a nice compromise). The T1 bar is just too big. It trashes the sweet handling of the car at low speed cornering such as driving a country road or autocrossing.
Also remember that the T1 bar is supposed to be matched with very stiff T1 leaf springs and shock rates as part of the package. Using the stiff bar with a light spring/ shock package that can't adequately control the weight transfer may well the bar to causing the inside wheel to raise under hard cornering. This could be quite troublesome if it's an inside rear... how are you going to get traction coming off the corner with a wheel up in the air?
sj
The Zo6 bars increase the responsiveness to adequate levels for 35-65 MPH cornering. You still get some cowl shake and a definate degregation in ride, (I ended up replacing the poly bushings with stock Zo6 rubber... a nice compromise). The T1 bar is just too big. It trashes the sweet handling of the car at low speed cornering such as driving a country road or autocrossing.
Also remember that the T1 bar is supposed to be matched with very stiff T1 leaf springs and shock rates as part of the package. Using the stiff bar with a light spring/ shock package that can't adequately control the weight transfer may well the bar to causing the inside wheel to raise under hard cornering. This could be quite troublesome if it's an inside rear... how are you going to get traction coming off the corner with a wheel up in the air?
sj
Drifting
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 1,517
Likes: 1
From: Stockholm
Re: T1 vs. Z06... (C5EVIL)
I have had the T1's since I got my car delivered new July -00, I love the ride and the T1's are dead quite. I have about 12000 miles on the car, those who have had noise problems, maybe they have mounted the endlinks wrong(it´s possible to do that) and had excessive wear?
I would say go with the T1's you wont regret it. :smash:
:cheers:
I would say go with the T1's you wont regret it. :smash:
:cheers:
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Melting Slicks
Joined: Oct 2001
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From: Official Misfit Cooler Owner
Cruise-In III Veteran
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Re: T1 vs. Z06... (C5EVIL)
I have the T1 bars with Z06 end links and Bilstein Sport shocks. Nice combo but I do get some noise when I go over speed bumps and such. I don't mind it though, sounds like a race car. :cool:
There was a post on here yesterday that compared the size of the different bars on the market. The T1 bars are much bigger than any other ones including Hotchkis.
If you want ultimate preformance the choice is T1s. If you want really good performance go with the Z06 bars. The Hotchkis are in the same category as the Z06 bars just more money.
There was a post on here yesterday that compared the size of the different bars on the market. The T1 bars are much bigger than any other ones including Hotchkis.
If you want ultimate preformance the choice is T1s. If you want really good performance go with the Z06 bars. The Hotchkis are in the same category as the Z06 bars just more money.
Drifting
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 1,941
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From: Stealth So Cal GOCC ...comming to invade your neighborhood soon
Re: T1 vs. Z06... (vette.se)
I bought a new vert with Z51 and installed the T1's. Origionally the enl links were noisy but I then replaced them with the Hotchkis' end links-to date they're fine( over 12K miles). The other noise I have is the bushings which creak on speedbumps if I don't grease them-maybe they're just too old.
As for the ride, they're only harsh on single wheeled bumps and dirveways at angles-speedbumps straight aren't an issue.
Regarding using Z06 endlinks, I used them on the rear and they work great but the fronts won't work because they'll hit the "A" arms-you must use an adjustable one.
Ground clearance won't be an issue.
As for lifting the inner wheel up in a turn due to mismatched springs, I do some HARD canyon carving with quite a few others from here and usually turn quite harder than all but the heavily modded cars. To date this hasn't been an issue and if it has, it hasn't slowed me down yet.
I say go for them. If in doubt, there is another bar in between the T1's and the Hotchkis. There was a thread telling all about the rates and categories of each. Do a search.
As for the ride, they're only harsh on single wheeled bumps and dirveways at angles-speedbumps straight aren't an issue.
Regarding using Z06 endlinks, I used them on the rear and they work great but the fronts won't work because they'll hit the "A" arms-you must use an adjustable one.
Ground clearance won't be an issue.
As for lifting the inner wheel up in a turn due to mismatched springs, I do some HARD canyon carving with quite a few others from here and usually turn quite harder than all but the heavily modded cars. To date this hasn't been an issue and if it has, it hasn't slowed me down yet.
I say go for them. If in doubt, there is another bar in between the T1's and the Hotchkis. There was a thread telling all about the rates and categories of each. Do a search.
Team Owner
Joined: Jul 1999
Posts: 50,808
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From: Buy USA products! Check the label! Employ Americans
Re: T1 vs. Z06... (C5EVIL)
If you want to handle get the T-1's I have run them since they came out and have about 50,000 on NY roads. No noises and the end links are fine. I spray then with lubricating oil when I'm under the car. Use some good grease on the bushings. I neevr heard a squeak. The bushing did wear after all the mileage. I replaced them when I put poly in the entire car. Chuck Mallet doesn't like them and said there to stiff. Maybe if the car is getting Penske shocks he controls roll with that. I had T-1 & Bilstiens and ran fast. I installed new VB springs and had the shocks rebuilt and revalved. I would go with the T-1's if you don't like them you may lose 75% or less if resold on forum when new.