I'm looking for my first Vette - a '99 or a 2000 MY. What are the differences in the a) Active Handling Package and b) the Real Time Damping option ? And - do these two options use the same technology on both the '99 and the 2000 models ? Are they mutually exclusive ? And - Is there any reason why I should Avoid one option or the other ?
I plan to keep the car I buy for a long time.

Thanks for your help.

 

Hi Corvector....

Both Active Handling and Real Time Damping were RPO options in 1999 and 2000. Active Handling was a common add-on, but the Real Time Damping was not. These are not the same type of feature, they are not related and do not share components. To verify the C5 you want has these features, check the RPO label in the glovebox of the car.

Active Handling, RPO JL4..... this is a safety feature that utilizes the ABS braking system and related sensors, yaw rate sensor and accelerometer. This feature automatically kicks in when the computer senses a difference in the orientation of the car vs. the intended direction the driver wants to go. This has saved my butt a couple of times on the road. In my opinion you would 100% want this feature on the car. It can be turned off. Its also good for learning a track for the first time, then can be switched off if desired.

Selective Real Time Damping, RPO F45..... this is an enhanced suspension option that includes special shocks, sensors and a console mounted selector with choices of TOUR, SPORT and PERFORMANCE. The primary benefit of this package was the smoothest ride available on any C5 up to this date when placed in the TOUR mode. During aggressive maneuvers and at speed, the PERFORMANCE setting was stiff and gave the driver improved road feel. You could dial-in on the fly how you wanted your Corvette to handle. This is a very rare feature on most of the 1999-2000 C5s. Rumor is that GM will be offering an upgrade kit to convert the F45 to the new F55 Magnetic Selective Ride.... but don't hold your breath and it will be expensive. I personally had the F45 on my 2000 Coupe. It was a nice toy and did make a small amount of difference in the settings. Personally I would opt for finding the Z51 package and forget the F45. If you do decide to get this, you can upgrade the shocks and swaybars to stiffen the ride and still retain the selection feature, if you find the OEM system too soft.

Hope that helps...... let me know if you have any questions.


.


[Modified by TexasRedZ06, 7:52 AM 11/29/2003]

 

Hello,
Active handling can be viewed to ways (IMO) it makes a bad driver a good driver OR it is a great safety feature when you absolutely need it.

Real time is a comfort issue, if you plan on doing some suspension (lowering the car etc) work than go with the Z-51.

As far as problems go, I believe that both systems are very reliable.

Kevin

 

I have real time damping on my C5 and cannot tell the difference when i move it from tour to performance and vice versa. i think it is a waste of money. in fact, i have wondered how one can determine if it is even working, given that i cannot decipher any noticeable difference when moving the switch.

 

The F45 setting difference is much more apparent at higher speeds, and it depends on how bumpy the road is. Try going 70mph and change the settings. I think you'll notice the difference. If you can find a twisty road that allows you to go fast, try it there......... very noticeable.

When I had the F45, I would make the switch to Performance just before I would navigate some aggressive corners. I could tell the difference.

 

I bought my 2004 Coupe (my first Vette) without MSRC. :banghead: :banghead:

This is apparently GM-patent protected technology and will not be made available to vendors, therefore GM is the only source.

I have asked numerous dealerships (to compare their answers) about whether this option will be made available as an aftermarket option through GM or one of our fine aftermarket vendors. The answer was a resounding NO. :cry :cry

Hopefully GM will make this available but as TexasRedZ06 said: Don't hold your breath.

:seeya

 

Hi Greg,

The F45 suspension implements electronic (or real-time) damping.
First off, I'd like to point out (to the people that say electronic suspension doesn't have a place in a real sports car) that the Ferrari 360 Modena's suspension system also utilizes electronic damping... and that it's standard equipment on that car. (I'll touch on this again at the bottom.)

Here's an interesting tid-bit of information I recently learned the system could do: (This was taken from the 1999 Corvette Specialist's Data Book.)

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
It improves the use of damping to control vehicle roll in turns and adds additional damping to aid wheel control at higher lateral accelerations as well as to control body lift and dive during acceleration and braking.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Also, the second generation Active Handling system now makes use of the F45 suspension (if your car is so equipped) for stability control.

Pretty cool stuff!

F45.. there are three settings/modes: Performance, Sport, and Touring.

There is a difference between the settings.
The performance of the suspension systems requires proper tire inflation (believe me... this one makes a HUGE difference in the way the system works). If the tires are over-inflated, the system feels like it's not even working.

You really notice the difference between Performance and Touring on twisties and bumpy roads. On smooth straight roads, you won't feel that much difference except that it feels a little smoother in Touring. I never used Sport, which is supposed to reproduce the feel of the base suspension. I don't believe in a compromise (medium) setting. For me, it's either performance or comfort with no in-between.

I drove with the system in Performance about 90% of the time.

I normally had it in Performance mode. Especially when I was driving really fast on the highway or on curves, twisties, entrance/exit ramps, etc.. You definitely feel the tight precision on curves. While the stock F45 car might not be as tight as a Z51-equipped car, it comes really close and it's very stable. Plus, you can always replace the factory sway bars with the Z51 bars for a relatively low price if you are so inclined.

Now for the other 10%:

When I went for a long highway cruise, I'd drive in Touring mode. If I was driving on rough streets, I'd put it in Touring mode. Long bridges ride better on Touring mode... especially over those jarring tension joints/spacers. They seemingly disappear on Touring mode.

If I was just trying to unwind and out for a smooth cruise, I'd set it on Touring mode. It does approach the feel of a nice luxury sedan, although it will never equal that feel.

Back in April 2001, I took a spur-of-the-moment cruise down to Galveston and back. I have to tell you that there's nothing better than the F45 suspension for a 650 mile cruise! [Edit: except perhaps F55!!!]
Very comfortable. I was on the road about 9 1/2 hours total with about a 1 1/2 hour rest in between. (Drove the speed limit down there, but followed some really fast drivers on the way back.)

Now that I've driven with the Z51, I can say that the Z51 would not have been as comfortable, although, it would still have been a nice ride.

Whether or not you go with the F45 suspension really depends on what you're looking for in your Vette. If you have the opportunity to drive one of each type (FE1, F45, Z51, F55]), do it. If you get to drive an F45-equipped car, make sure you drive it not just on the highway, but also on some bridges and rough roads so that you can get a good test of the system's capability. You can trust me that it handles very well on twisties in performance mode. In that setting, the shocks are basically locked down into the highest performance setting possible. So, your selling point on the F45 suspension should be how well you like the dynamic handling characteristics of the other two settings in addition to the performance mode.

You're going to be limited to an extent by what you can easily do with regards to modifying your F45 suspension (depending on how much you want to keep your F45 suspension working at optimum level in all 3 modes of operation).

Once again, if you drive alot, want the option to dynamically alter the ride depending on your mood/circumstances, want the most technologically advanced Corvette suspension choice [pre-2003 F55], and are willing to pay the price... go with the F45 suspension. F45 will give you everything the FE1 (base) does, plus higher performance (than FE1) out of the box and the ability to actually get a smoother ride (by using the Touring mode) than the base suspension. If you want to do alot of modification to the suspension in the future such as major ride height changes, wheel camber changes, etc., you'll probably want to stay away from the F45 suspension unless you're okay with possibly causing the system to not respond at its optimum level in one or more of the three modes. As far as sway bar changes, you can do that without negatively affecting the system. If you decide to replace the shocks, you're basically disabling the F45 suspension, since (at a high level) the shocks and computer are what basically make the system so this would be reason not to go with the F45 option.

One last thing, the FX3 (forerunner to the F45) was the STANDARD suspension on the ZR1 in 1989. That says alot about this type of suspension since the ZR1 was the "King of the Hill." Again, another example of a real-time damping suspension application in a high-performance sports car.

-Keith

 

The upgrade would only be available to F45 equipped vehicles and not those with just the mechanical suspensions. While it would possible to add all of the wiring and electronics to a non-F45 or non-F55 vehicle, I think the cost would be prohibitive as I there would be modifications needed to the car's BCM hardware and not just the software. I don't think we'll ever see an F55 upgrade unless you already have the F45 in the vehicle. But we can hope :D.......... wouldn't mind putting the F55 in my Z06.


[Modified by TexasRedZ06, 8:46 PM 11/30/2003]

 

Keith........ great information.

I did want to point out for Greg's information, that 1998-2000 C5s had the Gen I Active Handling. Gen II was available on the 2001-2004 C5s. So the F45 system did not assist the JL4 in the model years he was interested in. :)

 

So ... for a 99coupe, is it feasible/reasonable/possible to upgrade to the F45 system if it didn't come with it?

If so, what does it get you, and any estimate of costs (at least parts costs, I've got a place that only charges me 45/hour for labor and specializes in Vettes :D ) ?

[edit for speling ;) ]


[Modified by TheDarkKnight, 10:00 PM 11/30/2003]

 

I can tell you, that on a long drive of straight flat road.... the Tour position is great, it does ride nice... with the CD player playing tunes.... but when I am on a lot of the LA and OC Freeway interchanges... they are tight, and I switch to Perf. as for me there is also no middle... and it handles much better... I would say that Tour is so sloppy, I remember to switch when I feel the body roll...
I still don't know exactly how it works... I see the little arms on the shocks...is that it? How fast does it switch? can you see the arms move while parked?... Guess I need a person to switch for me while I look.... hummmm that could work... :cheers: :smash: :withstupid: :seeya :chevy :auto: :auto: :thumbs: :skep: :steering: :leaving:

 

I do know you will need the F45 shocks, center console template, center console selector, control arm sensors, F45 computer and somehow wire the entire system together. I have also read that the non-F45 BCM can't be modified to accept the F45 system........ regardless of TechII programming........ but I'm not 100% sure about that. I have not read about anybody adding the F45, but I have read about many that disabled theirs, so you might be able to find most of the components used.

 

AH (JL4) rocks...a must have
F45 is of questionable value from a preformance standpoint.
You can get much better performance out of the FE3 or FE4 packages.
Also with F45 be prepared for sticker shock when it is time to replace the shocks.

 

Hey - I want to thank ALL of you for responding. Really good info. and you've helped clear-up the issue for me. Looks like I'm goinf to keep both the Active Handling and the Real Time Damping at the top of my "shopping list."

 

Thanks for the info. Interesting to compare the two items.

 

I had real-time damping on my Mazda 929 (one of the most enjoyable cars I've ever owned) and loved it until the shocks wore out. Then the sticker shock (over $1000) for shocks pushed me to replace them with standard non-motorized shocks. The car never handled well after that and since it was a lease, I turned it in.

 

Did you see that this thread was over 7 years old????

Bill

 

No; and wouldn't have mattered if I did.

 

Great info, even for a 14 year old thread...
So heres a looking back story...
I have a '99 coupe with 180k on the clock. She has the FE1 suspension and I am soo glad! I have read some threads and FB feeds about problems later in life with the AHS and some of the costs of repairs...so actually it was on my MUST NOT have list when I was shopping for my first corvette.
Now granted she is almost 19 and has buttload lot of miles, but she is straight and fast and doesnt break the bank every time she has an issue...and there have been a few. At this many miles and at the price I paid, it was expected, and growing up in a corvette/hot rod southeastern family that never paid for a wrench to be turned I actually enjoy working on it.
The z51 parts upgrade is on my wish list as she was also 100% original at 160k when I got her besides a Borla system & basic GM maintenance up until about 120k. So the original shocks I am about to replace means she rides pretty rough since most of her life was spent on these awesome roads in southern Louisiana.
I guess what I am getting at is who, said the who, buys a new(ish) corvette with expectations of comfort AND impressive cornering and handling abilities in the early 2000s...not me said this who...but props to chevy for the effort and I guess if I could afford a C7 Grand Sport maybe I would expect a little comfort?
I dunno but a who can ponder...